Another 2wd Extended Radius Arm Question

[Mutant Pony]

As I said, I put my build on hold. If I were building it I would figure it out.
I have tubular beams. They use the stock mounting location. I really can't wait to do this build because It will be a lot of fun.
I'm thinking, measure both beams (from pivot to radius arm hole) and average out the length and make the radius arms that length.

 

[Hardwareman]

That sounds like it would work for me I guess. I think I'll extend them about 10" then since I'll have considerable lift on the Ranger by the time I install the bent beams.

Can I have the "NEW" radius arms fabbed straight as opposed to that angle the stock ones have?

I guess it's going to be a trial and error here. The only thing that really concerns me is what Junkie was saying about the bushing end not going totally straight into the bracket.

I need some more pics to get a better idea. I guess I can show my welder the pictures and he can fab them from there.



Allen

 

[4x4junkie]

There are a few pics of my arm build on my BII Cardomain page (not sure if you seen those).

Can I have the "NEW" radius arms fabbed straight as opposed to that angle the stock ones have?

You asking about how they're swept inward? You'll need that so the tires clear when turned.

I'm not sure how well all that lift is gonna work out though (4" RC lift PLUS 4" modified beams? what are you going to use for coils?) Unless your steering angles are perfect right now, I would bet you'll need a bigger drop pitman arm to handle that.

Edit:
Harbor Freight Tools will have an angle gauge like that.
As for where to measure, I would maybe try sticking it on the front of the beam just inside the knuckle, and see what it says. Then keep it at that measurement when you build the arms.
Yes, the beams should be at "ride height" when taking the measurement.


Hope that helps.

 

[Hardwareman]

Yes that helps A LOT.

Well right now with the 4" RC lift and 6" SJ coils it's perfectly aligned. It's been done at the same shop now for about 4-5 years by the same technician that also owns a TTB Ranger. He no longer works there and they won't tell me where he went so I'll have to find someone else again.

According to the AutoFab website the bent beams cause no ill effects on alignment and say they don't offer a dropped pitman arm because "frankly" it's just not needed with their 4" bent beam lift kit.

So it seems logical (to me anyways) that if my Ranger is fine now, then installing the bent beams would be the same as if my Ranger was stock and I was installing them. You know? I will have the brake line issue, but that's an easy fix.

As far as coils, I was just going to see how long of ones I could find at summit, SkyJacker or something. I was thinking I could probably get away with some 8" ones (and spacers if needed).

It seems my total lift with everything installed should be in the neighborhood of 8 or 9 inches.

This is the link:http://www.autofab.com/econo2wd.htm

If you can verify this information for me I'd be grateful, then you can align it for me when I'm done....lol



Allen

 

[canyoncritter]

drop brackets and bent beams is going to give you some NASTY camber at bump and drop. not to mention some crazy toe change. But I guess if your just after the "lift"


if you run autofabs 4inch bent beam kits by them selves, you dont need a droped pit man arm at 4inches of lift.

most 2wd perfomance kits run betweeen 7-10o of caster at ride height.

you may like to look around the desert truck sites to get ideals on radius arms and mount locations. better than I can explain.

 

[Hardwareman]

Yeah, it's a pavement pounder. It's 2wd and my work truck. I'm just after a little more lift to fit some 35's. I like the way Rangers look with that size tire. How could I safely lift it to that height then? Thanks

EDIT: Yeah, I've been looking over at DezertRangers.com but most of their stuff is like 6 inch extended beams, which IS NOT what I'm looking for. Plus all those guys are into fiberglass and full out desert racing, jumping, etc. and are not street legal or are pushing being street legal.


Allen

 

[canyoncritter]

there is still some good info over there and other desert sites on building radius arms.Affects of outside the frame rail vs under vs inside.same with lenths and such.

I'll try and find some of the threads for you.Just alot of b/s to weed threw sometimes on a few of those boards.like most boards.

if you look up the name gregG over there you may have good luck finding the threads Im talking about.


for a "lifted street queen" I can see how in theory you could bump and strap the front so keep from riding on the side walls and making.

not to be a nay Sayer but I just think your going to end up with some kind of messed up steering,not to say it cant be drive able but may be a chore.
Autofab is the only shop Im aware of that offers the bent beam kits that has no need for a dropped pitman arm.Leads me to believe he has a few odd tricks in to those beams to work the way they do with no pitman arm with the stock brackets.

So dont be surprised if the steering doesn't "stack" in to place.

 

[Hardwareman]

Well that's why I was "thinking" why would'nt they work if "right now" I'm good you know?

Just seems like I'm going after 4" more of lift on a truck that's already lifted and steering correctly. IF there's no need for a dropped pitman with their beams then in theory it sounds like I should be ok.

I'm not going after a long travel kit.............AND I'm using stock beams now with my drop brackets, which "in essence" is what AutoFab has, except they're slightly tweaked to produce the 4" of lift.

You may be right but do you get what I'm saying/asking? Thanks.




Allen

 

[4x4junkie]

Bent beams on drop brackets isn't going to affect how the camber reacts, that's purely a function of the wheel travel amount (and length of the beams).

The big thing IS going to be your steering.
Unless the drop amount of the pitman arm on your RC lift EXACTLY matches the height your lift is tall, things will not react the same as when the beams are on an otherwise stock truck (just because it seems to drive fine now, doesn't mean it can't be off by an inch or two, which could end up compounding things when you put the beams in).


With modified beams, things actually change a bit. It's no longer sufficient to simply just say the steering linkage should be flat horizontal (or set at the same height as the beam pivots) for proper geometry. Instead you need to focus on the tierod being directly in front of (and parallel as viewed from front) to a straight line from the beam pivot to the TRE at the knuckle.

This means a drop pitman arm should still be used with modded beams, even with stock pivots (I don't care what Autofab says). The steering will no longer move in phase with the beams if it's not, due to the altered ride height.
This is NOT to say the steering won't be acceptable without the drop arm, it's just not as good as it would be with one (most notably, less toe-in at droop).

Hopefully that makes sense... it's roughly half of the height amount the beams are modded for that the steering needs to be dropped down.


Have you though about just adding a bodylift on it?

 

[Hardwareman]

Yeah, I thought about a body lift but I don't want to deal with the little things involved, like radiator shroud, wiring, shift lever and body gap covers and whatever else is going to come along.

I've always had the mentality of "if you're going to lift your truck lift it right"!

When I was younger I used to hang out with the "older" crowd and everyone used to have fullsize rigs, 4 wheel drive and suspension lifts only.

Call me what you like, but that's how I like it. Sorry.




Allen

 

[4x4junkie]

Lol, it's actually wrong to think that using a bodylift is "wrong"... They DO have their place.

The shroud is dirt-simple, probably wouldn't take more than 30 mins. to drop it down using two pieces of sheetmetal.
Nothing needs to be done with wiring (at least nothing had to be on my BII), just make sure nothing gets pulled tight (reposition it if needed).
The kit should come with a shift lever extension.
The frame gap is really the only thing you'd have to live with (you could put some black rubber lawn edging or something int here to help cover it).

I've found people who bash on bodylifts rarely ever make mention of the fact a bodylift makes it SSOOOO much easier to work on the truck (pulling a transmission, t-case, etc.), and that the lift it adds is without any further suspension (steering) headaches (such as what were discussing here).

 

[Hardwareman]

Sorry, did'nt see you posted this.

I guess you're right about the shroud, a couple pieces of metal brackets would probalby take care of that. What about the gas filler neck though?

I would probably only want to go about 2" of body lift though and not the 3".



Allen

 

[Sasquatch_Ryda]

I didn't have to extend the filler neck on mine, i just loosed on off the clamp and slid the metal part of the filler up out of the hose as much as i could safely go and it was long enough.

 

[Hardwareman]

Ok, thanks Sasquatch_Ryda,

That's pretty much all I have to worry about with a body lift if I go that route right? The shifter, fan shroud, and filler neck?

Of course the bumper brackets, wiring, and body gap fillers.



Allen

 

[Dangeranger3]

The wiring is one thing that makes me not want to do it. That and the steering extension.