Why does this seem like a major design flaw on the wheel bearings?

[shane96ranger]

SO you have toasted the bearings but have never replaced the bearing races? There's you're issue.....

Always.....ALWAYS replace the roller and races as a set....

No doubt!

The races that came in my Explorer rotors were complete garbage too. Keep them as a matched set.

 

[aeidian]

SO you have toasted the bearings but have never replaced the bearing races? There's you're issue.....

Always.....ALWAYS replace the roller and races as a set....

Define races? Bearings come in two parts, the roller bearing ring which you pack, and what I've called the cups. Is that what races are? I'm not sure if I can get those things out without damaging the rotor, they're in there pretty good, it's why I left them in. That and they look exactly the same, as did the bearings that came out.

 

[Sasquatch_Ryda]

Cup and cone...whatever nomenclature you prefer. Yes that is the race, and needs to be replaced along with the rollers. They can simply be removed with a drift and installed with a drift......

 

[BLOODBANE]

As far as loosing grease make sure the O-ring on your hubs are in good shape as well. You really have to torque the heck out of the outer axle nut to keep it tight. And check it. A LOT.

 

[aeidian]

As far as loosing grease make sure the O-ring on your hubs are in good shape as well. You really have to torque the heck out of the outer axle nut to keep it tight. And check it. A LOT.

I'll take a look when I check it tomorrow. One of my hubs is broken. The seam right where the canister part of the manual locking hub is separated from the part that fits over the lug studs. I figured I would just get it welded back together since I can't find any in the salvage yard and prices on them run 200+ from what I've seen.

 

[aeidian]

Ok, I got new bearings, a new grease seal for the rear of the rotor, and a new rotor. I used a punch to remove the racers that were already in the new rotor (which were exactly the same as the ones I then put in there, part numbers even matched), put the racers off the new bearings in there using the racers that came with the rotor (it was easier to flip them and use them to beat in than a punch). Used the bearing packer to pack the inner bearing, put it in, put the grease seal in the rear of the rotor, slide the rotor on. Packed outer bearing and slide it on. Cleaned the grease gobs off the spindle threads (I used quite a bit of axle grease), put the inner lock nut on tightened to 35 ft lbs while stopping to spin every 1/4th turn. Backed inner nut off 1/4th turn, then snugged it up again, put washer with holes in it on, then outer lock nut and tightened to 150ft lbs. It seemed just like the same way I did the last one. Everytime I do this the rotor feels tight, like tighter than common sense would think it should be. It takes some effort to spin the damn thing, it's not a free spinner. So I got to thinking maybe I tightened the inner locknut TOO tight all this time and I was binding the bearing and causing it to melt (when I took it apart this time it was literally melted, the rollers fell out like a bunch of marbles). So I took it apart up to the rotor again. Then I tightened the inner locknut to 35, backed off a 1/4th turn. This time I only tightened it enough I could catch a hole on the washer and be able to slide it flush. Seemed like quite a bit more spin to it, and no wobble. Torqued the outer nut to 150 and checked again, seemed alot more fluid. It doesn't free spin when you turn it, but at least its not like having to put some muscle behind it. I torqued past 150 on the outer. Just about an 1/8th a turn I think. I've yet to take it for a ride, but I suspect if there's a problem it won't show up for about a week. I believe I just tightened the inner locknut too tight all these times. I still think it might be too tight, but I'm afraid if I go any looser I'll have some wobble.

Oh and I paid 24 bucks for a brass set of punches with a drift in them. That was a stupid idea. I didn't realize they'd be a one time use only. I bought a cold chisel set after that for half the price that works better. I know the brass set has its uses, but this sure wasn't one of them.

Edit: Driving it now. Seems as smooth as it always does when I first replace them, I'll have to drive it a week and recheck.

 

[legoms013]

For the inner nut I have always gone by feel versus actual torque ratings. What I do is tighten it a bit until the rotor won't spin, to seat the bearing, then I back it off just until I can notice slop between the rotor and spindle (like if you grabbed the top of the rotor and moved it back and forth and notice 1/16" of play) THEN I slow tighten the inner nut by hand (with the 4 pronged socket) until the play goes away, and it spins without "too" much effort. If it takes two hands and your weight to turn the rotor, it is too tight; if you notice slop then it isn't tight enough.

This has given me good results over the years.

One time I had bearings go out because I bought new rotors that came with races pre-installed, and I did not swap them out for the races that came with my new Timken bearings. The races grenaded after a year, and the bearings were fine (though I tossed em and got). When I replaced them, I installed new races that came with the new bearings, and have been solid ever since.

Make sure when you tighten down the outer nut, that it is not taking the lock washer and inner nut with it. If it is, the prong on the lock washer that fits in the channel of the spindle is sliding into one of the grooves on the spindle threads. If this happens, you are basically torquing the inner and outer nut to the same spec, and your bearings will fuse themselves pretty quick to their nearest neighbor: the spindle.

I hope this time they don't give you any more trouble, I know how frustrating it can be. Good luck

 

[Sasquatch_Ryda]

Yes, bearings that are set up too tight will eat themselves a long time before a bearing that is loose.

You just need to take the end play out of the bearings when adjusting the inner nut. I simply use the hub socket with my hand to set the inner lock nut.

 

[aeidian]

Make sure when you tighten down the outer nut, that it is not taking the lock washer and inner nut with it. If it is, the prong on the lock washer that fits in the channel of the spindle is sliding into one of the grooves on the spindle threads. If this happens, you are basically torquing the inner and outer nut to the same spec, and your bearings will fuse themselves pretty quick to their nearest neighbor: the spindle.

The inner bearing damn near fused to the spindle. It took me an hour to figure out how to get it off. Finally took a 3 jaw and jamming a large flat head in the ujoint of the 4x4 axle so it didn't push in to get it off. Took some fine grit sandpaper and cleaned up some burs on the spindle. I thought maybe it was spinning both nuts when I do the outer because the inner moved but it was just play in the groove that the tab of the washer slides into.

Sent from my NookColor using Tapatalk 2

 

[brinker88]

I have no faith in anything but Timken bearings.

:

Hands down the ONLY bearing I will use. Altho most of them are not made in the USA anymore

 

[shane96ranger]

Hands down the ONLY bearing I will use. Altho most of them are not made in the USA anymore

I bought 2 Timken bearings for my Escape. One from Rock Auto, one from Autozone. Both were made by SKF and said Made in Spain. At least it didn't say China.

 

[shane96ranger]

One time I had bearings go out because I bought new rotors that came with races pre-installed, and I did not swap them out for the races that came with my new Timken bearings. The races grenaded after a year, and the bearings were fine (though I tossed em and got). When I replaced them, I installed new races that came with the new bearings, and have been solid ever since

Same thing here. You don't know what the hell is in there until you pull them out.

 

[brinker88]

^ That is one of the best tips you can give. Dont trust it just because it's new.

 

[legoms013]

Same thing here. You don't know what the hell is in there until you pull them out.

^ That is one of the best tips you can give. Dont trust it just because it's new.

Wish I had known that then. Was a costly mistake.

When I punched out the old races, sure enough they were emblazoned with the communist "China" all over them.

 

[BLOODBANE]

But even Timkin bearings fail at times. I had a front pinion bearing seize up with only about 4miles on it. Install was done correct. We always suspected that it was never heat treated.