Ok, need MASTER level advice or VERY creative ideas.

[ab_slack]

Ok, so here what going on... if i start the truck up in gear it takes off like a rocket, but if i start it in neutral I can not shift into any gears it will not let me.

Read thru everything. There are questions I have relating to this statement.

If I am understanding correctly, when it is sitting normal engine off you can move the shifter in and out of gear positions no problem. When you start it with the shift in neutral, you are unable to shift into any gear. Entirely consistent with the clutch not disengaging.

When you put it in gear and start it in gear, I take it to mean when you say "it takes off" that it does so even if the clutch is depressed. Is that correct? I am assuming it is cause if you could push the clutch in or shift at this point it would rule out clutch.

This leads me to a question. Once started like this, assuming it is in first, say you give it gas till you get a little speed (engine around 2.5K or 3K rpm), if you put some back pressure on the stick towards neutral and let off the gas momentarily to relieve the drive load, does it easily slip out of gear into neutral?

If yes, another question. Typically, with the truck rolling (like you can get above), I find I can shift to higher gears after getting into neutral (like above) and moving the shift towards the next gear, not forcing it, but just some lite pressure and adjust engine RPMs with the gas till the engine rpm matches what it would need to go into the next gear and the synchro lets it slip into place. With practice, I find I can do it without much guessing where to set the gas. Key is to just feel the back pressure on the stick and not force it till the synchro opens the window. I am just wondering if it is possible to do this. This would tend to validate the transmission back and reinforce the idea that it is just the clutch not releasing rather than something odd in the transmission.

The only other thing that comes to mind, and this is just trying to explain the oddity about lifting the rear by the body verses the axle, is that maybe something is binding in the drive shaft preventing it from compressing to the dimension it needs to when it is sitting flat pushing a bunch of force back into the trans and engine. So when you lift it up, shaft extends and that force comes off. Just a bit WAG there.

 

[American1990]

Did you check the clutch pedal to master cylinder eyelet and plastic grommet? If that's worn (or the clutch pedal arm pivot point) it will give you your symptoms...

SVT

Can you elaborate a little more on that? Are you talking about the plastic clip that hold the master cylinder metal arm into the pedal?

 

[American1990]

Read thru everything. There are questions I have relating to this statement.

If I am understanding correctly, when it is sitting normal engine off you can move the shifter in and out of gear positions no problem. When you start it with the shift in neutral, you are unable to shift into any gear. Entirely consistent with the clutch not disengaging.

When you put it in gear and start it in gear, I take it to mean when you say "it takes off" that it does so even if the clutch is depressed. Is that correct? I am assuming it is cause if you could push the clutch in or shift at this point it would rule out clutch.

This leads me to a question. Once started like this, assuming it is in first, say you give it gas till you get a little speed (engine around 2.5K or 3K rpm), if you put some back pressure on the stick towards neutral and let off the gas momentarily to relieve the drive load, does it easily slip out of gear into neutral?

If yes, another question. Typically, with the truck rolling (like you can get above), I find I can shift to higher gears after getting my truck rolling after getting into neutral (like above) and moving the shift towards the next gear, nor forcing it, but just some lite pressure and adjust engine RPMs with the gas till the engine rpm matches what it would need to go into the next gear and the synchro lets it slip into place. With practice, I find I can do it without much guessing where to set the gas. Key is to just feel the back pressure on the stick and not force it till the synchro opens the window. I am just wondering if it is possible to do this. This would tend to validate the transmission back and reinforce the idea that it is just the clutch not releasing rather than something odd in the transmission.

The only other thing that comes to mind, and this is just trying to explain the oddity about lifting the rear by the body verses the axle, is that maybe something is binding in the drive shaft preventing it from compressing to the dimension it needs to when it is sitting flat pushing a bunch of force back into the trans and engine. So when you lift it up, shaft extends and that force comes off. Just a bit WAG there.

Yes, when the engine off I can shift into any gear perfectly fine. Once I crank the truck up I can no longer shift into any gear, THOUGH when I try to put it into fourth gear I guess since the ratio or whatever starts to match up it starts to fall into gear but it just will not go and the engine starts to die out but there is no grinding. Also when I do crank it up in gear in any gear it starts to move with every turn of the crank, but once it started it hard to pull it out of gear and if I did i still will be unable to put into another gear, though i have not tried to do the clutch synchronization trick like you mentioned. About the Rear axle vs Frame lift, I am able to put it in gear in both situations but when i lift from the frame it smoother and required less force vs lifting from the axle and just having the wheels hanging.

 

[snake]

check the crank for play also. Working on a Toyota, the midshift main bearing got worn so when you put the clutch in, the crank moved forward. You can check it easy, have someone push in the clutch (engine off) and watch the harmonic balancer to see if it moves forward. On the yota it was very obvious.

 

[Road Angels]

Check crankshaft end play if you lost a main bearing trust it may be pushing the flywheel clutch assembly out of the stroke of the throwout bearing saw it on a mazda 626 once, guy put new flex plate and starter in but the starter would only spin and not engage the ring gear, the main thrust bearing steel backing and all was in the pan so the flywheel was out of reach of the bendix drive

 

[Eaglefixer]

had same type problem on my 96 Ranger and it was the brake/clutch pedal pivot bracket hole was elongated causing the throw of the clutch pedal to be shorter. here's a link of my old bracket http://www.therangerstation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67723

 

[snake]

Damn good find and great pics! Did you replace it with a new one (or boneyard), and, what did it cost?

 

[Eaglefixer]

bought a new one from the dealer, cost I think $116

 

[American1990]

ok guys... I have tried everything... i have replaced every single part except the engine. Nothing changes, the symptoms don't get better or worse. I tried increasing the stroke of the master cylinder and got every big of millimeter I could out of it still could not disengage the clutch. I have almost completely lost hope, I love this truck but it just seems like I will never work again. I checked for movement in the front of the engine as the clutch was being pushed and saw none, but every couple pushes on the clutch the belt on the engine would turn slightly...other then this nothing new... even tried my old trans, clutch setup, and slave cylinder...

the only other thing I can think is there something wrong with the engine... but I don't see movement other then the belt turns slightly every couple pumps... is there any other way to tell if the bearting have gone bad? the engine idles fine it seems and when I crank up in gear it moves fine it seems...

 

[RangerSVT]

You may have to pull the trans for this, but put a dial caliper on the flywheel, and with a prybar pry the flywheel away from the block, then on the front of the engine pry the pulley away from the block, record the measurements. Compare it to OEM specs...

SVT

 

[American1990]

You may have to pull the trans for this, but put a dial caliper on the flywheel, and with a prybar pry the flywheel away from the block, then on the front of the engine pry the pulley away from the block, record the measurements. Compare it to OEM specs...

SVT

ok, so while pulling the flywheel from engine block from back, measure the distance from block to front or back of fly wheel? and then do same to front just for the pulley. And where would I find the OEM specs? I had a haynes manual and Clinton book...but my buddy has them and he out of town at the moment.

If it is out of spec, would this mean the engine bearing haver gone bad and need to be replaced/rebuilt?

 

[Road Angels]

service limit is .012, but it would have to be alot more than that to cause your problem,remember as you push the clutch in the crank may be already as far forward as it will go, so you have to check first by pushing all the way to front or back, so if you push the clutch down its all the way forward now push it back on the balancer if its a lot of play you will feel it this wont tell you how much but will give you an idea with out pulling it apart again

 

[Road Angels]

one last thought was it a new flywhell that you put in or a remachined one

 

[American1990]

It a brand new one not machined. I'm trying to think of a way to completely press by hand, the rod into the master cylinder... but every way I have tried has left my with busted knocks,. trying to see that if maybe the pedal not pushing it far enough

 

[American1990]

Ok... so tomorrow I am going to try a few more things... if it fails...This is what I am thinking about doing, I have a 96 trans and 92 engine, the parts I (slave, master, line, clutch) are for 92 ranger... so idk if that would be enough to cause all this so I was going to buy a fully bled pre-assembled kit (Master, slave, line, reservoir) and new clutch and pressure plat to put in. Tomorrow I am going to try everything I can to make sure that it not, or that i cant get enough stroke out of my master.

The part that just doesn't make since is that I used all the parts from 92 4.0 ranger in my FM146 trans and it ran great, I put all new parts with Fm146 today and still same problem.... so either not bled right or something with engine..but I plan to try to depress it with my hand tomorrow to see if I can get it to disengage without the pedal.