Rough idle/hesitation/pinging?

[cp2295]

Yeah I'm pretty sure I installed a 192 thermostat recently.. The only downfall of that would be gas mileage, would 180 lower pinging because it would decrease cylinder temp? That's why pinging happens right? Gas predetonates under the heat?

And yeah I think I will just replace the PCv valve anyways, it's like $1

 

[stmitch]

So you just spray the sea foam through the brake booster intake line and then plug it back in and run the engine?

Not exactly. There are specific instructions on the bottle. As I remember it, start the engine, remove the booster line, and slowly pour the SeaFoam into the vacuum line. The engine will sputter and want to die, but as long as you don't add it too quickly, it will keep running. Shut the truck off, and let it sit for 15 minutes, then take the truck for a drive. If you get white smoke out of the tailpipe, it's blowing the carbon out. Most trucks smoke a lot and run rough while they smoke. When it quits smoking, you're done.
You can also add half a bottle here and there to a tank of gas to keep the fuel system cleaned out.

 

[stmitch]

Any other suggestions other than vacuum leak.. Evap stuff??

EVAP stuff under the hood is all vacuum controlled too, just like the EGR. It could be a vacuum leak, or it could be a faulty component.

 

[TrexMex]

Seafoam... you can start really heated up discussions on what the pros/cons are and/or if it's just snakeoil or not just but mentioning the "S" word around here hehe...

In my case I have used Seafoam with decent success in both my current 4.0 and my previous 3.0 ... 1/3rd of the can through the brake booster vaccuum line, 1/3rd in the oil and the rest through the gas tank so it says in the can.

You don't spray it, you pour it. Take care not to pour it too quick through the brake line or you risk on hydro locking the engine/blowing up a gasket... I may ping like crazy from the liquid stuff you're pouring in too..

You will need to let it sit for 10-15 minutes and then re-start and rev it up to 2500-3000 RPMs. Oh and make sure to do this in a well-ventilated area as it will blow A LOT of white smoke..

Hope this helps.. Another thing you should try to fish for vacuum leaks which would induce rough idle is to use an un-lit propane torch with the engine running and see if revs go up. If they do, then you have a vacuum leak

 

[cp2295]

In the intake, gas, and oil!? The oil part seems a little sketchy but I'll give it a shot.. Thanks for the info!

 

[McCormack]

Yeah I'm pretty sure I installed a 192 thermostat recently.. The only downfall of that would be gas mileage, would 180 lower pinging because it would decrease cylinder temp? That's why pinging happens right? Gas predetonates under the heat?

And yeah I think I will just replace the PCv valve anyways, it's like $1

I didn't notice any mileage decrease when I installed a 180* t-stat, and as a a bonus my engine seemed to run a bit crisper than with the stock 197* t-stat. But even if I did lose mileage, pinging is hard on an engine and I'd rather trade a bit of gas mileage for the peace of mind that my engine isn't being hurt by pinging.

 

[cp2295]

I didn't notice any mileage decrease when I installed a 180* t-stat, and as a a bonus my engine seemed to run a bit crisper than with the stock 197* t-stat. But even if I did lose mileage, pinging is hard on an engine and I'd rather trade a bit of gas mileage for the peace of mind that my engine isn't being hurt by pinging.

Yeah definitely. Also, I hooked up my stethoscope and listened to the fuel rails on the truck and they tick really bad, is that normal? Am I just hearing the fuel being sprayed because the explosions sound different on the exhaust.. Maybe an injector is clogged?

 

[Mosinguy]

Yeah definitely. Also, I hooked up my stethoscope and listened to the fuel rails on the truck and they tick really bad, is that normal? Am I just hearing the fuel being sprayed because the explosions sound different on the exhaust.. Maybe an injector is clogged?

Injectors make a ticking sound as they work. I wouldn't be concerned unless you can hear the ticking without a stethoscope.

 

[cp2295]

Injectors make a ticking sound as they work. I wouldn't be concerned unless you can hear the ticking without a stethoscope.

I do hear it, pretty clearly that's what prompted me to take a look around with the stethoscope, and then I found out it was the injectors making the noise

 

[cp2295]

Does that mean they're bad?

 

[RonD]

Smoke test for vacuum leak is done with engine off, that's the point of using smoke, it will come OUT of a leak point, if engine was on it would just be sucked into a cylinder because of the vacuum.

Remove each vacuum line from intake manifold, one at a time, and blow smoke into it, watch to see if it comes out anywhere, it shouldn't.

Then blow lots of smoke into the intake manifold, via PCV hose or power brake hose, and watch for leaks around intake gaskets.

Ford injectors are noisy, just like Ford power steering pumps
If an injector seems too noisy then test it with an OHM meter, 14ohms is average, 11-18ohms is acceptable range.


Installing a 180deg(or 160deg) t-stat is the same as installing a Cold Air Intake, actually better since it's cheaper and will get the same results.
It will lower overall engine operating temp assuming cooling system is working at 100%.
This will lower intake temp.
Since one of the parameters of fuel injected systems is air temp, the now cooler air(denser) will require more fuel to get the correct fuel/air mix, more fuel = more power.
This is why people often comment that their engine seems "peppier" in cold weather, colder air = more fuel in the mix = more power.

But yes MPG will go down, simple math, will you notice this, depends on how accurately you track MPG, it won't change that much, but a definite reduction in MPG.
Oil lubrication is best at 200-220deg, that's the engine design parameter, all motor oil viscosity is rated at 212deg
Will your engine blow up if you run no t-stat or a lower temp t-stat, no, of course not, lol.
Will engine efficiently go down, yes, of course it will.
Will engine power go up, yes, of course it will.


Will lowering overall engine temp reduce pinging?
It would depend on why the engine was pinging.
Pinging/pre-detonation has a few causes:
Incorrect spark timing
Too lean fuel/air mix
Too low octane rating for engine compression
Cylinder temp to high for octane rating(octane is a heat rating so this is a "duh" statement, lol)

Heat is a contributing factor in all of these, so lower engine temp would slow the start of the pinging but wouldn't eliminate it since it is not the direct cause of the pinging.

Engine design is for efficiency, so running close to the lean marker is what is desired, this is why adding unmetered air can cause pinging, i.e. a vacuum leak, this leans the mix too much, too lean = pinging.

EGR system allows for leaner mix under load, better emissions and efficiency, so pinging under load could be an EGR system issue.

 

[McCormack]

Will lowering overall engine temp reduce pinging?
It would depend on why the engine was pinging.
Pinging/pre-detonation has a few causes:
Incorrect spark timing
Too lean fuel/air mix
Too low octane rating for engine compression
Cylinder temp to high for octane rating(octane is a heat rating so this is a "duh" statement, lol)

Heat is a contributing factor in all of these, so lower engine temp would slow the start of the pinging but wouldn't eliminate it since it is not the direct cause of the pinging.

Heat is what causes 3.0 engines to ping, and the two contributing factors that cause that cause that heat are 197* thermostats in an older engine that wasn't really designed to run that hot (as evidenced by all the cracked cylinder heads you hear about on the Ranger forums), and spark timing from the factory that is too far advanced.

When I swapped a 180* thermostat into my engine it eliminated about 80% of my pinging (I also tried a 160* thermostat but it didn't do anything to further reduce pinging so I went with the 180*), and I bought a tuner and retarded my timing a couple of degrees, and that took care of the other 20%. I also blocked off the hot water feed to my intake manifold so that the intake charge doesn't heat up as much... whether that helped anything I don't know, but it certainly can't hurt.

Yes theoretically gas mileage is supposed to go down if you cool an engine down, but if anything my mileage seemed to go up a bit. As the poster stated a cooler engine will make more power, which theoretically should lower gas mileage, but a more powerful engine will allow the driver to use lighter throttle settings, so perhaps that's why mileage isn't affected all that much one way or the other.

 

[cp2295]

Heat is what causes 3.0 engines to ping, and the two contributing factors that cause that cause that heat are 197* thermostats in an older engine that wasn't really designed to run that hot (as evidenced by all the cracked cylinder heads you hear about on the Ranger forums), and spark timing from the factory that is too far advanced.

When I swapped a 180* thermostat into my engine it eliminated about 80% of my pinging (I also tried a 160* thermostat but it didn't do anything to further reduce pinging so I went with the 180*), and I bought a tuner and retarded my timing a couple of degrees, and that took care of the other 20%. I also blocked off the hot water feed to my intake manifold so that the intake charge doesn't heat up as much... whether that helped anything I don't know, but it certainly can't hurt.

Yes theoretically gas mileage is supposed to go down if you cool an engine down, but if anything my mileage seemed to go up a bit. As the poster stated a cooler engine will make more power, which theoretically should lower gas mileage, but a more powerful engine will allow the driver to use lighter throttle settings, so perhaps that's why mileage isn't affected all that much one way or the other.

Wow I'm gonna do that, tomorrow in fact. I ran some seafoam through and that seemed to clean the idle up a bit, I also sprayed some carb cleaner around the butterfly valve. I'm gonna get a smoke test done anyways because I still suspect vacuum leak, but I think the t-stat switch will help a lot

Very convincing argument by the way, thanks for the info

 

[cp2295]

What other cool little tricks can I do to increase engine performance like that ? Is an underdrive pulley a good idea and what about an electric fan? I've already done all I can to the suspension and stuff with replacing bearings and what not, but hasn't seemed to make a difference with fuel efficiency, made my truck smoother though. Any sort of aftermarket pulleys that reduces engine load?

And I've seen quite a bit that the 3.0 comes stock with a cold air intake, is this true? Will a k&n sort of deal help me at all?

Anyways different spark plugs to increase power? Anything my truck feels like a dog, it seems like it should have more power, my friends 2.9 has way more power, and on paper the 3.0 has more so I don't get it.. My truck should have more power!!

 

[cp2295]

Smoke test for vacuum leak is done with engine off, that's the point of using smoke, it will come OUT of a leak point, if engine was on it would just be sucked into a cylinder because of the vacuum.

Remove each vacuum line from intake manifold, one at a time, and blow smoke into it, watch to see if it comes out anywhere, it shouldn't.

Then blow lots of smoke into the intake manifold, via PCV hose or power brake hose, and watch for leaks around intake gaskets.

Ford injectors are noisy, just like Ford power steering pumps
If an injector seems too noisy then test it with an OHM meter, 14ohms is average, 11-18ohms is acceptable range.


Installing a 180deg(or 160deg) t-stat is the same as installing a Cold Air Intake, actually better since it's cheaper and will get the same results.
It will lower overall engine operating temp assuming cooling system is working at 100%.
This will lower intake temp.
Since one of the parameters of fuel injected systems is air temp, the now cooler air(denser) will require more fuel to get the correct fuel/air mix, more fuel = more power.
This is why people often comment that their engine seems "peppier" in cold weather, colder air = more fuel in the mix = more power.

But yes MPG will go down, simple math, will you notice this, depends on how accurately you track MPG, it won't change that much, but a definite reduction in MPG.
Oil lubrication is best at 200-220deg, that's the engine design parameter, all motor oil viscosity is rated at 212deg
Will your engine blow up if you run no t-stat or a lower temp t-stat, no, of course not, lol.
Will engine efficiently go down, yes, of course it will.
Will engine power go up, yes, of course it will.


Will lowering overall engine temp reduce pinging?
It would depend on why the engine was pinging.
Pinging/pre-detonation has a few causes:
Incorrect spark timing
Too lean fuel/air mix
Too low octane rating for engine compression
Cylinder temp to high for octane rating(octane is a heat rating so this is a "duh" statement, lol)

Heat is a contributing factor in all of these, so lower engine temp would slow the start of the pinging but wouldn't eliminate it since it is not the direct cause of the pinging.

Engine design is for efficiency, so running close to the lean marker is what is desired, this is why adding unmetered air can cause pinging, i.e. a vacuum leak, this leans the mix too much, too lean = pinging.

EGR system allows for leaner mix under load, better emissions and efficiency, so pinging under load could be an EGR system issue.

Thank you for all this information by the way very helpful