Stupid 2.9.....

[Mike828]

1987 Bronco II.
Put new-used '87 2.9 motor in it last winter. Used '92 ecu to remove EGR.
Put in new-

in-tank fuel pump/sender/sock
fuel filter
coolant temp sensor
map sensor
oil pressure sensor
air charge sensor
plugs and wires
'rebuilt' the injectors
clutch/pressure plate/flywheel

Ran great until 2 weeks ago. Wouldn't rev over about 2200 rpm. Got code 14, Ignition pickup was erratic, replaced TFI ignition module with used one that tested good 3 times and ran great for a week.

then it started acting funny, loosing a little power right after shifting (manual trans). This has gotten worse and worse to the point I need to drop to second gear to get up a hill I used to have no trouble with in 3rd or 4th.

I've tried to pull codes, there aren't any.
Grounds are good.
Compression is 150-170
Fuel pressure is 40psi key on engine off and drops to 32 engine on and rises slightly with throttle then settles.
I went ahead and got a new fuel filter, cap, rotor, plugs, ignition pick up, TFI module, idle air control valve, throttle position sensor and O2 sensor. No help.
It definitely sounds funny when driving. Like it's out of time, sort of 'glugging' and hard to describe, but idles fines.

It is timed at 10 degrees BTDC with the SPOUT removed but when i watch it with a timing light, every few seconds I don't see the mark on the pulley.
Both cats and muffler I believe were replaced by the previous owner who didn't change the oil, ever, I think. I found a LOT of carbon and goo in old engine that didn't have any oil pressure.

Anybody got ideas? I'm starting to wonder if the cats are clogged or the ECU is having issues. It idles fine. Just no power when I try to move it.

 

[bimmer325es]

how old is the cat? this is very possible happened on my moms jeep rpms would go up half way no farther no power at all. Does it smell like rotten eggs ever? try to rattle it and see if it makes noise. If its bolted on cut the bolts, buy some new bolts, and look inside to see what you find.

 

[rusty70f100]

It is timed at 10 degrees BTDC with the SPOUT removed but when i watch it with a timing light, every few seconds I don't see the mark on the pulley.

Do you mean the light stops flashing every few seconds? I'm thinking here that there might be a malfunction in the ignition somewhere.

Is the SPOUT unplugged when you watch it with the timing light? If it's plugged back in, the computer might just be adjusting the timing.

Did you check the ignition coil?

 

[Mike828]

how old is the cat? this is very possible happened on my moms jeep rpms would go up half way no farther no power at all. Does it smell like rotten eggs ever? try to rattle it and see if it makes noise. If its bolted on cut the bolts, buy some new bolts, and look inside to see what you find.

Dunno how old. Previous owner told me he replaced cats and muffler and they look pretty new. Doesn't smell and no noise if I tap on it..

Vacuum gauge tells me it's a little low when first started, 14-16 but builds to 18. Revved to 3000 it drops a little then goes back to 18.
I think the cats might be alright.

 

[Mike828]

Do you mean the light stops flashing every few seconds? I'm thinking here that there might be a malfunction in the ignition somewhere.

Is the SPOUT unplugged when you watch it with the timing light? If it's plugged back in, the computer might just be adjusting the timing.

Did you check the ignition coil?

I've watched with the SPOUT in and out. It just skips here and there. Pretty irregular.

Took ohm meter to the coil and was good.

Pulled #1 wire and put an old plug in and the spark seems kinda weak sometimes. Put another wire on and it seemed the same.
Didn't drive any better either.

 

[John Smith]

have you replaced the

I've watched with the SPOUT in and out. It just skips here and there. Pretty irregular.

Took ohm meter to the coil and was good.

Pulled #1 wire and put an old plug in and the spark seems kinda weak sometimes. Put another wire on and it seemed the same.
Didn't drive any better either.

diz sender?....I understand the PU in the diz is the primary candidate for the code 14?..or at least a bad signal from the diz pu...in the wiring...try to remote mount it..and if that don't cure it..pull the Diz and replace the PU. It's a pain..but worth it if it's defective..you ARE still using a Distributor right?..if i understand you you have a later ecu but an 87 engine..

As you remote mount the TFI you will create a different ground path for the TFI module..that may help if your dist isn't grounded well..a new PU in the DIST will help with any loss of signal bcuz of burnt wiring there or grounding issues..just sayin..

 

[Mike828]

diz sender?....I understand the PU in the diz is the primary candidate for the code 14?..or at least a bad signal from the diz pu...in the wiring...try to remote mount it..and if that don't cure it..pull the Diz and replace the PU. It's a pain..but worth it if it's defective..you ARE still using a Distributor right?..if i understand you you have a later ecu but an 87 engine..

As you remote mount the TFI you will create a different ground path for the TFI module..that may help if your dist isn't grounded well..a new PU in the DIST will help with any loss of signal bcuz of burnt wiring there or grounding issues..just sayin..

I replaced the pickup yesterday, didn't help.

 

[Mike828]

Anybody with more brains than me want to help me with #6 here-

Spark Timing Advance Test #8

Spark timing advance is controlled by the EEC system. This procedure checks the capability of the ignition module to receive the spark timing command from the EEC module. The use of a volt/ohmmeter is required.

1 - Turn the ignition switch OFF.

2 - Disconnect the pin-in-line connector (SPOUT connector) near the TFI module.

3 - Start the engine and measure the voltage, at idle, from the SPOUT connector to the distributor base. The reading should equal battery voltage.

4 - If the result is okay, the problem lies within the EEC-IV system.

5 - If the result was not satisfactory, separate the wiring harness connector from the ignition module. Check for damage, corrosion or dirt. Service as necessary.

6 - Measure the resistance between terminal No. 1 and the pin-in-line connector. This test is done at the ignition module connector only. The reading should be less than 1 ohms.

7 - If the reading is okay, replace the TFI module.

8 - If the result was not satisfactory, service the wiring between the pin inline connector and the TFI connector.

Is it right, I'm getting a crazy reading and looking at my wiring diagram in Haynes if I'm reading it right they want me to test the resistance between one wire going into the computer and another coming out.
I've been told this isn't possible.

Am I right? And does a super high reading mean my wiring between those 2 points or computer is messed up?

 

[cavedweller]

Two things come to mind the EEC and fuel pump relays and the computer itself...Iam in a bit of a hurry right now so forgive me if I missed something....Also you know a quick and dirty way to check the cat besides the hammer test is to pull the Oxy2 sensor and take a reading ....grey is good ,white is lean and black may mean you need a new cat.....Also when was the last time the Oxy2 sensor was replaced,checked?

 

[Psychopete]

They are having you test the voltage from one leg of the SPOUT to the distributor base to make sure there is voltage there.

Then disconnect the TFI-IV connector.

Looks like they are telling you to test the resistance from the other SPOUT pin to the TFI-IV connector to make sure the SPOUT wire itself isn't the issue.

 

[Mike828]

Two things come to mind the EEC and fuel pump relays and the computer itself...Iam in a bit of a hurry right now so forgive me if I missed something....Also you know a quick and dirty way to check the cat besides the hammer test is to pull the Oxy2 sensor and take a reading ....grey is good ,white is lean and black may mean you need a new cat.....Also when was the last time the Oxy2 sensor was replaced,checked?

Replaced o2 a few days ago. It's mostly grey, a little whitish.

 

[Mike828]

They are having you test the voltage from one leg of the SPOUT to the distributor base to make sure there is voltage there.

Then disconnect the TFI-IV connector.

Looks like they are telling you to test the resistance from the other SPOUT pin to the TFI-IV connector to make sure the SPOUT wire itself isn't the issue.

Now I see. But I only have 7 volts at the SPOUT. Resistance is fine.

So it's saying my TFI is bad. 3 of them actually in a couple weeks.....
But could it still be the EEC since it's controlling it?

 

[cavedweller]

Oxy2 sensor color shows correct engine operation ,from what I know ...If you have not done so,you could Buy your grey TFI module from NAPA,these replacement TFIs seem to have a better lifespan then others,..in my opinion.......... Could also be the EEC relay,see one way these relays go bad is that they lose resistance,(about 65 ohms), in the coil when they get hot .....Or two,they open ,under the same condition....hot.

 

[Mike828]

Oxy2 sensor color shows correct engine operation ,from what I know ...If you have not done so,you could Buy your grey TFI module from NAPA,these replacement TFIs seem to have a better lifespan then others,..in my opinion.......... Could also be the EEC relay,see one way these relays go bad is that they lose resistance,(about 65 ohms), in the coil when they get hot .....Or two,they open ,under the same condition....hot.

I have some extra relays I'll swap in to see what happens. Guess I should test my brand new TFI too....

 

[IRKillroy]

without reading all the responses, I noticed you checked the fuel pressure but did you check the fuel flow? They are two different things, you can have 10000lbs of pressure but only 2GPH (hypothetically speaking and for instructional purposes only). Working on HMMWVs there are some brought in for shift problems when it's a fuel supply problem. I will agree that it's a totally different fuel system, but it still proves my point.