86 Turbo Thunderbird Motor in OBD2 Range -. HELP!

[ShotnVA777]

So, I've decided to go TURBO with my Ranger build and buy an OLDER Ranger for the track and my high compression NA build (my 88 motor)

I recently got a 1987-88 T-Bird Coupe motor, COMPLETE (other than transmission) and running at 69k. STRAIGHT STEAL!

Now, I'd like to put this in my 97 Ranger, using the dizzy and everything that comes with the turbo motor. .. but my truck is OBD2! So check me out, I have a few questions...

I have a buddy who's pretty much a "guru" and has a BUNCH of 2.3t stuff. I mean, EVERYTHING! He's really deep into these Turbo Limas. BUT, he's never done a Turbo swap on anything "NEW"(er), like my truck. Just pintos, fox body stangs, t-birds, etc...

So after me and him thought for a bit, on HOW THE HELL were going to do this, weve came to the conclusion to try to kind of run BOTH ECU's! What do y'all think?

Pretty much the stock OBD2 will run the entire "Ranger" portion of the truck, lights, speedo, RPM, gauges, etc... With the pins pulled and clipped/taped up, the ones that NEED to be pulled

The T-birds ECU, we will run into the cab and power only the motors equipment... In a sense, this is all we can come up with!

I'm NOT paying 3-400$ for a tune. I just want it to run like "stock".... Any info or input?! PLEASE!

Much thank you's in advanced!

 

[RangerSVT]

You have a couple options, you can do a basic engine swap, and use the turbo ecu. The ecu dont control the ranger dash. Take the power, ground, and gauge wirez from the 42 pin connector and hook the turbo's engine functions to this, your good to go. Another option (and a better one IMO) is to install the turbo motor, but use the ranger electronics/ignition. This will give you a more accurate spark and timing control, allow you to stay OBD2, and be much easier to tune. I know you said you done want to tune, but lets be realistic (and honest), you want more power, why else would you be installing a turbo motor. After some time, you will want to have more power by turning it up, which means more tuning...

SVT

 

[stmitch]

Typically, guys do 1 of 2 things to run the 2.3T stuff in an OBD2 chassis.

1. Switch the turbocoupe internals and turbo stuff into/onto the stock (non turbo) 2.3. This will require a tune, but is pretty straight forward and opens up lots of potential for growth later if you want more power.

2. Switch the electronics back to OBD1. This is basically a wiring nightmare, and a step back in tech, but it's been done. There may even be a write up or three on some other Ranger sites. Tuning if you ever change the setup would be difficult unless your buddy knows a guy.

I've never seen anyone attempt what you're wanting to do, but it sounds almost like going from OBD2 back to OBD1.

 

[ShotnVA777]

You have a couple options, you can do a basic engine swap, and use the turbo ecu. The ecu dont control the ranger dash. Take the power, ground, and gauge wirez from the 42 pin connector and hook the turbo's engine functions to this, your good to go. Another option (and a better one IMO) is to install the turbo motor, but use the ranger electronics/ignition. This will give you a more accurate spark and timing control, allow you to stay OBD2, and be much easier to tune. I know you said you done want to tune, but lets be realistic (and honest), you want more power, why else would you be installing a turbo motor. After some time, you will want to have more power by turning it up, which means more tuning...

SVT

I won't want more power.... At all. This motor puts out plenty as is! I'll have a front mount, the head re-worked and so forth, but I'm sure I'll be happy with how it runs!

That said..... You JUST said what I said, in a sense. It MAKES sense to use BOTH ECUs, but only connect what I NEED to the Ranger ECU (IE: LIGHTS, starter, gauges, etc.) Everything else can just be UNPLUGGED or clipped off from that ECU then!

Then I splice in the power supply(s) and ground(s) to the original Ranger ECU, to POWER the ECU for the 2.3T motor - wire as necessary! Seems logical to me!

Now that it's "better" explained. What do u think? I know the T-birds OBD1 ECU can't do the lighting and so forth on the truck.... So why not just keep my original ECU in for JUST THOSE THINGS???

Typically, guys do 1 of 2 things to run the 2.3T stuff in an OBD2 chassis.

1. Switch the turbocoupe internals and turbo stuff into/onto the stock (non turbo) 2.3. This will require a tune, but is pretty straight forward and opens up lots of potential for growth later if you want more power.

2. Switch the electronics back to OBD1. This is basically a wiring nightmare, and a step back in tech, but it's been done. There may even be a write up or three on some other Ranger sites. Tuning if you ever change the setup would be difficult unless your buddy knows a guy.

I've never seen anyone attempt what you're wanting to do, but it sounds almost like going from OBD2 back to OBD1.

1. I'm NOT switching the internals to a dual coiled, 8 plug head. Just NOT happening! ONLY thing that will be stolen is a few minor parts!

2. We know guys that knows guys! Lol.... Seriously tho, ATM, I JUST want to get her RUNNING and MOVING again!!! I've already started purchasing rebuild parts for the T-bird motor and new motor mounts, clutch n flywheel to "beef up" the transmission a little, a 8.8 3.75 rearend, etc etc...

3. Not necessarily. Just using the best of BOTH worlds, in a sense! :lol:

 

[RangerSVT]

The ecu does not operate or control the lights, instrument cluster, speedo, tach, or any of that, on either vehicle. It only controls the engine. Only one ecu is needed....

SVT

 

[ShotnVA777]

The ecu does not operate or control the lights, instrument cluster, speedo, tach, or any of that, on either vehicle. It only controls the engine. Only one ecu is needed....

SVT

Ok... So, if what your saying is correct, then I should just take the "old" wiring harness (from the 97 Ranger) COMPLETELY out, right?

Then just use schematics to wire in the Turbo Coupe's ECU???

I just want to make sure my lights are guna work, my speedo, my EVERYTHING to keep the car streetable!

Can u help a brotha out or point him in the direction of someone who can and doesnt mind?

PLEASE!

 

[adsm08]

I won't want more power.... At all.

If you honestly believe that then you are very very good at lying, even to yourself. The preponderance of evidence suggests that boost is addictive and people who start modding for power (that is what you are doing by adding a turbo) they keep wanting more.

That said..... You JUST said what I said, in a sense. It MAKES sense to use BOTH ECUs, but only connect what I NEED to the Ranger ECU (IE: LIGHTS, starter, gauges, etc.)

If you think the engine computer is needed for any of that stuff then the wiring for this project is above your head.

1. I'm NOT switching the internals to a dual coiled, 8 plug head. Just NOT happening! ONLY thing that will be stolen is a few minor parts!

WTF not? More power, better power curve, lower emissions. What do you have to lose?

3. Not necessarily. Just using the best of BOTH worlds, in a sense! :lol:

OBDII is the best of both worlds. Anything that EEC-IV can do OBDII will do it better, and it can do MORE. Scanners for OBDII are far more readily available and much cheaper for the same level of features and functionality. Again, nothing to lose, except that if you switch and see how much better it is you might have to admit that your prejudices against the "evil computer that runs my engine" might have been wrong.

 

[ShotnVA777]

If you honestly believe that then you are very very good at lying, even to yourself. The preponderance of evidence suggests that boost is addictive and people who start modding for power (that is what you are doing by adding a turbo) they keep wanting more.



If you think the engine computer is needed for any of that stuff then the wiring for this project is above your head.



WTF not? More power, better power curve, lower emissions. What do you have to lose?



OBDII is the best of both worlds. Anything that EEC-IV can do OBDII will do it better, and it can do MORE. Scanners for OBDII are far more readily available and much cheaper for the same level of features and functionality. Again, nothing to lose, except that if you switch and see how much better it is you might have to admit that your prejudices against the "evil computer that runs my engine" might have been wrong.

Why is everyone being so rude about this? I'm just trying to ask a few questions.... I've never done an OBD1 swap into an OBD2 or an ENGINE SWAP FOR THAT MATTER! I've HELPED people, but they had ALL the goodies that I can't afford!

Also, please remember, its NOT just ME building the truck! I have a guy helping me but he's old school and that's also how I want to run this motor. I would like to have a distributor to turn to advanced my ignition timing, not aa CPU. I would like to use all the stock equipment FIRST, like a stock Thunderbird motor in a 97 Ranger. Everything bolts up. Correct?

I'm not 100% sure how it works with this particular swap and my guy DOES, but ONLY for the motor in a car that readily accepts it like say.... His 1987 Mustang LX or his T-Bird! He did the entire swap in his LX and it shits and gets. He just has the setup I would like to have!

That said.... I'm fully capable of reading a wiring schematic and wiring all 50 (I think it is?) wires that go to the ECU. AS LONG as I have the color coded pin outs for BOTH harnesses. I'm also capable of a plug and play ordeal, which would be MUCH easier with that LA3 that I have! (Any company make a "plug and play" ordeal?)

I'm not trying to beat down what your saying, I'm not saying I won't want more power, DOWN THE ROAD, WHEN I HAVE MORE MONEY! Lol... I drove a '03 Jetta GLS 1.8T on the stock setup FOREVER! Until I got the Garrett GT2871R on there and then it was night and day. I'm CONTENT with JUST getting it BOOSTED right now! Seriously. Lol...

 

[ShotnVA777]

Aka - junkyard turbo build! Haha...

If someone could just point me to a build that someone has DONE, using a dual plug Ranger, dropping in an old 2.3T in it, as the motor SITS....?

THAT WOULD BE AWESOME! lol

 

[ShotnVA777]

SEEMS AS IF I'M NOT THE ONLY PERSON WITH THESE QUESTIONS! Guess this guys a "dummy" too!

http://www.turborangerforums.com/showthread.php?t=2235

 

[adsm08]

Why is everyone being so rude about this?

We honestly are not trying to be rude. I do apologize if that is how I am coming off. We are trying to help by pointing out that there are more effective ways to meet your stated goals for power/performance, while at the same time simplifying or eliminating the changes that need to be made in the areas that you have told us you are having problems wrapping your head around.

Frankly I think this is a much more worthwhile endeavor than your 140 HP NA carb idea.

The OBDI setup shouldn't be all that hard to make work, but not having the full diagrams for the T-bird or Mustang on hand I can't help much. If I remember I will see if we have that book at work and snag it so I can try to help though.

Honestly you should be able to drop the t-bird engine in, with it's engine bay harness and computer, hook up about 6 wires to key-switched power, and go. The real problem is if you care about appearance. In all likely hood it will end up looking at lot like my engine bay. Two harnesses laying on top of each other, three battery cables, one only hooked to the frame, an ignition coil that is only along for the ride, and 7 unused plugs laying back by the brake booster.

 

[RangerSVT]

As stated, we're not trying to be rude. Many of us know and have experience with both OBD1 and OBD2 systems, and know whats better and easier. Just cause an old skool guy knows a way to do it, doesn't mean he knows the best, or easiest way. That being said...
The 42 pin connector above the ranger motor is the only connector that you need to disconnect as it sends all power and communications through this one plug. You will also make your connections to this same plug for power and ground and gauges...

SVT

 

[ShotnVA777]

We honestly are not trying to be rude. I do apologize if that is how I am coming off. We are trying to help by pointing out that there are more effective ways to meet your stated goals for power/performance, while at the same time simplifying or eliminating the changes that need to be made in the areas that you have told us you are having problems wrapping your head around.

Frankly I think this is a much more worthwhile endeavor than your 140 HP NA carb idea.

The OBDI setup shouldn't be all that hard to make work, but not having the full diagrams for the T-bird or Mustang on hand I can't help much. If I remember I will see if we have that book at work and snag it so I can try to help though.

Honestly you should be able to drop the t-bird engine in, with it's engine bay harness and computer, hook up about 6 wires to key-switched power, and go. The real problem is if you care about appearance. In all likely hood it will end up looking at lot like my engine bay. Two harnesses laying on top of each other, three battery cables, one only hooked to the frame, an ignition coil that is only along for the ride, and 7 unused plugs laying back by the brake booster.

I think it'll be MUCH worthwhile as well! I just wanna get the RUNNIN, STOCK Turbo Coupe motor in there and BE DONE for NOW!

If you have ANY more info, on that book, or WHATEVER! That would be GREAT!! Thank you...

Also, just so you know... Im NOT worried about looks! #sleeper

As stated, we're not trying to be rude. Many of us know and have experience with both OBD1 and OBD2 systems, and know whats better and easier. Just cause an old skool guy knows a way to do it, doesn't mean he knows the best, or easiest way. That being said...
The 42 pin connector above the ranger motor is the only connector that you need to disconnect as it sends all power and communications through this one plug. You will also make your connections to this same plug for power and ground and gauges...

SVT

Understood. But he really DOES have a VERY quick Mustang that's EXTREMELY simplified and I LOVE that! I know a GREAT tune and aa dyno session would net BETTER results, but please just try to understand, I want NOTHING MORE than this Turbo Coupe Motor to just RUN, in my 97 Ranger, WITHOUT losing lights, heat, speedo, etc. I want it to be FULLY streetable as this WILL BE my DD for the time being!

THAT said... My "guru" isn't ALWAYS available and I'm doing MOST of the work, he's simply guiding. But this is one thing I have to figure out on my own it seems! As he said we should run both harnesses and ECU's to keep lighting/sensors and so forth from going haywire. But remember, HE DIDN'T EVEN KNOW WHAT OBD2 WAS!!! He's 70 yrs old and has ALWAYS had a distributed, old school type motor. Lol... Weird? Maybe... But WHATEVER!

So that said, can you shed some more LIGHT on how to wire this thing specifically? As both of you are OBVIOUSLY, VERY knowledgeable on the subject aand THAT'S why I keep coming back HERE!

THANKS GUYS!

 

[stmitch]

Turning your truck into something similar to a Thunderbird or Foxbody is the OBD 1 swap I mentioned earlier. Do lots of reading over @ turborangerforum because others have documented what you want to do pretty well. They'd be the most experienced people to ask if you have questions.

 

[adsm08]

I forgot to look for that book today. It got kinda nuts because we were over-scheduled today and Fridays are usually crazy anyway

I gotta go down and drop the oil-filter drums off after I go empty them tomorrow though, so I will try to remember then since nobody should be bugging me.