8.8/D44 front axle hybrid

[RacinNdrummin]

Im putting this in the non-ranger axle area because I feel its more appropriate.

Before I get flamed for bringing this up, I wanted to say in my defense that I have been thinking about this for awhile and the idea came to me due to the lack of other options I have come across in my area.

I was looking into a 6" lift for my B2 when the thought struck me that instead of spending $1200 or more on a TTB lift that I could get away with spending a lot less money if I SAS'ed it. Now the only problem with that is that I cant seem to find an EB axle and even then I would have to modify it, and I have noticed a few HP44's in F150's at the JY but I would have to modify those moreso than an EB, Not to mention the cost of a locker and gears for the 44.

I got to thinking after looking at my extra set of 4.10's on the shelf and seeing a jeep around my area with 9" front and rear axles, why not make a hybrid axle myself.

I already have a 97 explorer rear axle with 4.10's in my shop I was going to use for the rear. I was thinking of going out to the yard and picking up another explorer axle for around $100 and also picking up a front 44 out of an F150 or something also for around $100. I could drill out the plug welds and remove the tubes from the pumpkin and that would leave me with the chunk that I could re-gear with my other set of 4.10's. I could pick up some 3" .5" wall pipe(tubing) and make new tubes. Then I could either: A)Bore out the D44 knuckles to 3" or B) turn down the tube to 2.75" (I have the capability to do both), and attach them to the new tubes. I would run all the F150 outer stuff with new shafts to fit the 31 spline carrier.

Why go through all the trouble when I could just use the 44 and mod that right?

Well I could use the locker from the 8.8 (free), and the gears on my shelf (free). I would have to spend anywhere from $100 to $200 on a locker for the D44 plus the cost of gears and that could be anywhere from $100-$150.
I would have to get new axle shafts either way, and the 31 spline from the 8.8 would be bullet proof on that end. The only downfall I see to the 8.8 setup is that it would be a Low pinion setup, but it doesnt seem that people have too many problems with LP setups.

To me I see the 8.8 setup as being cheaper and more unique. Am I out to lunch here?

 

[martin]

Interesting idea, definately unique. You would however be running on the coast side of the gears, unless I missunderstood something somewhere.

 

[4x4junkie]

Highly doubtful you will be able to pull all that off for less than what a suspension lift costs.

The cost of the axle is only a tiny part of what adds up, all the extras needed to do the swap (things like the replacement steering linkage that will be needed, trackbars, bushings, links, all the needed hardware, brackets, etc.) need to be remembered as well. Then all your time (which will be massive with all that work on the axle you're proposing).
Most reports of SASs being less work and/or money than a suspension lift for your TTB tend to leave out those details (remember the price of most suspension lifts also includes the parts for lifting the rear suspension too).

If you have the D35 in your BII, there's really no good reason not to use it if you'll be running 35" or smaller tires. If you have a D28, the D35 basically just bolts in it's place. If you still want to swap the suspension, then I'd just narrow the F-150 D44 (that 3" .500 wall tubing you mentioned ain't at all cheap either). 4.10 gears are quite common, finding a used set for cheap shouldn't be difficult.

 

[Beanmachine7000]

I thought about this once, after I saw Xtreme4x4 build a steering 14bFF, but then decided for all the work the only positive for a front 8.8 is having matching front and rear axles, but you can't swap out thirds if one breaks anyhow... I don't see a benefit...

 

[RacinNdrummin]

Highly doubtful you will be able to pull all that off for less than what a suspension lift costs.

The cost of the axle is only a tiny part of what adds up, all the extras needed to do the swap (things like the replacement steering linkage that will be needed, trackbars, bushings, links, all the needed hardware, brackets, etc.) need to be remembered as well. Then all your time (which will be massive with all that work on the axle you're proposing).
Most reports of SASs being less work and/or money than a suspension lift for your TTB tend to leave out those details (remember the price of most suspension lifts also includes the parts for lifting the rear suspension too).

If you have the D35 in your BII, there's really no good reason not to use it if you'll be running 35" or smaller tires. If you have a D28, the D35 basically just bolts in it's place. If you still want to swap the suspension, then I'd just narrow the F-150 D44 (that 3" .500 wall tubing you mentioned ain't at all cheap either). 4.10 gears are quite common, finding a used set for cheap shouldn't be difficult.

I have taken the stuff you listed into account and it still comes out cheaper to do the SAS. I dont have to buy the brackets, just raw materials, I have access to a CNC plasma table. I figure I could find some 3" scrap and come out pretty cheap. I would have to buy bushings and joints and whatnot, yes, but I would be replacing the stock ones anyway if I lifted TTB. Even if I came out at or near what it would cost to do the TTB lift, it still would be worth it to have a stronger axle.

As far as the D44 parts go, Ive searched and searched, hell, ebay or CL doesnt even have a used set of 4.09's/10's/11's, whatever the D44 ratio is.

The only thing im worried about is like martin alluded to was the gear pattern and how well it would work, but I cant seeing that being a big deal, it would be like being in reverse, which would be fine if your just wheeling around anyway.

The other benefits of the setup would be part availability and affordability.

 

[RacinNdrummin]

I thought about this once, after I saw Xtreme4x4 build a steering 14bFF, but then decided for all the work the only positive for a front 8.8 is having matching front and rear axles, but you can't swap out thirds if one breaks anyhow... I don't see a benefit...

Honestly, Id be worried about breaking other stuff before the 8.8 housing, guys are running pretty damn quick with 8.8's in stangs at the strip, if you can throw 800+ hp at an 8.8 and it survives, I would assume it would handle anything I would throw at it on the front of a B2.

 

[Beanmachine7000]

Rear axles are always stronger than equivalent fronts too though... I only see a benefit here if you are going to gain an immense amount of strength (like Xtreme did with their 14bFF) or to have swappable thirds (9")... That's just my opinion... If you do it, make sure to take pictures... I really would like to see this happen...

 

[RacinNdrummin]

Yeah, If I decide to do it, it will be in my build-up thread.

 

[dangeranger01]

You can buy Axle tubes from sumit and then get some of the Cs for the knuckes of a Dana 44 and your set. But then you have to have custom shafts made for the inners. But then you could run 31 spline inner shafts. It would cost alot to make.

 

[wahlstrom1]

I've thought of it before, but using a 97'+ F150 8.8 front centersection as it's high pinion! But an aluminum housing made the idea kinda difficult...not really worth it IMO.

-andrew

 

[4x4junkie]

Even if I came out at or near what it would cost to do the TTB lift, it still would be worth it to have a stronger axle.

...

The other benefits of the setup would be part availability and affordability.

With D44 parts, it's not going to be all that much stronger unless you were to use alloy shafts (adding up considerable cost). The 5-297X axle U-joint is the primary failure point on both the D35 and the D44, so the most you really would benefit from would be the bigger brakes, and possibly the wheel bearings. These can be had with a D44 knuckle swap on the D35 (a D35/44 hybrid, if you will). Otherwise I'd just stick with using the D44 (unless of course you enjoy doing the type of work required to build what you're proposing, then of course by all means go for it (and do take some pics too). But be aware parts availability will not be a benefit to the swap, just the opposite. There is no such thing as a 31 spline D44 shaft in a junkyard that I know of).

Have you tried contacting any rearend shops to see if they might have any take-outs laying around? IIRC, HP D44 4.09s were pretty common in pre-'92 F-250s.

 

[RacinNdrummin]

I do enjoy doing that kind of work...Thats the main thing behind all of this, its unique.

But as far as parts availability goes, The only thing I would have to have made up would be the inner shafts, and if Im going with a 150 axle, Id have to have those made up anyway, If I went EB44, I have to have new shafts made plus the cost of the axle if I could find one, im not going to run the 5-260x's. I can run the stock LS in the front and that would get me by just fine. 31 spline over the stock 30 spline shouldnt be too hard to have made up, 3" pipe at the scrap yard would be fairly cheap. I can throw the knuckles up on the milling machine and bore out the tube holes to 3" and Ill machine a couple of 3.25" adaptors for the pumpkin end.

As far as the take out D44 gears go, thats great info, im sure I could get a set at the JY for around $30 bucks, but im still looking at around $200 for a locker if I can even find one.

I think im going to build this axle just to see what it takes and how it holds up.

 

[Beanmachine7000]

Make sure you take lots of pictures, I would love to see this work!

 

[AKBroncoII]

Just curious as to why you need new tubes? Why not use the 8.8 tubes? Cut down for short side, put cut off end onto other side.

 

[RacinNdrummin]

I was kind of thinking about that, but I dont know how much the knuckles would be able to handle as far as taking material out. Id have to remove a 1/4" of wall thickness where the tube is pressed in.

However, now that I think about it, I could just make some 3.25" to 2.75" sleeves and not have to machine the knuckles at all using the factory axle tubes.

Ill have to see what I can do as soon as I actually have both axles in my hands.