son of a bishop -- seized compressor

[MAKG]

Well, my compressor died on the highway in the middle of nowhere yesterday. I noticed a burning smell (though, remarkably, astonishingly little noise -- just a very subtle rubbing sound). So I pulled over, and saw acrid black smoke coming from under the hood. Turned off the A/C and it stopped.

The compressor hub was completely seized, and the belt was slipping. So, I need a compressor, maybe a condenser (Ford black death), massive flush, drier, orifice tube, and of course a serpentine belt. Is it necessary to replace the compressor lines due to the integral filter? I'd think so.

I use A/C almost continuously all year to dessicate the air. Now, the compressor is unplugged so I can use the now-emasculated defogger (it's better than nothing).

I'm a bit stunned that that slipping serpentine belt didn't squeal like a stuck pig. I wouldn't have known there was a problem except for the smell. At least the belt didn't break; not having a water pump more than 25 miles from the nearest town would have been a bit of a problem.

This is the 4.0L Exploder.

[skippy]

aside from the expense for parts,we know you can do the work.never happens in the driveway does it?ouch.good luck and happy wrenching.

[Ranger44]

Are you looking to pick up a used compressor or new? Got a good, but used one off a 2.3 Ranger. I'd think they were the same as one for a 4.0. Let me know. Thanks

[skippy]

Well, my compressor died on the highway in the middle of nowhere yesterday. I noticed a burning smell (though, remarkably, astonishingly little noise -- just a very subtle rubbing sound). So I pulled over, and saw acrid black smoke coming from under the hood. Turned off the A/C and it stopped.

The compressor hub was completely seized, and the belt was slipping. So, I need a compressor, maybe a condenser (Ford black death), massive flush, drier, orifice tube, and of course a serpentine belt. Is it necessary to replace the compressor lines due to the integral filter? I'd think so.

I use A/C almost continuously all year to dessicate the air. Now, the compressor is unplugged so I can use the now-emasculated defogger (it's better than nothing).

I'm a bit stunned that that slipping serpentine belt didn't squeal like a stuck pig. I wouldn't have known there was a problem except for the smell. At least the belt didn't break; not having a water pump more than 25 miles from the nearest town would have been a bit of a problem.

This is the 4.0L Exploder.

i recommend reading the sticky by some guy named makg,might help you out.

[MAKG]

Are you looking to pick up a used compressor or new? Got a good, but used one off a 2.3 Ranger. I'd think they were the same as one for a 4.0. Let me know. Thanks

It looks like the store I bought it from is going to warranty it.

[shadetree]

The compressor siezed on my F150 about 3 years ago. It was working when I stopped the truck, and when I turned it back on again, it wouldn't turn. I replaced the compressor only, and it has worked fine since. A/c tech said black death usually gives other symptoms over a period of time. shady

[Ranger44]

It looks like the store I bought it from is going to warranty it.

Glad to hear that MAKG.

[Bob Ayers]

It looks like the store I bought it from is going to warranty it.

Wonderful news!!!

[MAKG]

I have to admit, this is why I buy parts from these guys.

It's in (ready for pickup), and they DID warranty it. I'm going to have a shop recover the remaining refrigerant and flush it. The jury is still out on whether I need a condenser or compressor lines; we'll see what the flush comes out with.

It appears the repair will be less than $100 for the flush (labor and flush fluid), and parts will be around $60, counting the refrigerant. As usual, replacing the accumulator/drier, and orifice tube. I have all the equipment to charge R-134a, and I'm perfectly willing to let the vacuum pump suck for hours.

Shady, what other symptoms?

[shadetree]

Shady, what other symptoms?
Intermittent cooling. Slowly loses the ability to cool similar to a loss of refrigerant. Evaporator freezing were a few he mentioned. shady

[MAKG]

Hmm, I've been running the defogger, so I doubt I'd notice intermittent cooling. The defogger seems a LITTLE worse than it used to be, but that's really easy to fool oneself with. And those symptoms sound like a plugged orifice tube. If that's what's going on, pulling the orifice tube ought to make it really obvious, right?

The static (engine off) low side pressure is just under 40 PSI. This thing is fully charged. Since the compressor is seized, I can't measure it running like I'm supposed to.

It's going to be flushed Friday; I'll ask for the orifice tube and whatever goop comes out with it in a baggie.

The A/C tech says they can "usually" flush parallel-flow condensers like the aftermarket one I have. I find that a bit hard to believe. Does your A/C tech concur? Thanks a bunch.

[skippy]

I have to admit, this is why I buy parts from these guys.

It's in (ready for pickup), and they DID warranty it. I'm going to have a shop recover the remaining refrigerant and flush it. The jury is still out on whether I need a condenser or compressor lines; we'll see what the flush comes out with.

It appears the repair will be less than $100 for the flush (labor and flush fluid), and parts will be around $60, counting the refrigerant. As usual, replacing the accumulator/drier, and orifice tube. I have all the equipment to charge R-134a, and I'm perfectly willing to let the vacuum pump suck for hours.

Shady, what other symptoms?

if you have a thermister micron guage and the time,let the vacuum pump pull on it overnight.shoot for 100 microns or lower.

[MAKG]

My gauge isn't nearly that good -- it's just the vacuum side of my manifold gauge set, and I'm lucky to read down to 0.5 inches. But I do have the time, as long as the weather is decent.

The vacuum pump is a dinky converted R-12 Robinair, but it serves. Got it used for $30....

[skippy]

your vacuum pump should be ok,vehicles are small systems.micron gauge is a separate device w/hose that attaches to another available port and reads in microns.i pressure test w/dry nitrogen and soap bubbles for system tightness then blow nitrogen if ok,evacuate w/the pump.i let the pump pull for 15 minutes,then break the vacuum w/nitrogen to 0 psi,vacuum for 15 min,break w/nitrogen to 0 again,then let the pump run all nite.used to break w/refrigerant but it is illegal now.helps clear any pockets of air or non condensibles.micron guages range from about $100 to bend over,and are nice to have but your not dealing w/a $100,000 water chiller there.anyway good luck.

[skippy]

ps,change vacuum pump oil after each use.meaning when you complete the job,before you put the pump away.

[MAKG]

OK, now I'm pissed.

The parts store is not a problem. The shop is.

They claimed it takes an hour EACH to recover refrigerant, flush the system, and remove the orifice tube. Bull freakin s**t. Especially the last one (a proper flush has the orifice tube already removed, so the additional effort is ZERO). So I told them where to stick it. As for an hour to recover refrigerant, well maybe if they are evacuating for a recharge, but my estimate is barely over 15 minutes.

Of course on Monday when I made my appointment, they said an hour. It's Friday at 8AM (after I've dropped the vehicle off, of course) that it changes to 3 hours.

So, I lost a week. I'll have to shop around next week.

For $300, I can buy all new parts and skip the flush entirely.

[skippy]

fixed yet?

[RobbieD]

Well, you did the right thing walking away from the first shop. Good luck on finding an alternate.

[DesertStorm]

just by the $40 bypass pulley kit, then use the 2-55 a/c. I have used no a/c in 106F weather, I am still here to write about it. That is 106F with 90% humidity down here in the south, not in the desert. Notbad at all.

[MAKG]

Not just no, hell no.

I'll junk the truck and buy another before I start disabling equipment. The defogger is really pissing me off.

And FYI, you don't need a bypass kit to disable A/C. It works like that RIGHT NOW with the compressor unplugged.

[mhughes165]

OK, now I'm pissed.

The parts store is not a problem. The shop is.

They claimed it takes an hour EACH to recover refrigerant, flush the system, and remove the orifice tube. Bull freakin s**t. Especially the last one (a proper flush has the orifice tube already removed, so the additional effort is ZERO). So I told them where to stick it. As for an hour to recover refrigerant, well maybe if they are evacuating for a recharge, but my estimate is barely over 15 minutes.

Of course on Monday when I made my appointment, they said an hour. It's Friday at 8AM (after I've dropped the vehicle off, of course) that it changes to 3 hours.

So, I lost a week. I'll have to shop around next week.

For $300, I can buy all new parts and skip the flush entirely.
for what my opinion is worth to you, i would suggest replacing the lines if they are on the older side(ie original), and for the money vs a shop doing the work just buy all new parts and get the job done yourself, then atleast u know that u really did everything and not have a shop SAY they did everything.

[MAKG]

I've certainly thought about that.

And if I can find the time to deal with it, that's a likely possibility. $300 isn't THAT expensive an A/C repair.

Especially since I can't get a straight answer (that I can take seriously) from anyone about whether or not they can flush a parallel-flow condenser. It doesn't look easy to me. The only unequivocable answer came from a guy who also claimed the orifice tube protected it from any of the compressor debris.

As for trusting the shop, I routinely inspect shop work (it's saved my butt a few times, like when an alignment shop left the tie rod adjusters loose, and a "rebuilt" mail order head that came back severely bellmouthed, with a very quick one-angle valve job, and with no shims). I can blow a little brake cleaner into each component and see what comes out.

FYI, the only original A/C parts on this truck are the liquid line and the pressure switch. The evaporator, condenser, and compressor line assembly have all sprouted leaks at one time or another.

[mhughes165]

if you cant get a stright answer from a shop then id just bide your time until u have the time todo it yourself, luckily enough it is winter and it isnt too hot in cali right now (i lived in antelope outside of sacremento for 5 years) and im certain you will save money by not letting the shop touch the truck on this one.

[MAKG]

Well, I use A/C year round, for much more than just cooling. It's a very good dessicator, and where I live is considerably wetter than Antelope Valley. We got 30 inches in January, and the driveway probably won't be dry until April.

But now I'm sidetracked. I spotted an FN field mouse in the 'sploder yesterday. I suspect it got in through the outside-air door, as the blower motor is making sounds as though something is in it.

[mhughes165]

have fun with that mouse, u know if theres one theres got to be a few more. i never quite figured out a good way to keep them out entirely as one day i was drivin my truck and one peaked at me through one of the dash vents.....needless to say i was slightly perturbed and tore the entire dash out, they all got away but i still dont know how to make sure they never get it again

[skippy]

about that mouse,catch and release or summary execution?that mouse have a prayer?

[DesertStorm]

Not just no, hell no.

I'll junk the truck and buy another before I start disabling equipment. The defogger is really pissing me off.

And FYI, you don't need a bypass kit to disable A/C. It works like that RIGHT NOW with the compressor unplugged.

Sure makes changing the plugs a helluvalot easier to get to. And the bypass pulley looks soooo trick. Heat will defrost just fine. No need to de-humid the air too, ure just wasting gas doing that. I hate a/c on a truck. It is the first thing I hack away at. You get a lot better cooling capacity without the condenser restricting airflow to the radiator. I love my 4oh better than my own comfort.:tease:

[DesertStorm]

But seriously, to flush the condenser go to an commercial a/c supply house and get some stuff called SUPCO88. It is an oil additive that removes all gunk from the system. It takes care of acid formations, sludge and all that other nasty stuff. If you dont change the condenser, run this through and change the oil in the compressor after about 50-75 hours of run time.

[skippy]

But seriously, to flush the condenser go to an commercial a/c supply house and get some stuff called SUPCO88. It is an oil additive that removes all gunk from the system. It takes care of acid formations, sludge and all that other nasty stuff. If you dont change the condenser, run this through and change the oil in the compressor after about 50-75 hours of run time.

if mike experienced a burn out,and runs the supco 88 or acid away it will put all the gunk in the drier,and he'll have to change the drier too,not just the oil.sorry mike,i vote for complete replacement of all components.only way to buy complete peace of mind.i too run year round on defrost w/a/c in work truck,it's more comfortable to me.

[thegoat4]

If it were mine I'd spring for a new core. There's no way to effectively flush a parallel-flow core without removing the ends and flushing each path by itself. To check the core for crap, pour some solvent in it, let it sit for a few minutes, shake, then dump it through a coffee filter. If you find anything signifigant, the core is condemned.

The orifice tube will only catch stuff after it passes through the condenser core, which means you can still get a good amount of timebomb material wedged into the crevices. If a chunk of that stuff lets go all at once, that teensy little screen on the orifice tube will either get plugged up right away, requiring more AC repairs, or burst, letting metal circulate through the shiny new compressor, requiring lots more AC repairs.

[MAKG]

about that mouse,catch and release or summary execution?that mouse have a prayer?

Well, when I first spotted it, it was at a gas station on the way to preschool, several miles from home. I saw it run under the front passenger seat, opened both passenger doors, and went at it from behind with a squeegee. It might have run out the other door (this was the idea), but I didn't see it.

Now, there is a trap under each front seat. Neither has tripped.

I live in the forest. There are a bazillion small rodents here; they won't miss one. So, I have no qualms about its life or death. If I did manage to chase it out, the neighbor's cat would just eat it anyway.

[skippy]

Well, when I first spotted it, it was at a gas station on the way to preschool, several miles from home. I saw it run under the front passenger seat, opened both passenger doors, and went at it from behind with a squeegee. It might have run out the other door (this was the idea), but I didn't see it.

Now, there is a trap under each front seat. Neither has tripped.

I live in the forest. There are a bazillion small rodents here; they won't miss one. So, I have no qualms about its life or death. If I did manage to chase it out, the neighbor's cat would just eat it anyway.

ok,hopefully this won't upset the eco balance in your region,lol.good luck.

[MAKG]

if mike experienced a burn out,and runs the supco 88 or acid away it will put all the gunk in the drier,and he'll have to change the drier too,not just the oil.sorry mike,i vote for complete replacement of all components.only way to buy complete peace of mind.i too run year round on defrost w/a/c in work truck,it's more comfortable to me.

FYI, I did this last weekend. Complete replacement, cost around $350 including refrigerant, PAG oil, serpentine belt, and a gallon of propylene glycol. I sure am better now with that #@$% evap housing.

It's cold and quiet now. Just in time for tomorrow's trip to the desert. And the vacuum (low side) gauge pegged at 30 in. Hg for more than 3 hours. :D

And my son thought it was C O O L to watch Daddy drain the "green oil" from the radiator (he's seen an oil change; that's what he called it). Though to be honest, he's a bit more interested in brake inspections.