where do I start?

[jaymegriffiths]

OK. Im lookin to start my 302 buildup to put in my ranger, and Id like to ask the opinion of TRS members on the best qualities to look for in a donor 302. do I look for a truck, go the beefy route and watch out for a c6-302 combo to snatch up? Or do i Go the fast route and hunt for a mustang? Being currently a standard, do i stay standard or keep it easy and go auto? maybe find a crown vic or equivalent car with fuel injection, maybe spend the extra time, make it more fuel efficient? although being a somewhat junior mechanic I think fuel injection may complicate things more than I'd like.

 

[baddad457]

Read the stickies posted above. Then read them again.

 

[Mac]

Read the stickies posted above. Then read them again.

Getting kind of tired of answering the same old questions time and again? Take two six packs and call me in the morning, good advice.
Dave

 

[jaymegriffiths]

OK! haha sorry to be a pain in the butt! never even realized what those were! they gave lotsa info butt not a lot about tranny's. last question would a c4 be suitable for 350-375 horsepower?

 

[baddad457]

OK! haha sorry to be a pain in the butt! never even realized what those were! they gave lotsa info butt not a lot about tranny's. last question would a c4 be suitable for 350-375 horsepower?

Yes, but not in stock form.

 

[baddad457]

Getting kind of tired of answering the same old questions time and again? Take two six packs and call me in the morning, good advice.
Dave

The reason I answer the questions that the newbies give time and time again is by not willing to do the research, they're also not willing to do what's neccessary to complete a swap. Nothing worse than seeing your neighbor's kid's vehicle in the garage disassembled for years at a time before it's hauled off to the junkyard, all because they bit off more than they could chew. Forcing them at the start to do the legwork, gives them the future tools needed in completing a swap.

 

[jaymegriffiths]

The reason I answer the questions that the newbies give time and time again is by not willing to do the research, they're also not willing to do what's neccessary to complete a swap. Nothing worse than seeing your neighbor's kid's vehicle in the garage disassembled for years at a time before it's hauled off to the junkyard, all because they bit off more than they could chew. Forcing them at the start to do the legwork, gives them the future tools needed in completing a swap.

Just curious, where did you learn all you know about cars? I'm willing to bet a large portion came from ripping stuff apart and learning how to put it back together! I'm Not worried about getting this done today or this month or this year, I'd just like to start learning HOW to do it. startin with finding the right block. K so now i read the good portion of that sticky info which was awesome might i add, but i have a question. it mentioned certain 302 blocks being better foundations to build then some. how can one identify the better block to start with? Also It was mentioned that a c4 when properly built can be a stout transmission to use in a street drivin decently high powered (for a ranger) v8? how can i tell if its a c4 or not? K so I'll do some homework but If you happen to know feel free to save me the time! THX

 

[baddad457]

Just curious, where did you learn all you know about cars? I'm willing to bet a large portion came from ripping stuff apart and learning how to put it back together! I'm Not worried about getting this done today or this month or this year, I'd just like to start learning HOW to do it. startin with finding the right block. K so now i read the good portion of that sticky info which was awesome might i add, but i have a question. it mentioned certain 302 blocks being better foundations to build then some. how can one identify the better block to start with? Also It was mentioned that a c4 when properly built can be a stout transmission to use in a street drivin decently high powered (for a ranger) v8? how can i tell if its a c4 or not? K so I'll do some homework but If you happen to know feel free to save me the time! THX

Ford blocks and all other parts have engineering numbers cast or stamped into them (depends on the mfg technique used to make the part) This number is located in the lower rear of the block near the starter.(here's one example: C9OE-6015-A) Roller blocks have it cast here, but in a different location than the flat tappet blocks(and will just have the prefix: E6SE, F1SE, E7TE). Just me, but a roller block is the only way to fly, unless you're going all out racing, then the older flat tappet blocks seem to have a better reputation as to strength, these are the late 60's to early 70's blocks, with one exception, the late 70's D8VE block, this one's thick all over like the Mexican block (late 60's to early 70's castings made in Mexico) With the roller blocks, the only one to fight shy of is the 85 castings,starting in 1986, Ford added more iron to the block with the E6SE castings. All others since have the extra iron. As for Id'ing a C-4, these had removeable bellhousings and all three main castings (bell, case and tailhousing) are aluminum. This is the only Ford auto trans with these features. You can also help yourself more by buying all the Ford motor manuals and read more. I learned from these manuals combined with tearing down many motors and building a few more.

 

[Mac]

Most people just learn by doing, asking the right questions and learning all they can. I've got two books on restoring the older Mustangs for good reference in the part numbers and pictures they have. Got another one that is just an interchange manual. Couple sets of Ford shop manuals, maybe seven wiring manuals.
Really trying to stay organized with all the parts as you disassemble them, label and take pictures.
The only time you really should concern yourself in the strenght of the block if you are want some big power levels, otherwise, any one will do. In todays world, just find one in the best shape, fewest miles, that or just buy a rebuilt short block as a starting point.
The C-4 can sure be built to take some power, haven't looked at the prices lately. For a mild build, they were even used behind some 351 CI motors.
Kind of set a HP gole and work from there. Power gets expensive. Wants and needs are different.
Dave - Sometimes waking up on the wrong side of the world.

 

[jaymegriffiths]

Most people just learn by doing, asking the right questions and learning all they can. I've got two books on restoring the older Mustangs for good reference in the part numbers and pictures they have. Got another one that is just an interchange manual. Couple sets of Ford shop manuals, maybe seven wiring manuals.
Really trying to stay organized with all the parts as you disassemble them, label and take pictures.
The only time you really should concern yourself in the strenght of the block if you are want some big power levels, otherwise, any one will do. In todays world, just find one in the best shape, fewest miles, that or just buy a rebuilt short block as a starting point.
The C-4 can sure be built to take some power, haven't looked at the prices lately. For a mild build, they were even used behind some 351 CI motors.
Kind of set a HP gole and work from there. Power gets expensive. Wants and needs are different.
Dave - Sometimes waking up on the wrong side of the world.

I'm looking for 350-400. not insane but more than mild... I will probably settle for less say, 325 or so if i have to cause i dont wanna go to a c6. c4's are just to easy to find for that. And I would assume aftermarket parts are readily available.

 

[doorgunner]

i wus thinkin .......... maybe you guys with all the experience......rather than typing your fingers off to help some of us SNM people could have instant replies somewhere in ur computer and just paste em in a reply when you felt the newbie deserved an answer....

Or, I could just shut up and read the Si...Stickeys.......

 

[jaymegriffiths]

Ford blocks and all other parts have engineering numbers cast or stamped into them (depends on the mfg technique used to make the part) This number is located in the lower rear of the block near the starter.(here's one example: C9OE-6015-A) Roller blocks have it cast here, but in a different location than the flat tappet blocks(and will just have the prefix: E6SE, F1SE, E7TE). Just me, but a roller block is the only way to fly, unless you're going all out racing, then the older flat tappet blocks seem to have a better reputation as to strength, these are the late 60's to early 70's blocks, with one exception, the late 70's D8VE block, this one's thick all over like the Mexican block (late 60's to early 70's castings made in Mexico) With the roller blocks, the only one to fight shy of is the 85 castings,starting in 1986, Ford added more iron to the block with the E6SE castings. All others since have the extra iron. As for Id'ing a C-4, these had removeable bellhousings and all three main castings (bell, case and tailhousing) are aluminum. This is the only Ford auto trans with these features. You can also help yourself more by buying all the Ford motor manuals and read more. I learned from these manuals combined with tearing down many motors and building a few more.

Most people just learn by doing, asking the right questions and learning all they can. I've got two books on restoring the older Mustangs for good reference in the part numbers and pictures they have. Got another one that is just an interchange manual. Couple sets of Ford shop manuals, maybe seven wiring manuals.
Really trying to stay organized with all the parts as you disassemble them, label and take pictures.
The only time you really should concern yourself in the strenght of the block if you are want some big power levels, otherwise, any one will do. In todays world, just find one in the best shape, fewest miles, that or just buy a rebuilt short block as a starting point.
The C-4 can sure be built to take some power, haven't looked at the prices lately. For a mild build, they were even used behind some 351 CI motors.
Kind of set a HP gole and work from there. Power gets expensive. Wants and needs are different.
Dave - Sometimes waking up on the wrong side of the world.

ok. So look on the back of the block, near the starter for a roller block, with either E6SE, F1SE, or E7TE stamped in the block, as these are the prefix's that identify a roller cammed 302? and they are also post 86 to include the extra iron in the block?

 

[baddad457]

ok. So look on the back of the block, near the starter for a roller block, with either E6SE, F1SE, or E7TE stamped in the block, as these are the prefix's that identify a roller cammed 302? and they are also post 86 to include the extra iron in the block?

Those are some of the casting(engineering) numbers to look for in a roller(these are just the ones I can recall offhand), but any of the 86-up roller blocks have the extra iron. The E5AE block does not.

 

[baddad457]

i wus thinkin .......... maybe you guys with all the experience......rather than typing your fingers off to help some of us SNM people could have instant replies somewhere in ur computer and just paste em in a reply when you felt the newbie deserved an answer....

Or, I could just shut up and read the Si...Stickeys.......

I ain't that computer litterate

 

[AllanD]

350-400hp from a 5.0 and put it in a truck?

Let me explain basic physics.

There are very few engine mods that increase torque materially...
An increase in torque of greater than 20% over stock is ASTOUNDING
without forced induction, so MOST engine mods that make more power
(400hp is nearly DOUBLE that of a 5.0HO) be defination make the same
(or less) torque than stock but produce it at a greatly increased rpm....
meaning you must spin the crap out of the engine to get it.

a 5.0HO already has to be spun to 3400rpm to make peak torque and
5200 to make peak power, IOW it's already "too revvy" to be real useful...

sure they are "fun" but an absolutely stock 5.0 isn't enough better than
a 4.0 offroad to justify the effort.

Look at the top sticky in the 4.0 forum to really understand what a 4.0 is all about....

What you want in a truck, particularly a 4x4 is torque at as low an rpm as you can manage.... to get that the easiest and most reliable way is displacement.

People who go to the effort of putting a 5.0 into a ranger missed the boat... they should have gone looking for a 5.8.

I don't really care (nor does reality) what mods someone makes to a 5.0 or how much power a 5.0 can make, ANY stock 5.8EFI engine will hand you your ass in 95% of offroad situations because the 5.8 has something that a 5.0 by definition can never have... (short of a 100lb bottle of Nitrous) bottom end torque.

Yeah, you can make a 5.0 into a 347 or so by stroking it, but they make stroker
cranks for 5.8's too... and they don't cost any more for a 5.8 than a 5.0.

Cubes win.

As for the "Stong" 5.0 blocks vs the weaker 5.0 blocks?

the 5.0 block was lightened repeatedly because weight was critical in the passenger cas into which it was being installed.

the 5.8 was never subjected to that... they are ALL "strong" blocks by
comparison to the 5.0.... saving 25lbs on an F-250 would have been a
rather stupid waste of engineering brain sweat.

Anyone wishing to disagree with what I've just written here should stop sniffing glue or "drinking the KoolAid" for atleast a week before posting a reply.

In my carefully considered opinion the best use for a 5.0 in a ranger is in a "go fast" 2wd street truck.

If you want it for "offroad" you really want a 5.8 instead.

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