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Why is twin I-beam the worst of independent suspensions?


Ive never had a problem with a t.i.b, in fact one reason id prefer a ranger no newer than ‘97 is I dont like what ford went to, not a fan of r&p steering either.
 
Strictly pavement SLA would be my choice if racing. TTB/TIB would be fine for a daily driver, and has been for decades.
I had a 96 F150 4x4 and then a 97 Expedition 4x4 literally back to back.

The Expedition handled "tighter"...as in more responsive.

Besides that the F150 was better in everyway. It rode better, (IMO) handled better, and i never had any front end issue besides a busted u joint at the knuckle.

The expedition ate ball joints, wheel bearings, would never stay in alingment unless i never left pavement...

I was not impressed.
 
Twin I beam/Traction beam suspension works fine if your alignment guy knows what he's doing and is ambitious enough to set it up properly. Tire rotation is important, too, just like on every other vehicle.
 
I thought explorers were rolling over because of the firestone tires
That was complete hogwash. the pressure spec was too low at 26 psi, in my opinion. We always used 32 psi to improve tire wear. The biggest problem was people who had their vehicles "serviced" by the likes of Jiffy Lube where the pressure didn't get checked and then drove them 6 months without ever checking the pressure themselves. Underinflated tires driving at high speed on the highway in hot summer weather, what could go wrong? We made a pile of money replacing Firestones, though.
 
One thing common I have found is the TTB handles well on pavement in my experience. My 1980 f150 handled great in the turns. The Bronco II I have now handled great in the turns also. But since I put hard plastic body bushings on it, it goes around a turn like its on rails. Handles very good.

There are a lot of bushings in the TTB system that have to be changed out every so often or it will turn into a beast to drive and keep in the road.
 
Ive always felt the escape should turn a tighter circle than it does. I always thought the firestone tire thing was bullshit, ive seen more goodyear tire failures than firestone. The whole tpms system is horseshit too, if you cant keep a check on your tire pressure than you shouldn’t be driving a car.
 
TIB was part of why I bought my '97 Ranger... it had a bent beam and it scared the previous owner but to me I knew it was 6 bolts to change, did a tape measure alignment and put 45k miles on it...

Nothing against macphereson suspension (or did they go SLA for 4x2 Rangers? honestly never paid attention...), it's fine, but I wanted the rough road high speed characteristics of TIB... the billion inch wheelbase of an extended cab Ranger doesn't do it favors onroad in some situations but the cab room is worth it...

TIB/TTB is stupid simple, I've beat the heck out of my '00 Explorer with SLA and it does just fine with 31" tires and the giant sway bars it has, in fact it is very sporty and responsive, but the random mystery clunks in the front end I could live without, the front axle keeps leaking so apparently it has oil in it... one of these days in the next year or so it's getting a facelift with a TTB D44/D50 hybrid and a Sterling 10.25 out back with all the articulation mods for go fast purposes, hope to stay about 5" of lift and 36-37" tires...

In short, it really depends on what you are doing and who you talk to... everything has it's plusses and minuses...
 
Well I misread this topic completely. Can we talk about wheel geometry in suspensions? What's the goal? SLA (short top arm, long low arm) increases camber as the suspension raises. That seems backwards. The car leans out of a turn which increases camber, then the outer suspension compresses and increases it even more. Don't you want the wheel to be vertical at all times? Multi link gives a lot more control of wheel movement (can adjust angles when turning the wheel).
 
For best handling and even tire wear, SLA is superior to TIB, but TIB is a durable set up that handles well in normal driving conditions. If money was no object I would have put an aftermarket Mustang II front suspension under my Ranger but it handles well for the way I use it with the TIB and I won't change it. I go to the transfer station, the hardware store, the parts store, the machine shop, and Home Depot. It's perfectly stable when the speedometer needle is beyond 85 mph.
Some people were excited to get Michelins in exchange for their Firestones, about half came back and said their Explorer "rides better", the other half said it now handles sloppy, probably due to the soft sidewalls. Firestone ATX's usually lasted 50,000+ miles and the Goodyear RTS replacements were barely good for 30k and absolutely helpless in snow.
 
It isn't just camber that changes, alignment changes too.

We'll start with SLA:
The "rack" of the SLA steering puts the inner tie rod ends - more/less in offset of the inner suspension pivot points as the outer tie rod end are to the outer pivot points. So, if you put the truck up on jack stands and raise/lower the wheel, it always remains more/less pointed the same direction.​
In the 4wds, the CV axles are also more/less the same length from CV joint to CV joint as inner suspension pivot to knuckle, so there needs to be very little axle movement over suspension travel. As there is very little movement and the design of the one CV joint easily accommodates the movement, the suspension operate very smoothly which allows soft shocks = cushy ride.​
And as you note, due to the lower arm being longer, the camber increases when compressed, keeping the heavily loaded outside tire perpendicular to road surface. That the lightly loaded inner wheel isn't perpendicular doesn't matter a much as it isn't doing as much.​
An ideal TIB/TTB:
Would have an "idler" pitman arm on the passenger's frame rail and a cross member connecting the steering (driver's side) pitman arm to the idler one. This would allow a tie rod from the idler pitman to driver's side knuckle to be more/less identical in length to the driver's side axle.* Driver's side tie rod to passenger's side knuckle is already more/less identical in length to the passenger's side axle. Done this way, the wheels stay more/less pointed in the same direction through entire travel.​
* You have to put a little "bow" in both tie rods so they don't try to occupy the same space (or some equivalent). As the tie rods would no longer straight, they need to be slightly heavier duty so they don't "bow" a little more when you don't want them to (i.e. when steering).​

But Ford didn't do that as is would have cost additional parts (a idler pitman arm, the crossmember, the frame mount and mounting bolts, etc.)
Instead, they mounted the driver's side tie rod in the middle of the passenger's tie rod. The result is the driver's tie rod is shorter than the driver's axle. This causes the driver's tire to toe-in as it moves up/down in relation to passenger's side. This can result in additional tire wear - effects of which can be minimized by regular tire rotation.​

TTB has additional disadvantage that it uses U-joints, not CV joints. This is especially bad on the passenger's drive axle. There is no way to make the passenger's drive shaft match the axle housing length - its going to be much shorter. As a result, in addition to moving in angle, the length of the shaft is changing. A u-joint and slip joint doesn't move real smooth. The result is chassis engineer needs to use stiffer shocks. The drawback to the stiffer shock is the axle doesn't react as quick to rapid changes in direct (tends to stay extended or compressed).​
The combination of suspension steering and suspension not reacting, causes unpredictable handling - not what you want when racing and/or emergency situations.​
On the street, total suspension travel really doesn't matter. But off road, the longer the suspension arm, the more suspension travel you can have. As TIB/TTB mounts to the opposite frame rail, you easily get double the suspension travel of SLA. So, something like desert racer would be much better off with TIB/TTB.

The Explorer tire issue was 80% Firestone's fault.
Between the design of the tire (10% lighter, wedge gage below minimums, the issues between management and union, etc)​

I had one of the Firestone tires fail (lucky for me, slow speed/side street, side summer day); it was very clear from the failure (I went back and cleaned up the failed tire pieces) that the tread had separated from the belt. Tire wasn't flat, just had no tread, steel on asphalt isn't as good as rubber on road.

I replaced the tires with a set of the same as they were the cheapest tires on the rack - which says something as well. A year later, Ford replaced them with a set of Goodyears at no cost.

A couple years earlier, 235/75R15s would have been considered F150 tires and an F150 has much higher GVWR than Explorer.

Our Explorer was never driven 80mph, was never loaded that heavy, didn't tow up to that point. I am anal about maintaining tire pressure (actually my Ranger often runs 26 psi in rear tires as it is rarely loaded, and centers wear out if inflated to spec. On other hand, if I am going to load the truck, I will inflate the rears to spec - or maybe above). But yes, driving fast, you should increase tire inflation.

But the media drove the nail in the coffin - like Corvair and Pinto. A drunk personality rolling an Explorer and it was a Federal case.
 
The Ford Twin I-Beam suspension is essentially a heavy swing-arm design with the pivots mounted outboard instead of in the center of the vehicle as some small sports cars had for rear suspensions years ago. On the small cars the swing arms could cause a wheel to try to tuck under the car during hard cornering, possibly causing loss of control or component failure. The outboard pivots on the Ford trucks helped prevent tuck-under.

The Ford TIB is very rugged and gave an independent front suspension that was good for the time it was first introduced. These are the biggest problems:
1. The suspension beams are very heavy and there is a lot of undesirable unsprung weight.
2. The engine had to be raised because the beams ran under it, which raised the center of gravity of the vehicle. Not good. Ford was able to lower the engine and center of gravity after switching to more conventional suspension designs. Note that every Ford truck that had TIB, including the Econoline vans, switched over just a few years in the late 1990s–early 2000s.
3. Radius arms running under the cab were necessary to locate the beams. This was essentially a 1920s throwback in some ways, and those radius arms had to be fairly heavy themselves.
4. The whole system, especially the radius arms, had rubber bushings that aged and deteriorated over time. Driving with bad bushings on those arms was dangerous. We had to get them replaced on a '72 F-100 we had years ago.
5. Some shops had difficulty aligning TIB trucks properly.

The whole Explorer and Firestone story was more complex than most remember today. Ford had dictated to Firestone the tire specs, which were grossly substandard for the vehicle, in addition to the underinflation. That's not to say Firestone's hands were clean. But Ford knew the Explorer was prone to rollover with the proper tire at the proper inflation, partly because of past experience with the Bronco II, so it played games with the tires to disguise the issue. The high center of gravity from the TIB front suspension was a contributing factor in the rollover problem in Bronco IIs and early Explorers, and those models also had weak roofs that would buckle or collapse if the worst happened. There are reasons Ford and Firestone were both held accountable for the results.

The Ranger did not have the same rollover problem as the Explorer because it didn't have so many passengers raising the center of gravity, and also because the suspension was designed for a pickup, not an SUV. The load characteristics are different between the two types of vehicles.

Edit to correct a word typed in error.
 
Last edited:
The Ford Twin I-Beam suspension is essentially a heavy swing-arm design with the pivots mounted outboard instead of in the center of the vehicle as some small sports cars had for rear suspensions years ago. On the small cars the swing arms could cause a wheel to try to tuck under the car during hard cornering, possibly causing loss of control or component failure. The outboard pivots on the Ford trucks helped prevent tuck-under.

The Ford TIB is very rugged and gave an independent front suspension that was good for the time it was first introduced. These are the biggest problems:
1. The suspension beams are very heavy and there is a lot of undesirable unsprung weight.
2. The engine had to be raised because the beams ran under it, which raised the center of gravity of the vehicle. Not good. Ford was able to lower the engine and center of gravity after switching to more conventional suspension designs. Note that every Ford truck that had TIB, including the Econoline vans, switched over just a few years in the late 1990s–early 2000s.
3. Radius arms running under the cab were necessary to locate the beams. This was essentially a 1920s throwback in some ways, and those radius arms had to be fairly heavy themselves.
4. The whole system, especially the radius arms, had rubber bushings that aged and deteriorated over time. Driving with bad bushings on those arms was dangerous. We had to get them replaced on a '72 F-100 we had years ago.
5. Some shops had difficulty aligning TIB trucks properly.

The whole Explorer and Firestone story was more complex than most remember today. Ford had dictated to Firestone the tire specs, which were grossly substandard for the vehicle, in addition to the underinflation. That's not to say Firestone's hands were clean. But Ford knew the Explorer was prone to rollover with the proper tire at the proper inflation, partly because of past experience with the Bronco II, so it played games with the tires to disguise the issue. The high center of gravity from the TIB front suspension was a contributing factor in the rollover problem in Bronco IIs and early Explorers, and those models also had weak roofs that would buckle or collapse if the worst happened. There are reasons Ford and Firestone were both held accountable for the results.

The Ranger did not have the same rollover problem as the Explorer because it didn't have so many passengers raising the center of gravity, and also because the suspension was designed for a pickup, not an SUV. The load characteristics are different between the two types of vehicles.

Edit to correct a word typed in error.
Actually Econolines ran I beams right up till they went out of production....i think the E450 cutaway is still in production and uses them, as does the 250/350 F series 2wd.

The radius arms are different but its still twin I beam,
 
Actually Econolines ran I beams right up till they went out of production....i think the E450 cutaway is still in production and uses them, as does the 250/350 F series 2wd.

The radius arms are different but its still twin I beam,
I’m pretty sure the F250/350 switched to a monobeam in 2017.
 
I’m pretty sure the F250/350 switched to a monobeam in 2017.


Fords website shows I beams for 250 and 350 2WD. Heavier duty and 4WD versions of the super duty get the Monobeam.


"
Independent twin I-beam (narrow front track) with coil springs, shock absorbers, stabilizer bar (F-250 and F-350 4x2) Mono beam (narrow front track) with coil springs, shock absorbers, stabilizer bar (F-250 and F-350 4x4), mono beam (wide front track) with coil springs, shock absorbers, stabilizer bar (F-450)
"
 

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