Just an observation....

[rusty ol ranger]

Ive been looking to maybe trade/sell off my 97 F250 for something a bit more suited to my current needs.

I want to stay pre 97 ford preferably (although i have looked at chevy/dodge in the same year range)

Anyways....i never realized how many F150/F250 LD trucks have 302's.

Im looking for a 300/351 preferably with a manual, preferably 4wd, and would like an 87-91 3/4 ton.

But everytime i find one...its got a damn 302 in it.

Im not trying to start a "this is better then that" thread. Just wondering were the 302's really this popular in the trucks? Or is it just what people are selling?

 

[MaicoDoug]

I had a 2013 F250 with a 302 in it, kept the truck for 2 days & returned the thing to the dealer telling them that thing is shamefully underpowered for driving empty in the hill country in Texas. Ford's 302 is only as good as their transmissions & the software that controls them. They make it work with their "system".

 

[bobbywalter]

2013 250 with a 302? 1993 you mean?


or gen 1 coyote? 4.6 and gen 1 coyote for sure are not truck engines.....

or 302 windsors...lolz


rusty...


depends. they are better then the 300 generally.

i know you dont think that.

but it dont matter.

because its 100 percent provable.

i was just given a 300 hand shaker and i love it. runs awesome.


but ... i was succumbing to nostalgia like we all do....

and once i was actually using it remembered something ...



its a fawking slug period.

but gets it done.

a truck 302.... is just a faster slug.

 

[MaicoDoug]

no a 2013, slug no doubt

 

[Snoranger]

2013 250 with a 302? 1993 you mean?


or gen 1 coyote? 4.6 and gen 1 coyote for sure are not truck engines.....

or 302 windsors...lolz


rusty...


depends. they are better then the 300 generally.

i know you dont think that.

but it dont matter.

because its 100 percent provable.

i was just given a 300 hand shaker and i love it. runs awesome.


but ... i was succumbing to nostalgia like we all do....

and once i was actually using it remembered something ...



its a fawking slug period.

but gets it done.

a truck 302.... is just a faster slug.

This.
I worked in new vehicle prep back in the mid 90’s. I drove hundreds of new trucks. I’ve owned a few truck with each of the engines in question. The 300 and the 302 are underpowered. The 351 is adequate.

 

[rusty ol ranger]

2013 250 with a 302? 1993 you mean?


or gen 1 coyote? 4.6 and gen 1 coyote for sure are not truck engines.....

or 302 windsors...lolz


rusty...


depends. they are better then the 300 generally.

i know you dont think that.

but it dont matter.

because its 100 percent provable.

i was just given a 300 hand shaker and i love it. runs awesome.


but ... i was succumbing to nostalgia like we all do....

and once i was actually using it remembered something ...



its a fawking slug period.

but gets it done.

a truck 302.... is just a faster slug.

Im more after a 300 for the flat out durability and repair access.

Most the heavy towing i do is close to home (less then 40 miles) and really not all that heavy, (7000lb maybe) the most distance id run would be a couple hundred miles with my 2 quads and trailer (4100lbs) and a 300 wont have an issue with that.

Id keep mine but it lacks 4wd, and im just...bored with it. Yes the 460 is great for towing heavy shit, but i no longer have my camper and honestly everytime i leave the driveway with it im always worried something else will go south and cost me alot of money...as this things had a history of doing.

So yeah...the reason id be ok with a 351 is yes its harder to get to stuff to work on...but atleast its got some ass unlike a 302.

But id really like a 300

 

[rusty ol ranger]

⬆ This.
I worked in new vehicle prep back in the mid 90’s. I drove hundreds of new trucks. I’ve owned a few truck with each of the engines in question. The 300 and the 302 are underpowered. The 351 is adequate.

Im not argueing...but ive never felt the 300 lacked power. Yes its slow...but its equally slow regardless of what youre doing.

The 302's in trucks ive had experience with just dont seem to pull.

That being said i wouldnt mind a 99-03 (or whenever they switched to the 3v) superduty with a 5.4...but finding a manual is impossible about...and then youre really talking a bitch to work on.

 

[bobbywalter]

well.


sounds good.

but apparently you have never worked on an efi 300.

and your use model is why the 302 had a higher take rate and does the job better.

and...well is easier to work on.

 

[bobbywalter]

that said ... you will find a 300 and get it. and be happy.

i would never have bought the one i have.

if it wasnt from dad i would have sold it already.


i would never evict the 300 as long as it is running well. i do like and appreciate them ... i know how to build them for big power and circle track use



if the engine does catastrophically fail .... a 2.3 ecoboost or na 3.7 or 3.5 will most likely replace it.

those are long odds .... if i were the only one using it .

but .... my gremlin has it.

a true test to be sure

 

[Mechrick]

The main reason you see more 302's than 300's is the 300 was never built with the lighter duty 4R70W trans but the 302 (5.0L) was. AFAIK, all 300 F150s came with either a M5ODR2 manual or the E4OD (or a T18 or NP435 in the older trucks).

I've owned multiple examples of both. My conclusion is the 300 is better below 1500 RPM, the 302 better above it. The 302 is a good engine, but a 300 will easily outlast it. Both carb and EFI 300's get about the same fuel economy, an EFI 5.0L will match a 300, a carb 302 will not.

An EFI 300 (4.9L) will have more power than a stock carb version, but it's not hard to wake up a carb 300 with an intake manifold and bigger carb.

My last F150 had a 4.9L that the sole modification was some backyard head porting, and I routinely towed 6000 lbs behind it, once up through the hills of Tehachapi CA. Did surprisingly well.

For occasional light towing, the 5.0L is probably the better choice. For more serious work, the 300 has more off idle grunt.

The 300 is handicapped with a flat tappet cam, but there are some folks over at FordSix that are working to remedy that.

 

[rusty ol ranger]

well.


sounds good.

but apparently you have never worked on an efi 300.

and your use model is why the 302 had a higher take rate and does the job better.

and...well is easier to work on.

I have worked on an EFI 300 lol. I still find it much eaiser (acessable) then the V8's...espicially with AC. But that being said it has been a while since i messed with one...so maybe im remembering it being better then it was.

The main reason you see more 302's than 300's is the 300 was never built with the lighter duty 4R70W trans but the 302 (5.0L) was. AFAIK, all 300 F150s came with either a M5ODR2 manual or the E4OD (or a T18 or NP435 in the older trucks).

I've owned multiple examples of both. My conclusion is the 300 is better below 1500 RPM, the 302 better above it. The 302 is a good engine, but a 300 will easily outlast it. Both carb and EFI 300's get about the same fuel economy, an EFI 5.0L will match a 300, a carb 302 will not.

An EFI 300 (4.9L) will have more power than a stock carb version, but it's not hard to wake up a carb 300 with an intake manifold and bigger carb.

My last F150 had a 4.9L that the sole modification was some backyard head porting, and I routinely towed 6000 lbs behind it, once up through the hills of Tehachapi CA. Did surprisingly well.

For occasional light towing, the 5.0L is probably the better choice. For more serious work, the 300 has more off idle grunt.

The 300 is handicapped with a flat tappet cam, but there are some folks over at FordSix that are working to remedy that.

Ive had a few 300's. Both carbed and EFI. I never had an issue with any of them ever. Regardless of how i treated them. More then i can say for my 460 (or 351's ive had for that matter)

My dad used to tow a 3 horse gooseneck with 3 horses all over the place with a 94 F250LD with a I6, auto, and 3.55's. It did huff down south in the mountains but it never complained. That was pry a bit north of 7000lbs.

Heaviest i towed with one was my 96 F150, auto, 3.55's 4wd, i put almost 10k of skidsteer and trailer (yes to much, but i had 3/4 ton springs and was only going maybe 15 miles)....it got it up to 60. It was working hard...but it did it.

So yeah, a bricknose 300 3/4ton 4wd with a creeper 4 or 5 sp is what im holding out for. In decent shape

 

[Snoranger]

that said ... you will find a 300 and get it. and be happy.

i would never have bought the one i have.

if it wasnt from dad i would have sold it already.


i would never evict the 300 as long as it is running well. i do like and appreciate them ... i know how to build them for big power and circle track use



if the engine does catastrophically fail .... a 2.3 ecoboost or na 3.7 or 3.5 will most likely replace it.

those are long odds .... if i were the only one using it .

but .... my gremlin has it.

a true test to be sure

I’ve blown up 2 of them. I’d start looking for a replacement if little Bob has it.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

I've been happy with my 302.

Right now it is heavier and dirtier in the air than a fullsize by a wide margin, still set the cruise at 60 in a 55 and let 'er eat in fifth.

With my dismal 2:1 low range and the M5OD's suboptimal first gear it idled over everything I pointed it at on the KAT. Torque level and place in the power band is respectable. Ease of working one... its easier to work on than the stock 2.8.

She's tired, I wish I could sneak up on a fresher one. Otherwise for a $200 engine on Craigslist in a fencerow under a blue tarp almost 15 years ago... we've covered a lot of ground. I'd still drive it anywhere, for reference a month ago it was in Tennessee.

 

[rusty ol ranger]

I've been happy with my 302.

Right now it is heavier and dirtier in the air than a fullsize by a wide margin, still set the cruise at 60 in a 55 and let 'er eat in fifth.

With my dismal 2:1 low range and the M5OD's suboptimal first gear it idled over everything I pointed it at on the KAT. Torque level and place in the power band is respectable. Ease of working one... its easier to work on than the stock 2.8.

She's tired, I wish I could sneak up on a fresher one. Otherwise for a $200 engine on Craigslist in a fencerow under a blue tarp almost 15 years ago... we've covered a lot of ground. I'd still drive it anywhere, for reference a month ago it was in Tennessee.

Im still holding out for a 300 lol

 

[racsan]

I think rear acle ratio is the biggest issue, too many had 3.55’s when a 3.73 is much better. Granted a 300/3.73 is maxed out at 70 mph (at least my dads 74 F250 with a np435 was) but it was ine hell of a towing beast , just not meant for a 75 mph road trip.