Heads/Valves/Cam/Intake Options (I R noob)

[dasfinc]

Long story short, I have a 1998 V-8 out of an explorer (GT-40P motor) in my ranger. Custom header-back exhaust, 8.8 4.10 posi rear end, ALL new suspension, but the motor is BONE stock...

I'll be tearing it back apart this winter, and REALLY need someone to just 'hold my hand'

What do I buy to get a reliable 300WHP N/A Out of this motor without having to figure out expensive tuning options? (I'm actually getting the motor fully rebuilt, I have a full kit) So Should I pickup bigger pistons and go .20/.40/.60 over? How much, and what brand? What kind of camshaft EXACTLY should I buy for solid mid-end power? What kind of rockers/pushrods should I get to get 'a little more' out of it without having to worry about the heads? What brand of intake should I buy (Upper and lower) that will work easily/well for this application, and lastly, can I stick with GT40P heads for this goal? Should I get them PnP'ed or just a basic valve job to freshen them up?

Currently I'm using a 2000 ECU tuned with a special forces 'sniper' tuner to firm up the shifts, and I will work on figuring out how to change the tune to premium fuel and how to remove the limiter etc later.

ALL input is MASSIVILY appreciated, I can't wait for next

 

[originalnitro]

How will your truck be used. Will it be run hard. What kind of budget are you on?

 

[TRX501RYAN]

Budget is the big question lol...

 

[Mac]

300 rwhp means about 370-380 at the crank. You're running the stock Explorer intakes now right? You could have the lower ported. Probably better off with after market heads (there are some good deals out there) instead of porting/polishing the "P"s. What headers/manifold you runing now? Torque Monsters are about the best fit in that chassis but run close to $790. Just start a spread sheet and figure out what you need and where you can get by with something else. I'd talk to the machine shop on pistons selection, just make sure the deal with a lot of Fords. Ive got some FI tests of different combonations that MM & FF did a couple of years ago. Check mail tomorrow.
Dave

 

[dasfinc]

300 rwhp means about 370-380 at the crank. You're running the stock Explorer intakes now right? You could have the lower ported. Probably better off with after market heads (there are some good deals out there) instead of porting/polishing the "P"s. What headers/manifold you runing now? Torque Monsters are about the best fit in that chassis but run close to $790. Just start a spread sheet and figure out what you need and where you can get by with something else. I'd talk to the machine shop on pistons selection, just make sure the deal with a lot of Fords. Ive got some FI tests of different combonations that MM & FF did a couple of years ago. Check mail tomorrow.
Dave

Torque monsters I'm seeing can be purchased for $680 from their website? and I recall that because I'm a 'premium' member of the explorer forum I get $100 discount just for mentioning them (so about $580)... Regardless, those will be the headers I will be running.

budget wise, I'd like to keep stock heads since after market ones run often $1000+

I'd be "OK" with less HP if I can run stock heads... Ideally I'd like to get into the mid 13 second range Completely N/A, and then run maybe a high 12 pass if I run nitrous? 300 was really just 'a toss out' number for these goals.

The Plan is to spend as far under $2000 (Excluding the cost of the labor for the engine rebuild) as I can over the course of 5-6 months so I can get a 13 second pass come spring.

A big 'problem' I've run into is that good machine shops want to make big money, so they will only recommend pistons that they sell so they can make a solid profit off of you.... I'd rather purchase my pistons, and just bring them, and my longblock to a machine shop with my rebuild kit and say "Put it all together please" and pay the $600 or so that it will cost to get it done in labor, and honestly feel it would be money well spent to have a 'fresh' .40 over longblock with OEM fresh heads that can support some 'decent' power.

Another problem is there is no hand-held tuner that really 'works' with the ranger being an OBD2 5.0... Standalones are outside of my budget, and I'm currently using my Special Forces Sniper with varying degrees of success. So I'd like to aim for 'bolt on power' if you will... I know I will not get the best gains with ANY mods until it is tuned correctly, but I hope I will find a solution to that by spring.

I've been told there is a certain cam that works VERY well with these motors for mid range power, but have yet to find exactly what that is/was. Also, what benefits do roller rockers have, what brand, what kind, etc?

On a side-note, I know Rnzwing (screenname misspelling) has a Ford motorsports supercharger on his 4wd, where would you find that, how much would it cost, what is it tuned with etc?

Ideally I'd like to 'reach my goals' (mid 13 pass) with Headers, cam, intake manifolds, PNP heads, roller rockers maybe? and then ARP headstuds so I can spray with a bit more confidence...

Sorry for being so 'vague' I feel like a noob, but I still don't have much of a 'list' as far as what EXACTLY I should do to reach my goals....

 

[dasfinc]

So here's the list really:

$1000 - Get motor rebuilt with .40 over pistons (Higher comp pistons?), and head ported to match with a valve job. I have a quote for $560 for a full rebuild, I already have a kit, pistons I'd imagine would be under $300 give or take, so $1000 total budget for this part.

$120 - ARP Headstuds

$250 - Get Crane/Comp 'stage 1' or 2 cam (So I can retain a good idle, and stock ratio rockers)

$150 - Roller rockers to reduce resistance in the top end

$100 (Probably less?) - After market valve springs (Between this and the cam/rockers I'd like to bump the redline a bit... What is the factory redline for these anyways?)

$600 - Torque Monster Headers

$400 - lightly used rear tires/28 inch radials

Figure out/remove transmission governors (Truck tops out at just under 100mph, and shifts into 4th at like 70mph) *ANY help would be amazing on this issue*

Are there underdrive kits available for this engine? My A/C Is already removed and using a by-pass pulley, what about if I Switch to a manual steering rack (Would it be worth it?)

Exhaust is already 2.5 header back

Already have a 8.8, 4.10 posi

Intake is factory box with a K+N Panel filter

So with the above, Is it worth the $ for new rods also? I would want to spray a 100 shot at some point next year, and assume new rods isn't needed.

 

[dasfinc]

Any more input guys? :-(

 

[baddad457]

So here's the list really:

$1000 - Get motor rebuilt with .40 over pistons (Higher comp pistons?), and head ported to match with a valve job. I have a quote for $560 for a full rebuild, I already have a kit, pistons I'd imagine would be under $300 give or take, so $1000 total budget for this part.
CHOOSE YOUR PISTONS WISELY GRASSHOPPER. NOT ALL "flatop" 302 pistons yeild the same comp ratio, the pin heights vary from 1.585 to 1.620
$120 - ARP Headstuds
for what you're doing, the stock head bolts are fine, just buy new ones as oyu may have the torque to yeild bolts now
$250 - Get Crane/Comp 'stage 1' or 2 cam (So I can retain a good idle, and stock ratio rockers)
no comment, other than to do your homework before choosing
$150 - Roller rockers to reduce resistance in the top end
good idea, go with it
$100 (Probably less?) - After market valve springs (Between this and the cam/rockers I'd like to bump the redline a bit... What is the factory redline for these anyways?)
the stock valve springs start to float at about 5000-5500 rpms, the stock roller lifters have a lot to do with the rev potential as much as the springs do. If you want to rev higher, spring for a new set of aftermarket roller lifters too
$600 - Torque Monster Headers
not my choice, but it's your truck and money
$400 - lightly used rear tires/28 inch radials
that's about $300 too much.
Figure out/remove transmission governors (Truck tops out at just under 100mph, and shifts into 4th at like 70mph) *ANY help would be amazing on this issue*

Are there underdrive kits available for this engine? My A/C Is already removed and using a by-pass pulley, what about if I Switch to a manual steering rack (Would it be worth it?)
don't waste your money here, you're working with a V8, not a torque limited 4 banger ricer
Exhaust is already 2.5 header back

Already have a 8.8, 4.10 posi

Intake is factory box with a K+N Panel filter

So with the above, Is it worth the $ for new rods also? I would want to spray a 100 shot at some point next year, and assume new rods isn't needed.

If you're going to rev it and spray it, new rods aren't a bad idea. But if not, just invest in new ARP rod bolts. (unless you've got a set of 90's F1SE or F2TE forging rods, then a new aftermarket set would be manditory)

 

[fordmike1]

Long story short, I have a 1998 V-8 out of an explorer (GT-40P motor) in my ranger. Custom header-back exhaust, 8.8 4.10 posi rear end, ALL new suspension, but the motor is BONE stock...

I'll be tearing it back apart this winter, and REALLY need someone to just 'hold my hand'

What do I buy to get a reliable 300WHP N/A Out of this motor without having to figure out expensive tuning options? (I'm actually getting the motor fully rebuilt, I have a full kit) So Should I pickup bigger pistons and go .20/.40/.60 over? How much, and what brand? What kind of camshaft EXACTLY should I buy for solid mid-end power? What kind of rockers/pushrods should I get to get 'a little more' out of it without having to worry about the heads? What brand of intake should I buy (Upper and lower) that will work easily/well for this application, and lastly, can I stick with GT40P heads for this goal? Should I get them PnP'ed or just a basic valve job to freshen them up?

Currently I'm using a 2000 ECU tuned with a special forces 'sniper' tuner to firm up the shifts, and I will work on figuring out how to change the tune to premium fuel and how to remove the limiter etc later.

ALL input is MASSIVILY appreciated, I can't wait for next

300rwhp is super easy with the Explorer 5.0. If you are going to go thru the engine then just get a rebuild kit, good valve job with new springs, retainers and keepers and mill the heads .020, Ford F-cam, 65mm t-body, 73 or 76mm MAFS and some good long tube headers. I have built about a dozen of these engines with this combo and have had them dyno'ed tuned from 290 to 320rwhp.
Yes there are better cams out there and yes there are better intakes out there and yes there is alot more you can do but this combo works very well and you will be very happy with it.

 

[Mac]

Think there is a problem using any of the letter cams with the Explorer computer, they all have too tight a LSA from what I remember. Think 114 degs is the minimum. Couple of Ford engineers who did the swap found the problem and had Ford add a disclaimer to their FRPP catalog. Not sure any tuning around it. Headers - Torque Monsters are about the only proven ones to fit those heads and chassis, anyone got an idea of others that work? I don't think you are going to get them TM's for that price no matter what his site says. I talked to him a couple of months ago and asked him about it. It might also take a couple of months to get them. What good shop did you find down there to port them heads?
You ought to road trip over to Bryon to watch the wheel standing contest on Sunday, ought to be a wild show.
Dave

 

[dasfinc]

If you're going to rev it and spray it, new rods aren't a bad idea. But if not, just invest in new ARP rod bolts. (unless you've got a set of 90's F1SE or F2TE forging rods, then a new aftermarket set would be manditory)

You kinda scared me off with your comments:

$100 (Probably less?) - After market valve springs (Between this and the cam/rockers I'd like to bump the redline a bit... What is the factory redline for these anyways?)

the stock valve springs start to float at about 5000-5500 rpms, the stock roller lifters have a lot to do with the rev potential as much as the springs do. If you want to rev higher, spring for a new set of aftermarket roller lifters too

Stock redline is 5000RPM Chief.... I bumped it by 400 to 5400, holding up just fine, but going to drop it back down to 5300. Regardless I've heard explorer springs are junk and I will replace them

$600 - Torque Monster Headers
not my choice, but it's your truck and money

These are the ONLY choice for 98+ 5.0 swapped rangers....


$400 - lightly used rear tires/28 inch radials
that's about $300 too much.

used slicks and skinnies on rims I see going for about $400, Sorry I didn't clarify that I meant a whole set of tires AND rims.

Thank you for the other input though, I'll keep it in mind

 

[dasfinc]

300rwhp is super easy with the Explorer 5.0. If you are going to go thru the engine then just get a rebuild kit, good valve job with new springs, retainers and keepers and mill the heads .020, Ford F-cam, 65mm t-body, 73 or 76mm MAFS and some good long tube headers. I have built about a dozen of these engines with this combo and have had them dyno'ed tuned from 290 to 320rwhp.
Yes there are better cams out there and yes there are better intakes out there and yes there is alot more you can do but this combo works very well and you will be very happy with it.

Think there is a problem using any of the letter cams with the Explorer computer, they all have too tight a LSA from what I remember. Think 114 degs is the minimum. Couple of Ford engineers who did the swap found the problem and had Ford add a disclaimer to their FRPP catalog. Not sure any tuning around it. Headers - Torque Monsters are about the only proven ones to fit those heads and chassis, anyone got an idea of others that work? I don't think you are going to get them TM's for that price no matter what his site says. I talked to him a couple of months ago and asked him about it. It might also take a couple of months to get them. What good shop did you find down there to port them heads?
You ought to road trip over to Bryon to watch the wheel standing contest on Sunday, ought to be a wild show.
Dave

Which Camshafts WILL work with my application then? I'm a bit lost on that part honestly...

I assume aftermarket 5.0 mustang throttle bodies will bolt right on? as far as MAF's go, I'd imagine I could probably pickup an aftermarket MAF from the company that sells my tuner to simplify things quite a bit as far as tuning is concerned.

 

[fordmike1]

Which Camshafts WILL work with my application then? I'm a bit lost on that part honestly...

I assume aftermarket 5.0 mustang throttle bodies will bolt right on? as far as MAF's go, I'd imagine I could probably pickup an aftermarket MAF from the company that sells my tuner to simplify things quite a bit as far as tuning is concerned.

If you are putting all this into your Ranger I would use the Mustang computer and wiring harness and then build the engine just like I said and you will be happy. There is going to be other opinions on this and that is fine but I have done this engine set up at least a dozen times and dyno'ed about half of them and they make 300rwhp with no problems. There is other guys on here that can steer you in a diffrent direction from there past builds and there combos may work just as well or better but from what I have built its super easy and cheap. Either way you go I am sure that you will achive what you want.........Good luck.

 

[Mac]

If you are putting all this into your Ranger I would use the Mustang computer and wiring harness and then build the engine just like I said and you will be happy. There is going to be other opinions on this and that is fine but I have done this engine set up at least a dozen times and dyno'ed about half of them and they make 300rwhp with no problems. There is other guys on here that can steer you in a diffrent direction from there past builds and there combos may work just as well or better but from what I have built its super easy and cheap. Either way you go I am sure that you will achive what you want.........Good luck.

Totally agree Mike, it's the Explorer computer that causes the problem. He should already have the 65mm TB and larger MAF from the Explorer. If he was to stay with the Ex set-up, I was going to reccomend the Comp Cam XE264HR-14. Long winded explaination about the LSA and duration at the bottom.
http://www.v8-ranger.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1981
Dave

 

[baddad457]

You kinda scared me off with your comments:



the stock valve springs start to float at about 5000-5500 rpms, the stock roller lifters have a lot to do with the rev potential as much as the springs do. If you want to rev higher, spring for a new set of aftermarket roller lifters too

Which ? About the roller lifters or the rods ? I've seen two 90's 5.0's that broke the rods in normal service. Not the bolts like the earlier C8OE rods did, but the rods themselves. I don't know what the change in rods was for or what they actually did, but the 90's rods in my opinion aren;t as good as the 68-90 C8OE rods were. I built several 5.0's for my V8 Ranger, the first two with used stock roller lifters and neither would rev past about 5000-5500. I replaced the lifters when doing a head swap and went with a set of Crane O.E. type rollers and the rev limit jumped to 7500. (along with the springs that came with the Canfield heads I swapped on) The heads they replaced were a set of ported E7's with new Crane springs (don't recall the numbers for them) but these heads are now on another motor with stock rollers and it floats at around 5000-5500.