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2.3L ('83-'97) CODE 33, EGR failure to sense, SOLVED, a good read on EGR diagnosis process.


corerftech

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Folks my 1990 Mississippi brutalized truck is just about to hit the road, after many hours of repairs to all major and most minor systems.

Last night I dealt with most all the exhaust leaks, from a butchered flow master knock off install. I found it cheaper (and that’s the point at this time, to install a cherry bomb and a 2.5 inch turn down just before the rear axle. I still have a minor leak at the ball/socket for the header down pipe.
I say all that because every time the truck is started (after being run or recently started) there is a decisive pop or backfire at ignition.
Having spent much time in the fuel system, even yesterday to deal with a sending unit wiper that lost contact with the brass pivot base and gauge went to extra full. I noticed that if the truck sits, it “seems” as though fuel pressure is lost. Prior to a file filter change after a few days of sitting, I tried to bleed pressure off at the Shrader valve and there was zero.
I would expect that an exhaust backfire might come from fuel, excess, that has made its way via an exhaust valve open to the exhaust.
The truck was running very rich. Soot everywhere. Now that the ignition system and sensors are doing their part, only rich (by smell) at cold start.
I have concerns about leaking injectors. No codes anymore. Truck behaves flawless except the backfire. But I think the backfire is indicative of a problem that may worsen.

Given the lack of static pressure in the fuel system shortly after a run, I suppose the regulator could be leaking back to the tank due to failure or….. leaking injectors. Injectors may be the reason for what still could be rich conditions.

Anyone care to through some conjecture at this? Car is bone stock except the newish exhaust remediation.

Lastly , a point for future reference. This is a beater truck that has been hurt but the core of the truck is solid. Dollars invested are not going to pay dividends beyond a certain measure. The exhaust repair was my second exhaust work. Autozone junk thin wall section had to be added to an old thick wall (read:quality) pipe to get the muffler where it belongs. Cheap and less than dirty was the directive. I welded all but the new thin wall to old pipe after the head pipe (under passenger seat). I used a quality 2.5 inch clamp for a seal. Seal has two obvious leaks at tips of the clamp saddle. I was not happy, “junk clamp”???? Blah blah blah. Then I was perusing the net and hit walker muffler website and a guide to clamps and use parameters.
Aha—— you need two clamps per joint, one 90 degrees phase from the first. Walker explains the conditions for each clamp and their pros and cons. I didn’t weld as the down pipe is really more than I am choosing to tackle and access is only doable with a gas torch ala muffler shop. They can do blind welds above the pipe much easier than I can and they do it daily. But a clamp should be fine. For what it’s worth, I learned two clamps out of phase 90 degrees is the proper way to have a leak proof joint that will last forever (not serviceable though) without the need for a band type clamp.

As always, thanks in advance for the ideas on my backfire problem. Literally the last problem I face.
 


89Twincharge

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Back fire is probably lean pop from no fuel in rail.. could be the fpr.smell for gas in the vacuum line. Use a fuel pressure tester see if it's working properly. Could also be hose on fuel pump... Ethenol makes them mushy and it could be bleeding off there. If that's all good then I'd look towards injectors
 

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I was leaning towards a lean mix too.
 

Jazzer

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Thanks for the info on proper clamp placement, it will come in handy. 👍

-Jazzer
 

corerftech

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Oy- injectors.
My luck FPR will test fine, 25 bucks here. $125 there…. Meh!

Ill try to get a loaner Fuel Inj Pressure gauge from AZ, I really don’t want to spend another 40-50 bucks on another tool in 2021!
Parts are bad enough right now.
Of course puking fuel over a month of driving will be just as bad…..

thank you folks!
BTW: Merry Christmas
 

corerftech

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Just curious, since the mass air sensor was throwing enormous voltages for Lord Knows how many miles in hands of prior owner and the exhaust system clearly shows nearly pure soot flowing from exhaust (before repairs)….. is it possible the O2 sensor has failed due to contamination and is leading to potential further RICH operation??

I know nothing about O2 sensor robustness with heavy overfueling.

Not that I am walking away from the fuel pump/reg/injector potential…..
Just the bulk of the issues with this truck we’re induced by piss poor electrical work or manipulating E systems to be better according to BUBBa in MS.

I don’t know what kind of self diagnostics the O2 sensor has on EEC4 like the MAF tells you Over/Under volt, etc…… aside from a heater failure, can it fail to function in range and go undetected?
 

corerftech

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Update:
So loaner AZ junk sh?? Chinese Fuel Pressure Test kit didn’t work.
Wouldn’t activate shrader valve stem.

I found my stem leaking and replaced it. Once cap was removed and engine started I could see fuel bubbling from valve stem.
New stem corrected this but still tester failed to assist.

Pulled alternator, didn’t remove rail, installed new FPR because “what the hell”, AZ has been a debacle all day anyway.

Pulled the IAC to gain access to FPR, I’ll post a pic of IAC. It has huge amount of oil baked on, can’t be working well.

Replacing shortly (IAC).

Procured Innova test kit and will try again on FP test.

After FPR was replaced the Shrader valve test with a probe squirted a bit more robust but it sure as hell doesn’t have 35 psi behind it (engine off). IDK, maybe it does. Before the FPR install, same test was super weak.
There is a 2 year old Airtex Fuel Pump on good lines with a new filter installed.

Engine does what it’s supposed to but until I see a valid fuel pressure test I’ll not be happy.
 

corerftech

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Innova came through.
Then on 5th test, Innova filled with gas and that’s that!
we will call it a retail rental.
worked well for 5 minutes.

If the pump is fresh, I get 38 PSI no at KOEO, then after 15 seconds the pressure bleeds off down to 20 PSI pretty quick, I am assuming I have injector(s) that aren’t closing.
While running pressure drops to 30-35 psi at idle, whack the throttle and it runs to 35 psi while at RPM. I had alternator out and battery is probably at 11.5 volts under test (from FPR replacement).

nonetheless- after the engine is warm, shut off, 30-38 psi drops to 20, then dies pretty quickly.

I have a couple of videos but of course can’t attach them.

It appears I need some injectors.
I will be after late mode substitutes I can farm from the JunkYard! Certainly there is a late model substitute I can hunt for. I do have 50k mile old injectors from a 2001 5.0 available??? I think those are 19 Lb injectors??
Anyway—— take a look at the IAT before and after pics and the leak down videos.

KOEO, then power off and wait for leak


Below is the Running test as well.

 

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scotts90ranger

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From some recent experience I have at work an exhaust backfire at startup is going to be from a too rich situation (an intake backfire is too lean, but not too common at startup), if the pre cat O2 sensor is sooted up it could be suspect, burning the soot off with a propane torch could get it working again... you can test it with a digital volt meter, it should make up to a volt when working, the signal wires are the two that are different colors, the two that are the same color are the heater.

The soot/oil on the IAT probably aren't the best but I wouldn't worry about it too much, it'll just slow down the signal which isn't a quick response signal anyway...
 

corerftech

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Scott,

I believe the IAT foul is from the prior engine and its likely oil issues(engine is a JYD replacement) and Im sure the intake was swapped over w/o cleaning. Why bother, right???

There is no CAT on this truck.
Rare is it that in Memphis, a car still has a CAT remining since the heroin/meth/crack heads all need some "come up" daily.
This was a MS truck and CATS are just for recycling in Mississippi. Ford put it there for removal 'cause you can get some junk.... Ill shut up now.

I digress..... sorry it was a rough day in the Midsouth trying to get someone at a parts house to provide me with any of the following: an intelligible answer, a part, a piece of equipment and mostly........ actually show up for work.

So I expect the O2 sensor to look pretty much as bad as the IAT or worse.
And I am sure it is a replacement. Its too pretty on the outside.
The truck was 'RUN" for a year really rich in BUBBAS hands, per BUBBA.
 

scotts90ranger

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Oh, I understand, you've been through a lot and auto parts are a pain anymore between finding anything and getting a good part...

The intake air temp sensor is just a thermistor, changes resistance with temperature, not much to go wrong with them, I imagine the clean one should be fine, they're not near as fancy as an oxygen sensor that generates voltage...

I understand your persistence and stubbornness :), you might be going further than I would have but I'm there with ya sometimes... one of these days I'll dig into the Geo Tracker that's in my driveway in my way... it needs to get fixed then go away, although maybe now with prices high I should look at unloading it...
 

corerftech

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Frankentruck hit the road to the gas station yesterday for a fill up. NO windshield (just taped in place), but otherwise a complete ready to drive truck.

I got to get the engine up to full temp and ll was well, but a CEL came on and it was a CODE 33, EGR. Other than a CODE 33 which doesnt persist, i,e,. when truck has been run into the code, then the CEL is on till shutdown. A restart and slow drive, no CEL. But of course the code is in memory for reading.

The truck ran really great and above 2k rpm, hauls butt. It started to bobble a bit at part throttle but off idel performance was great. Its as loud as HELL with a 24 inch headpipe to a 22 inch "CHERRY BOMB $34.95 muffler" to a 2.5 inch turn down in front of the rear axle.
Frankentruck is a good name for it.

I digress....

So the CODE 33 can only come on after the car is at highway speeds and is a sign of EGR valve failure, EGR solenoid, or vacuum issues affecting the EGR solenoid working.

When I got the truck the RED/GREEN vac lines were damaged, I replaced with a great set from a JYD donor.
But the charcoal can 3/8 line was off the throttle body and a few other things. Those were remedied.
Also the green wire on the solenoid has pulled off if disturbed due to BUBBA helping make it better. That was tightened up and remedied as when its off, codes start flying!!

Now I have read some dissertation on EGR failure and with a code 33, if EGR died then the truck should run flawless and maybe better at highway speed with no EGR function. But I have a stumble that is intermittent and not coding (not ignition related I dont think, I have exorcised those demons out solidly). That stumble is at low rpm work and might be consistnet with a VAC leak. A VAC leak I guess is a great source of problems with EGR operation and a stumble and CODE 33 point more to a VAC leak.


Any input as to that line of thought (confidence inspiration)?

If I have energy today Ill get a bottel of water and try to find a VAC leak. I dont own a VAC gauge but it seems I may become one. Probably just as well anyway. Windshield gets installed today as well, God willing.
 

corerftech

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I firedhosed every possible surface, connection, hose end, thread, seam, gasket surface from EGR solenoid to vac tree, vac can, EGR INLET/OUTLET/CONTROL, manifolds (all), TB, IAC, head......... I cant find a leak. Shot with Brake Cleaner (highly flammable one) and absolutely no affect on engine. While running both cold and very warm, vac never left 19 inches and 20 inches at cold start. Thats from the manifold tree 3/8 test port. This engine makes 180/175/175/175 for compression. So my code 33 may be a defectve EGR valve (just the electronic part) or solenoid, I figured out how to test both with a mityvac and a DVM so I will try that this next weekend. I need to replace the MISSING EGR solenoid connector, BUBBA broke it and instaleld 1/4 inch BLADE terminals on the wires. Ill go to JYD and find a good used connector pigtail and ressurect it proper, like most everything else electrical has needed under the hood. Ill probably rob a replacement solenoid too. An EGR valve is unlikely as the engines will be gone by now.
 

corerftech

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12/30/21 was my last day at work for a few and I started early so I could run by salavage yard on way home before 5 PM.

My mission was to get a washer pump motor, an EGR solenoid, solenoid wire stub/connector, EGR valve and the EGR operation sensor.
Fortunately that was all that was left of the donor I have milked a few times. The head was gone but I did get all of the parts I was after. Plus I get to return half of them for credit now as they werent needed.

Today I had success in resolving the last code (33) EGR open sense failure. I can't believe how eye opening this little truck has been, I have learned MUCH about the EEC4 EFI system (due to diagnosis of ridiculous problems) and this one tops it off.

Diagnosis was not a plug n play affair today; a day off, low pressure to perform, I wanted to ascertain complete failure or operation of every aspect of the EGR system before writting off a solution.

I repaired a badly damaged (read: missing) connector to the EGR solenoid. I also found that there is a PTC auto reset circuit breaker/current limiter embedded in a sub-connector on the solenoid. On my truck, BUBBA most assuredly said < WTF? this is unnecessary and removed it, thereafter killing the harness connector too. Like literally EVERYTHING on the truck that had issue, it was SOLELY OWNER CREATED!
Without the PTC installed in front of the harness connector, you will run the risk of the 42 ohm coil shorting due to heat failure and taking out the DRIVER TRANSISTOR on the ECU. (See I been learning a bit 'bout the EFI system and finally got my head wrapped aroud a few things).
I am writting this as I couldnt find a complete diagnostic procedure that clearly explained HOW/WHERE/WHEN/WHY and I needed that.

I started by using a DVM to meter the raw solenoid. Its should be about 42 ohms DCR (I tested more than 1). If you ADD the PTC/circuit breaker module, that will take it to about 51-52 ohms. The solenoid is NOISELESS so when you do dry fire it with 12v, you will hear nothing. I COULDNT/DIDNT verify that 12v was enabled at the input from the ECU as it would have been a hassle and I was pretty sure that after harness connector repair, I would have not have to look at the ECU as the culpret. I made an assumption of a GOOD ECU and a GOOD harness output to solenoid (12v and a driver transistor switching a ground).

I installed the missing (from the JunkYard) PTC module on the OLD solenoid. I wired it by a remote starter switch to the battery positive and a jumper wire to the battery ground. So........ it was isolated from the truck completely except for external battery wiring. I used a MityVac to generate a vacuum signal and used a vac gauge to read output behavior. The EGR valve will fail/misbehave if it sees more than 5 inches of VAC hence the need for a regulator in the middle to prevent too much VAC signal. So the idea of the initial test of the solenoid is two fold, VAC switching and VAC level regulation.

First was regulation:
Pump MityVac to try to get 20 inches while it is hosed to the RED inlet side of regulator. You should not be able to get more than 5 inches and that will fall immediately. As I found when I performed test to the DONOR/NEW device, a VAC GAUGE hosed to the GREEN OUTPUT side while pumping should show a VERY MINUTE DEFLECTION of the gauge showing the regulator bouncing to control the VAC LEVEL. On my OLD unit, there was no bounce, it was as though nothing was connected. First red flag---- regulator stuck shut.

To reiterate: A Good regulator shoud show the most minute deflection of a vac gauge on the regulator output when its input is pumped down with a hand pump. If it shows MASSIVE VAC signal, its BAD (regulator died), if it shows ZERO deflection (like its disconnected completely), it is ALSO BAD (reg died).

Second test is switching while under VAC:
Keeping the same scenario wired and hosed- while pumping the MityVac, activate the solenoid with the remote starter button (add 12v to the solenoid however you choose). You should see the VAC GAUGE begin to pop a full 5 inches showing the REGULATOR controlling VAC level and the transfer of VAC to the GREEN OUTLET hose at a maximum of 5 inches. If you see more than 5 inches, reg is dead. If you see less than 5 inches, reg is dead or your doing it wrong. If you and a monkey both pump the vac like your life depends on it and you only get a max of 5 inches and then it drops down between pumps, ITS GOOD TO GO!!!

If in both tests the results are:
5 inch regulated with almost zero passage of vac signal to external vac gauge (the VAC GUAGE twitch I mentioned, far less than 1 inch) but NOT TOTALLY MOTIONLESS
...... and then elec activation showing passage of VAC signal at 5 inches max, then you have a good solenoid and the PTC module is still kosher too.


Aside from that testing (which was ultimately my issue), I tested the EGR valve itself with vacuum. On the 1990 EGR, the valve gate can be seen opening with naked eye through the vent ports in housing. If you add 5 inches of vac max with a manual vac pump, directly to the EGR vac inlet, you will see the VALVE GATE open slowly to max. When you release the VAC, you should see the VALVE GATE which had disappeared from view in the vent port, pop back to rest/closed, again visible to you. Of course that only proves the EGR GATE is opening and closing, not the viability of the Exhaust Gas flow to the manifold or the Verification Sensor operation when it is OPENED or CLOSED.

At the end, to simply cover all bases (since I had found a dead fault with the EGR solenoid regulator) I connected "everyone" in circuit, using the remote starter as the current source for the EGR solendoid activation and my MityVac as the VAC source.

So I fed VAC signal from pump via the RED hose on VAC tree (removed from VAC tree). I left both hoses attached to the installed solenoid. My starter switch wired to fire the solenoid. The GREEN HOSE still attached to the EGR valve.

While pressing starter switch, I pumped vac constantly, watched the GATE OPEN smoothly and then upon release of STARTER SWITCH, the GATE CLOSED immediately even when VAC signal was maintained.

A last test if I had not found the solenoid as the obvious dead part would have been the Activation Sensor (white plastic housing on the EGR valve with a 3 pin connector to harness). It should have 5v on a pin, GND on another and a signal out somewhere between 0 and 5VDC on a 3rd pin. I could have tested with KOEO for a 5V signal, for a GND and probed the 3rd line for 1v or less. I would have then had to add my MityVac while in KOEO to the RED solenoid vac line, triggered the solenoid with Remote Starter Switch, pumped until the EGR valve is all the way visibly open, then PROBED the SIGNAL WIRE TO BATTERY GROUND WITH DVM for a voltage from 3-5VDC (effectively: 0v, closed, 5v wide open). I would then have released teh VAC signal shutting the EGR gate, then PROBED again to ensure a solid migration from an effective ZERO to an effective HIGH state (3-5VDC). That would all be done with the EGR harness connected and all PROBING done with a piercing probe.

In the end:

I cleared code 33 and drove the car for 30 minutes to get wiper blades at the local parts house as rain is here for the weekend. No more CEL at SPEED when the ECU attempts to open EGR (that proves the Activation Sensor was not the issue, the EGR wasnt opening at all due to regulator failure)
Not a glitch, car ran as well or better than it ever has.

I STILL HAVE A BOBBLE at about 1700 rpm under load (under geared when torque is needed), like a miss, and I believe its all in the fuel injectors as its right at a transition point (like a carb) between primary and secondary.... I have injectors that leak into cylinders and who knows maybe they are clogged too and not flowing like they should. I maybe lean and thats what it sounds like at 1700. Get above that rpm or add more throttle and the truck absolutely hauls ass. Off idle you can let the clutch out with an uphill ahead of you (So under load), no throttle and in first gear it will climb the hill at idle speed. It is the EASIEST Ranger I have ever driven (from a manual trans perspective). Its like my 94.5 PowerStroke and its ZF5. It idles up hills. Does the same in reverse. Let clutch out smooth and the car will run down the street at idle (650 rpm).

Maybe this diagnostic will help save someone some cash rather than just go out and buy an EGR (then lose), but another part (then lose again) only to find out it was the obscure regulator, OR VICE VERSA.

Happy New Year.
 
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alwaysFlOoReD

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Thanks for the detailed fix.
 

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