89 2.3 Running rough and dying at idlehttp://www.therangerstation.com/forums/images/s

1989rangerob · Jun 29, 2014

89 2.3 Running rough and dying at idle

I've done the intake side sensors/gaskets. I took down the mid pipe to see if the cat fell apart and clogged up the muffler. It did so I removed the exhaust from the mid pipe back and installed a new muffler and tail pipe. The motor still ran the same with the pipe off though.

So now I'm doing the timing belt, thermostat, water pump... The timing belt is loose and has cracks all over it. I'm going to mark the gears with paint when I take the belt off so re installation should be a breeze.

Is there anything else you all think I should replace while I have the front of the motor taken apart? There is a sensor for the crankshaft that autozone and napa didn't have. It sits in a groove. It's magnetic and reads what looks to be the inside of the harmonic balancer.

Am i missing anything? Do any of you have any suggestions?

Mark_88 · Jun 30, 2014

The last one is the crank sensor and that is probably not the problem if it is starting since it as it tells the computer where the crank is to set timing. If the timing belt is cracked and old that may be part of the problem.

Usually the timing marks are on the gears so no need to mark them...

Water pump is a good thing to change as well as the thermostat since you are tearing it down...but you may want to look into moving the TFI off the distributor...not necessarily now but at some point...but check to see if the distributor bolt is loose as that will affect timing also.

Rough running though can be caused by other things as well as the dying engine...things like inertia switch, MAP sensor (on the firewall usually) can give certain symptoms but not necessarily that combination. More like fuel pressure and pumps as there may not be enough pressure to run the engine properly and if it cuts out sporadically then the pump may be on the way out.

Could also be as simple as a clogged fuel filter...

tomw · Jun 30, 2014

If the idle is off the wall terrible, try disconnecting the MAF. It signals the computer how much load the engine has, and if broken will make the computer change the fuel mix incorrectly, leading to a poor idle. If you remove it, a default load will be used by the computer and the idle should smooth out.
Causes for poor idle can include plugs, wires, cap, rotor, injectors, leaking gaskets, loose intake, fuel flow, fuel pressure, and the IAC.
Visual inspection first, then tests. If the engine will start and do high idle then taper down to ~600-700 rpms, the IAC is likely working. It will kick the cold idle up if it works.
Hissing would indicate vacuum leaks. Black smoke from the exhaust, excessive fuel.
A solid, every time miss would indicate more individual components, such as plug, injector, valves, rings etc for one cylinder. Intermittent is harder to find.
tom

1989rangerob · Jun 30, 2014

Mark_88 said:
The last one is the crank sensor and that is probably not the problem if it is starting since it as it tells the computer where the crank is to set timing. If the timing belt is cracked and old that may be part of the problem.

Usually the timing marks are on the gears so no need to mark them...

Water pump is a good thing to change as well as the thermostat since you are tearing it down...but you may want to look into moving the TFI off the distributor...not necessarily now but at some point...but check to see if the distributor bolt is loose as that will affect timing also.

Rough running though can be caused by other things as well as the dying engine...things like inertia switch, MAP sensor (on the firewall usually) can give certain symptoms but not necessarily that combination. More like fuel pressure and pumps as there may not be enough pressure to run the engine properly and if it cuts out sporadically then the pump may be on the way out.

Could also be as simple as a clogged fuel filter...

The coil packs have been replaced. There are eight spark plugs and wires on this 4 cylinder, apparently to improve fuel economy. I have also replaced the fuel filter. The motor is distributorless

1989rangerob · Jun 30, 2014

tomw said:
If the idle is off the wall terrible, try disconnecting the MAF. It signals the computer how much load the engine has, and if broken will make the computer change the fuel mix incorrectly, leading to a poor idle. If you remove it, a default load will be used by the computer and the idle should smooth out.
Causes for poor idle can include plugs, wires, cap, rotor, injectors, leaking gaskets, loose intake, fuel flow, fuel pressure, and the IAC.
Visual inspection first, then tests. If the engine will start and do high idle then taper down to ~600-700 rpms, the IAC is likely working. It will kick the cold idle up if it works.
Hissing would indicate vacuum leaks. Black smoke from the exhaust, excessive fuel.
A solid, every time miss would indicate more individual components, such as plug, injector, valves, rings etc for one cylinder. Intermittent is harder to find.
tom

It's intermittent. No maf on my year model. The timing belt was literally loose, there was a good amount of play in it. that would make sense with the weird motor sound at higher RPMs. The motor would sound like it was trying to go out of timing and then cycle like that.

Mark_88 · Jun 30, 2014

1989rangerob said:
The coil packs have been replaced. There are eight spark plugs and wires on this 4 cylinder, apparently to improve fuel economy. I have also replaced the fuel filter. The motor is distributorless

Oh, right, the 88 was the last year for distributors...it's the mustang 2.3 that was late changing over...

Did you get to the timing belt yet or are you waiting for more input?

1989rangerob · Jun 30, 2014

Mark_88 said:
Oh, right, the 88 was the last year for distributors...it's the mustang 2.3 that was late changing over...

Did you get to the timing belt yet or are you waiting for more input?

I have the belt. Do I need to take off the harmonic balancer, or will the belt fit behind it and up on through? Also, I don't have a lower timing belt cover and they no longer make them. Where should my marks line up? I know where the camshaft is supposed to line up. The oil pump and the crankshaft not so much. I didn't remove the plugs either, the motor turns with them still in.

1989rangerob · Jun 30, 2014

...and it ran super rich before I tore it apart

1989rangerob · Jun 30, 2014

Mark_88 said:
Oh, right, the 88 was the last year for distributors...it's the mustang 2.3 that was late changing over...

Did you get to the timing belt yet or are you waiting for more input?

The Hanes manual I have shows the line up marks to be on the timing belt cover. It shows the keyway at 12 o'clock. I gues I have to take off the harmonic balancer. It also says I'll need a special tool to install the crank sensor. I don't think I'm going to replace it though. I can't find one at any of the auto part stores.

1989rangerob · Jul 1, 2014

flange

I guess I will be pulling it

Mark_88 · Jul 2, 2014

It looks like you have the bottom end of the cover still in place. That's usually only held on by two or three 10mm bolts that usually come out pretty easy...but you may have to crawl under the truck to get at some of them...otherwise, yes, it does look tight. I don't think mine has any more room and I've managed to get the belt in and around the flange.

1989rangerob · Jul 2, 2014

man I just realized that. I was looking at all the gunk on the front Of the motor and couldn't see the bolts. I removed all the gunk and then decided to come on here to see if you had commented. Lol. you already answered the question I was about to ask. thanks man.

1989rangerob · Jul 2, 2014

Mark_88 said:
It looks like you have the bottom end of the cover still in place. That's usually only held on by two or three 10mm bolts that usually come out pretty easy...but you may have to crawl under the truck to get at some of them...otherwise, yes, it does look tight. I don't think mine has any more room and I've managed to get the belt in and around the flange.

I remove those bolts you were talking about. do I need to remove the two 8 millimeter oil pan bolts that go up through the oil pan into the bracket?

Mark_88 · Jul 2, 2014

Not sure, try sliding a screw driver behind the plastic guard to see if it pops away from the motor. The oil pan should be separate from the plastic because they come from underneath and usually bolt into the bottom of the block.

I removed mine years ago and it was not connected to the oil pan at all. it just may be glued in there with all the gunk.

Mark_88 · Jul 2, 2014

There should also be one or two on the other side of the crank...check for those and remove them (above the oil pan only) and it should come off.

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