Should we be left to ourselves?

[JOLENE_THE_RANGER]

i do know the science behind it, and sure ill accept that as to why whe should wear em. like i said i dont mind it...but the other questions?

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

*schools are a bad example, kids probably trade masks while they trade their buggers. Not the most hygienic bunch even on a good day...

 

[rusty ol ranger]

The government needs to butt out.

If you go outside "unprotected" in public then you are accepting the risk, Simple as that. Just like smoking, sex, and anything else.

Its called personal responsibility.

 

[Snoranger]

i do know the science behind it, and sure ill accept that as to why whe should wear em. like i said i dont mind it...but the other questions?

Because of an initial overreaction due to an unknown disease that we had very limited information on, other than it was killing people. Once we learned how it was spread, and how to slow it, most things opened back up. They put the capacity restrictions in place because people are A-holes and won’t police themselves.... in all reality they have to put all these rules in effect for that reason.

 

[JOLENE_THE_RANGER]

i live in CA so maybe things are weirder here than where you are. we were just shut down again yesterday. i still dont understand eating outside inside a tent with 4 walls but not inside a building with 4 walls lol.

 

[Snoranger]

i live in CA so maybe things are weirder here than where you are. we were just shut down again yesterday. i still dont understand eating outside inside a tent with 4 walls but not inside a building with 4 walls lol.

I’m in NJ... we’re about a week or so behind you in enacting the restrictions.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

The government needs to butt out.

If you go outside "unprotected" in public then you are accepting the risk, Simple as that. Just like smoking, sex, and anything else.

Its called personal responsibility.

It isn't going unprotected, no mask allows you to spread it to others. Without a mask your breathing spreads it onto things that other people touch, it slows the spread that way. They are actually kind of mediocre as a breathing in filter.

 

[MikeG]

i do know the science behind it, and sure ill accept that as to why whe should wear em. like i said i dont mind it...but the other questions?

Some of it is 'science', but a lot of it is mathematical modeling. Which is useful, but often doesn't absolutely prove things .... it simply suggests what the probabilities are. I warned you guys that I dig through the details.....

When the Navy looked at the outbreak on the TR, they did so by interviewing and testing a group of sailors (a little less than 400), well after the fact. Which doesn't mean the conclusions are faulty, but it does raise more questions than answers. For example, when the TR went to port in Guam and most of the sailors left the ship (late March) there were no FDA approved antibody tests. The antibody testing was done much later, leading to the question of whether a positive test resulted from the outbreak on the TR, or something after they left the ship.

There was no data listed in any of the articles detailing what kind of masks were used, nor how often they were washed or if there was any sterilization procedure.

All of the answers about mask usage, social distancing, etc., were given well after the fact.

'Social distancing' on a ship would be problematic, especially with common sleeping areas. Did any of the sailors wear a mask sleeping? Seem doubtful. I've been on a few ships that were set up as museums, and even slept overnight on one (Lexington) and the sleeping areas were just packed with bunks. Granted these were older ships, but a friend who was in the Navy in the 80s said his experience was similar, too.

Anyway the report concluded that there was a reduction in the rates of transmission by various measures, but emphasis on 'reduction in rate'. Not elimination of transmission. Again, that is a conclusion based on mathematical modeling. Unfortunately some of the things needed to narrow this down (ie antibody testing) weren't available till much later, and the more time that passes by, the less reliable people's memories tend to get.

 

[JOLENE_THE_RANGER]

It isn't going unprotected, no mask allows you to spread it to others. Without a mask your breathing spreads it onto things that other people touch, it slows the spread that way. They are actually kind of mediocre as a breathing in filter.

when the governor (of my state) starts wearing a mask and stops having dinner parties, then maybe ill take his thanksgiving limitations and mask mandates into consideration.
till then, i wont be listening to a thing he tells us to do in our own homes.

 

[Snoranger]

when the governor (of my state) starts wearing a mask and stops having dinner parties, then maybe ill take his thanksgiving limitations and mask mandates into consideration.
till then, i wont be listening to a thing he tells us to do in our own homes.

Everyone hates governor Murphy here in NJ. I try to keep my mouth shut because he really is trying to keep people from dying. I did find this one about his next round of restrictions funny...

 

[MikeG]

Further thoughts regarding the Navy report.....

Of the 400 or so sailors participating in the investigation, close to half had previously tested positive for the virus. However, only about a quarter of the entire population of the ship tested positive, suggesting that the sample was not entirely random. 400 or so should be well enough to get some solid conclusions, but if they don't have the virus at the same rate that the rest of the ship was thought to (or pretty close) then either the sample is biased somehow (maybe those who had tested positive previously were more inclined to volunteer for the study), or one of the testing methodologies is faulty.

The report doesn't say whether the data on the various measures is isolating each of the measures individually, or the rates of infection / transmission were an aggregate number. That is, for the conclusion that wearing a mask reduces transmission by a certain percent, and that 'social distancing' (whatever that means on a crowded ship) reduces transmission by a certain percent, how many of those were doing BOTH and if you're doing TWO things to prevent it - WHICH one of them was actually responsible? And the flip side is, of those who WEREN'T wearing a mask or social distancing (?), and caught the cooties..... WHICH of those two reasons were responsible for the increase in the transmission rate?

Like I said.... raises more questions than answers.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

when the governor (of my state) starts wearing a mask and stops having dinner parties, then maybe ill take his thanksgiving limitations and mask mandates into consideration.
till then, i wont be listening to a thing he tells us to do in our own homes.

My grandparents have already had the virus but the 10 little kids from 3 different daycares and 3 school districts give me the willies.

We are just doing immediate family this year.

 

[Grumpaw]

Wife and I have been together for 43 years. This is the first year in all that time that we're spending Thanksgiving by ourselves. Have always had family/friends but not this year.
No kids or grandkids. Wife is very sad. Rest of the holidays are going to be the same.

 

[RonD]

I talking about the rona.

Should the state just butt out and let us do as we please. Or step in and force people to stay separate and all that.

If you agree then why and if you don't then why?
And do you honestly think it's gonna make a difference what the state does when I comes to the spread of it?

I only ask cause ohio is contemplating another shut down. Which our local businesses couldnt afford anyway.

Well what about this
Should we be left to ourselves as far as driving?
Stop signs, stop lights, speed limits, general rules of the road

We are all adults, and have a drivers license, should we just be able to do what we want when on the road?
Driving is a "social activity" because we have to "share the road"

Is a School zone lower speed limit a government infringement on your daily driving

Social activities, like driving, require a certain amount of compromise, some times just expected but not required, some times mandated by laws

Covid-19 is a social disease, if you chose to not socialize(drive) then no problem, but if you still want to socialize(drive) then there may be new government mandates on how that can be done safely(lower speed limit) or maybe it can't be done at all(road closed)

 

[Jim Oaks]

Texas governor won't shut anything down, and we're well above a million cases.

I'd hate to be a governor or mayor right now. We elect these people to run the government and protect us, and then threaten to vote them out if office when they make tough decisions to protect the public. There was a plot to kidnap Michigans governor over all of this. Yet somehow Biden criticized Trumps handling of it and thinks he can lock everything down for 4-6 weeks.

I wear a mask in public to prevent myself from spreading germs. Unfortunately I see people without masks that could care less about other people. After all, the idea of the mask is to control people from spreading it, not controlling you from getting it.

We are a self centered society that only cares about ourselves. If not, we wouldn't need rules.

1 in 30 people in Texas have or have had the virus. I thought about that last Saturday when I went out for dinner, and then to a free outdoor concert. There were people in the crowds not keeping their distance, and not wearing a mask. (I was).

They've been warned and don't listen. Just like speeding and not wearing a seat belt. They might get away with it, they might suffer a minor setback from it, or they might become the unfortunate one in a hospital clinging for life. The law was there to protect them. They chose to roll the dice and gamble. They have nobody to blame but themselves. What's unfortunate is when their carelessness hurts someone else.