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Beginner Dirt Bike?


what is the terrain you ride in the most? are they sandy 1 car wide trails or are they tight, handle bar width wide winding tree-root infested trails? Im from michigan so i see lots of both. i would suggest an 88 or newer (up to 98) XR250. newer than 88 will have a disc up front and a drum in the back and somewhere in the mid 90s they switched to a rear disc. the advantages of the 250 vs the 200 are going to be aftermarket parts supply (hundreds of vendors of parts ranging from basic engine maintainace to LED lighting,skid plates, pipes, etc.), many people have them so they will be readily available for sale, the power delivery is very close to that of the 200 with the abilty to easily bolt on modifications to make it faster further down the road. the xr 200 is going to have a smaller cock pit, but you could easily rearrange the xr 250 to cramp it up. you will have better suspension with larger fork tubes and a stronger rear shock on the 250 and there are companies that make a lowering link that will lower the rear of the bike to give you a comfortable seat height. in my opinion, the 200 is a good and reliable bike, but the 250 is more popular (think ranger) and is just as reliable as the 200 with room to grow as a rider. any of these guys telling you to get a 2 stroke becuase theyre cheaper are speaking solely of repairs to the engine. things can get expensive in there, but you cant compare the new four strokes to the older xr engines. on a newer four stroke you need to go in and check the valves for clearance and shim accordingly quite frequently, where as on the xrs the valves dont need to be serviced nearly as often. once you understand how they operate it will be easy to work it a valve inspection into your maintainance schedule and you will save money in the long run by not suffering any engine problems due to neglect. hope that wasnt too confusing- wrench werks
 
what is the terrain you ride in the most? are they sandy 1 car wide trails or are they tight, handle bar width wide winding tree-root infested trails? Im from michigan so i see lots of both. i would suggest an 88 or newer (up to 98) XR250. newer than 88 will have a disc up front and a drum in the back and somewhere in the mid 90s they switched to a rear disc. the advantages of the 250 vs the 200 are going to be aftermarket parts supply (hundreds of vendors of parts ranging from basic engine maintainace to LED lighting,skid plates, pipes, etc.), many people have them so they will be readily available for sale, the power delivery is very close to that of the 200 with the abilty to easily bolt on modifications to make it faster further down the road. the xr 200 is going to have a smaller cock pit, but you could easily rearrange the xr 250 to cramp it up. you will have better suspension with larger fork tubes and a stronger rear shock on the 250 and there are companies that make a lowering link that will lower the rear of the bike to give you a comfortable seat height. in my opinion, the 200 is a good and reliable bike, but the 250 is more popular (think ranger) and is just as reliable as the 200 with room to grow as a rider. any of these guys telling you to get a 2 stroke becuase theyre cheaper are speaking solely of repairs to the engine. things can get expensive in there, but you cant compare the new four strokes to the older xr engines. on a newer four stroke you need to go in and check the valves for clearance and shim accordingly quite frequently, where as on the xrs the valves dont need to be serviced nearly as often. once you understand how they operate it will be easy to work it a valve inspection into your maintainance schedule and you will save money in the long run by not suffering any engine problems due to neglect. hope that wasnt too confusing- wrench werks

That sounds good, I will keep my eye out for both XR 200's and 250s.

The trails that I ride currently are wide open and flat :annoyed:

But if I move back home, I will be within an hour of Hollister which has long narrow trails. I am not sure how the terrain is with tree branches etc. But I know where I am at right now is pretty rocky.
 
So what problems do valves cause? Are they a pita to check and adjust? From doing some reading online last night, I read that 4 strokes should have their valves adjusted around 25-30 hours and a rebuild with new piston around 75-100 hours.

Also what about lowering bikes down like 1 in?

thats only true on motocross race bikes like CRF250R and 450R, YZ or WR250F and 450F, etc. They're race tuned, often make a ton of horsepower for their displacement. The newer 450 race motors usually make 50+ horsepower and the 250s are often 35-40. Think about how long your typical 3.0L Ranger might last if it was tuned to make 300hp.

The ~250 bikes designed for trails will last a LOT longer, as they're often only making 18-20hp instead of 35-40.

A lot of the dual sports and trail bikes have recommended valve clearance checks at like 5,000+ miles. That's like 160 hours of off-road riding, which is a whole hell of a lot.

The folks that will try to scare you away from a 4 stroke with maintenance horror stories are simply taking the extreme cases of race bikes and applying them across the board. It's the equivalent of using a Ferrari maintenance schedule and applying it to a Honda Civic.

I've got nothing against two strokes, but I don't agree that maintenance is a valid reason to choose between the two. They're completely different riding styles and it should be solely up to what you prefer to ride.
 
xr 250 ftw they are fun to ride
 
So what problems do valves cause? Are they a pita to check and adjust? From doing some reading online last night, I read that 4 strokes should have their valves adjusted around 25-30 hours and a rebuild with new piston around 75-100 hours.
They just add more levels of complication to work on. More moving parts=greater chance that one will fail.

Also what about lowering bikes down like 1 in?
Easiest way would be to shave down the seat foam. It would only take a couple of hours and you can lose a couple of inches without affecting the handling or performance of the bike.

And now that you guys have me interested in 2 strokes, what is usually the case of rebuilding a motor? How much will it cost if you do it yourself vs a reputable shop. With a good manual I would probably feel confident in doing it myself.
I'm not positive on shop prices because I've always done my own maintenance, but probably 200-300 for a 2 stroke, and 600+ for a 4 stroke. Doing it yourself, a 2 stroke will cost about 40 dollars and maybe 3 hours tops once you've done it a couple of times.

I am open to other bikes in the 200-300 range if its a 4 stroke. It I were to get a 2 stroke, it would be around a 125. I really only plan on doing trail riding no motorcross what so ever so winding a motor out wont be a huge deal for me on a constant basis which is why I wanted the torque of the 4 stroke.
2 strokes make way more torque than 4 strokes, it's just a lot harder to handle. A 4 stroke is a lot smoother in its power delivery, so it's easy to keep under control. A 2 stroke's powerband hits you like a brick wall, and will scare the hell out of you the first couple of times. Once you get used to it, you won't want anything else. I have a KTM 360 2-stroke, and it will go over 100. I'm sure there are 4 strokes that can do that too, but I've never ridden one.
 
So what problems do valves cause? Are they a pita to check and adjust? From doing some reading online last night, I read that 4 strokes should have their valves adjusted around 25-30 hours and a rebuild with new piston around 75-100 hours.

They don't cause problems. If you can use a feeler gauge and operate a wrench, valve clearance adjustments are extremely simple. All two valve and older RFVC Honda XR's use stud and jam nut adjusters which involve removing an inspection cover to check and adjust. It can be done in a matter of minutes.

Others, like my KLX, require the cam cover to be removed and the clearance checked with a feeler gauge. If adjustment is needed the cams have to be removed to change the shims. All in all, it takes a couple of hours to do.

Honda XR's aren't built like modern high output fourstrokes. A 200 or RFVC 250, 400, or 600 will go far beyond the 100 hour mark on a top end. Valve adjustments need to be made, but the process is simple on these machines so it is really a no brainer.

Also what about lowering bikes down like 1 in?

Lowering the front can (not always though) be as simple as sliding the forks up in the triple clamps. Lowering the rear can (again, but not always) be as simple as changing the shock linkages. I have never lowered an XR before, but I have lowered an older KLX250R. I made my own linkages out of plate aluminum to lower the rear and combined lighter spring rate fork springs with sliding the forks up a quarter of an inch to lower the front. It worked out well, but the change in shock geometry made the rear a little harsh which took some tweeking to correct.

And now that you guys have me interested in 2 strokes, what is usually the case of rebuilding a motor? How much will it cost if you do it yourself vs a reputable shop. With a good manual I would probably feel confident in doing it myself.

In the case of a two stroke, if the bottom end is sound all that needs to be done is a piston and ring job. For most common two strokes it can be done for around 50 bucks if you do the work yourself.

A KX100, for example, costs less than 100 bucks in parts and can be done in two to three hours depending on if the power valve needs cleaning or not.

My old KX500 routinely went far over 100 hours on a top end and I never suffered a piston failure. Parts for the job cost me just over 150 bucks and it took me around three hours to do the job (lots of time wasted swilling beer and bullshitting in that time too).

Keys to two stroke longevity are using high quality oils, premium fuel, good maintenance and common sense.

I am open to other bikes in the 200-300 range if its a 4 stroke. It I were to get a 2 stroke, it would be around a 125. I really only plan on doing trail riding no motorcross what so ever so winding a motor out wont be a huge deal for me on a constant basis which is why I wanted the torque of the 4 stroke.

Aside from Honda XR's, Kawasaki makes the KLX line. Older KLX250R's and KLX300R's can be found for a good price and are as bulletproof as they come. They are more of an "old school" thumper, which means they don't have a lot of top end, but the mid-range and lower end output is excellent. My KLX300R has more usable torque than my old 500 two stroke did down low. The 500 would kill the thing in a hillclimb, drag race, you name it, but it was a very unpredictable machine that ate rear tires like donuts. My 300 four stroke wasn't a perfect machine when I bought it, but I have it almost where I want it now. I was going to upgrade to the KLX450R this year, but until it gets fuel injection my 300 will do. I actiually plan on racing it this year too.

Both the KLX250 and 300 are basically the same outside of some fork changes and engine displacement increses over the years. Both can be lowered and both have very tame and predictable engine output. The really nice thing is that they also have good aftermarket support, so if you get bored you can always make it faster!

Anyways, I could write a novel on this stuff. There are tons of options out there that are inexpensive to boot. Honda, Kawasaki and Yamaha all make excellent machines. Suzuki does as well, but their trail machine line is pretty minimal outside of the DR-Z (125, 250 and 400) models which carry a big price tag due to the fact they haven't been around for very long. Older XR's and KLX's are pretty abundant for cheap.

:beer:
 
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NippleChops.

Thanks for writing so much information. I really appreciate it. I will keep my eye out for some KLX 250s and 300s. That certainly sounds like a good road to head down.
 
Suzuki did make a DR200 and a DR350 prior to the DR-Z. You could probably find one of those fairly cheap (especially the 200), as they've been making them for a long time and they woudn't be too far off from the KLX mentioned above. The DR350 might be a little big and heavy for your size, I think it's not too far off from the DRZ400 which comes in at nearly 300lbs.

They actually still make the DR200, in street legal dual sport form. They are available with electric start.

I'm a 6'0" 165 pounder, so I ride bigger - my current ride is a DR-Z400. My dream offroad bike would be a Yamaha WR250F but that would likely run me $2500+ for a used one and I'm just not in the shape to do that right now.


Btw - check out thumpertalk.com. It's the TRS equivalent for single cylinder offroad bikes. They concentrate mainly on 4 strokes but they have 2 stroke sections too, and model specific forums.
 
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Suzuki did make a DR200 and a DR350 prior to the DR-Z. You could probably find one of those fairly cheap (especially the 200), as they've been making them for a long time and they woudn't be too far off from the KLX mentioned above. The DR350 might be a little big and heavy for your size, I think it's not too far off from the DRZ400 which comes in at nearly 300lbs.

You would think I would have remembered that considering there is a guy in my neighbourhood with a DR200. :icon_twisted:
 
4 strokes are the only way to go i have a crf 450 i love that bike the power evertything about it a good beginer bike would be hondas new crf 150 those are good bikes
 
When I was that size a had a Kaw kdx 200 and absolutely loved it. Yes, it is a 2 stroke but I never had any probs with it and it was a blast to ride.
 
You would think I would have remembered that considering there is a guy in my neighbourhood with a DR200. :icon_twisted:

eh, it happens. I'm a zook guy so I'm more familiar with their model line than I would expect anyone else to be. It's not really that well known of a bike for some reason, Suzuki just hasn't marketed it very aggressively.
 
When i was younger my dad got me a TTR 125 and it was good for trails and stuff but was quickly underpowered. Then i got a 1990 YZ 125 two stroke for six hundred dollars. Its not so good for woods trails but on a track or in sand dunes it is fun as heck. Now i need a nice four stroke though. At least a 250 but preferably a 450.
 
ugh, I'm sorry people
but a TTR and XR are just such garbage that would just get old 2 days after riding it.

you have to get something with balls (this sounds bad because you dont want power to start) but if you understand how to slip the clutch good you for sure can ride a CR250 or YZ250 (Honda or Yamaha) not CRF250 YZF250. You just need to learn how to manage the power, but once you get the balance and the ability to flip through the gears without a problem you are going to want a bike with a little more umph. I dont know if this helps but check out this website they have fairly cheap bikes. www.race-dezert.com or you can always check craigslist. During this economy is a good time to pick up some bomb ass deals because people need to pay bills. Good Luck
 
300 vs 302 anyone?

I started with an XR 100 and went to a Yamaha IT 200 and then went to an XR350. in that time I also had an XL500 and an 87 YZ 250. My mom began on an XR 200 and still rides it with no problems and I much prefer the 4 stroke
 

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