What's causing this 2.3 Lima engine noise?

[outatime88]

I need help identifying the cause of a rapid clattering noise coming from my '97 2.3 (Lima). I finally found audio of another 2.3 Ranger making the EXACT same sound. Other Youtube comments in their video also ask what is causing it, but no answers. Because others have the same problem I'm thinking it must be something specific.

Other person's Ranger: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Xg2pd10ZaRo
My Ranger: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Ah9uMImMoOU

It started after changing the oil after a few months of owning the truck. I can hear it about 30 seconds after cold starting. Its worse when its colder outside. It goes away once I start driving for a few minutes. It also goes away when increasing RPM above idle. If I drive, while warm, and come to a stop and idle for a couple of minutes it comes back but the sound is less rapid. I thought it could be collapsed hydraulic lifters or maybe piston slap? I've tried thicker oil, Lucas stabilizer, Rislone engine treatment, but nothing seems to help. I've also used a stethoscope but its hard to zero in on where its coming from.

Does anyone know what it might be or had it before and was able to stop it?

 

[1990RangerinSK]

I need help identifying the cause of a rapid clattering noise coming from my '97 2.3 (Lima). I finally found audio of another 2.3 Ranger making the EXACT same sound. Other comments also ask what is causing it, but no answers. Because others have the same problem I'm thinking it must be something specific.

Other person's Ranger: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Xg2pd10ZaRo
My Ranger: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/GSIO_CbdeJM and ttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2OQZQnv0wk&ab_channel

It started after changing the oil after a few months of owning the truck. I can hear it about 30 seconds after cold starting. Its worse when its colder outside. It goes away once I start driving for a few minutes. It also goes away when increasing RPM above idle. If I drive, while warm, and come to a stop and idle for a couple of minutes it comes back but the sound is less rapid. I thought it could be collapsed hydraulic lifters or maybe piston slap? I've tried thicker oil, Lucas stabilizer, Rislone engine treatment, but nothing seems to help. I've also used a stethoscope but its hard to zero in on where its coming from.

Does anyone know what it might be or had it before and was able to stop it?

I would have suggested that it's lifter noise, but the Lima is an OHC engine, so it has no lifters. It COULD still be valve train noise. It sounds as though the top end of your engine isn't getting enough oil (normal for a few seconds at start-up, because oil tends to drain back down to the oil pan when you shut off the engine), and at low RPMs (not particularly normal).

Thicker oil will make low oil pressure WORSE. If that was my truck, I wouldn't drive it as it is. The repair is most likely going to be a new oil pump.

 

[outatime88]

I would have suggested that it's lifter noise, but the Lima is an OHC engine, so it has no lifters. It COULD still be valve train noise. It sounds as though the top end of your engine isn't getting enough oil (normal for a few seconds at start-up, because oil tends to drain back down to the oil pan when you shut off the engine), and at low RPMs (not particularly normal).

Thicker oil will make low oil pressure WORSE. If that was my truck, I wouldn't drive it as it is. The repair is most likely going to be a new oil pump.

Doesn't it essentially have hydraulic lifters/tappets/lash adjusters which can make noise if failing/collapsed?

Oil pressure is great, and the engine runs great. I thought the thicker oil would muffle the sound. It's temp based, it basically goes away when its warmed up.

 

[1990RangerinSK]

Doesn't it essentially have hydraulic lifters/tappets/lash adjusters which can make noise if failing/collapsed?

Oil pressure is great, and the engine runs great. I thought the thicker oil would muffle the sound. It's temp based, it basically goes away when its warmed up.

From what I understand an overhead cam engine has the valve stems ride directly on the cam lobes.

There could be any number of reasons that it goes away when the engine warms up:

• When oil warms up it flows better, because it's thinner.
• When you start your engine it takes a few seconds for the top end (where your camshaft and valves are) to be adequately lubricated (see my other post, where I mentioned oil draining back into the oil pan when you shut off the engine).
• Metal shrinks when it's cold, and expands when you heat it. This will cause the gaps between moving parts to change. Smaller gaps when hot, wider gaps when cold (and the wider gaps will cause noise)

Have you actually tested your oil pressure?

 

[outatime88]

From what I understand an overhead cam engine has the valve stems ride directly on the cam lobes.

There could be any number of reasons that it goes away when the engine warms up:

• When oil warms up it flows better, because it's thinner.
• When you start your engine it takes a few seconds for the top end (where your camshaft and valves are) to be adequately lubricated (see my other post, where I mentioned oil draining back into the oil pan when you shut off the engine).
• Metal shrinks when it's cold, and expands when you heat it. This will cause the gaps between moving parts to change. Smaller gaps when hot, wider gaps when cold (and the wider gaps will cause noise)

Have you actually tested your oil pressure?

No I should, I've just been looking at the oil pressure gauge which shoots straight to the middle in about a second on start-up.

If you're interested this is a good video which shows the lash adjusters and cam followers at around 4:28:

 

[1990RangerinSK]

No I should, I've just been looking at the oil pressure gauge which shoots straight to the middle in about a second on start-up.

If you're interested this is a good video which shows the lash adjusters at around 4:28:

I'm sure somebody else will chime in here, too, but the oil pressure gauge on these is an on/off switch. As long as you have oil pressure (more than five PSI, I believe) it sits in the middle of the gauge, no matter what the pressure actually is. So you *could* have low oil pressure, even though the gauge is telling you that it's fine.

 

[scotts90ranger]

Yeah, the gauge is a dummy light... it could be a bad lash adjuster, they're not super hard to change with the right assortment of pry bars once you get the valve cover offk. The Lima engine isn't particularly quiet either though... or prone to oil pressure problems after the early 90's when the oil pickup tubes plugged with oil pan gasket material... I have been ignoring the newer style oil pumps though until I got one, apparently there can be O ring issues on them but I don't remember if it's a low pressure or leaking issue...

 

[rusty ol ranger]

I wouldnt trust the stock gauge. My 97 460 had mains down to copper and showed completly normal on the gauge.

I would hook a mechanical gauge to it and see where its showing. The top end is (generally) the first thing to go to rattleing when PSI starts dropping.

Im not super familar with the 2.3 but do they like to wear out cams?

 

[scotts90ranger]

Not on a roller engine ('88 and later), the lash adjusters have been known to fail occasionally (rarely the cap will come off), sometimes a valve spring will break like with anything, cam bearings are fairly robust I think as I don't hear of them failing too often (hollow camshaft gives fairly consistent oiling)

 

[outatime88]

I wouldnt trust the stock gauge. My 97 460 had mains down to copper and showed completly normal on the gauge....

I'm sure somebody else will chime in here, too, but the oil pressure gauge on these is an on/off switch....

Yeah, the gauge is a dummy light... it could be a bad lash adjuster, they're not super hard to change with the right...

Ok so I finally got an oil pressure reading. After letting the engine warm up a while I was getting 20-22psi @ idle (800rpm) and 56-58psi @ 2500rpm.

The truck is running 5W-30 with a quart of Rislone engine treatment. I think these readings are considered normal?

 

[rusty ol ranger]

Ok so I finally got an oil pressure reading. After letting the engine warm up a while I was getting 20-22psi @ idle (800rpm) and 56-58psi @ 2500rpm.

The truck is running 5W-30 with a quart of Rislone engine treatment. I think these readings are considered normal?

Sounds like oil pressure ia just fine.

So either A) somethings worn or B) somethings plugged and that oil isnt getting up top.

 

[1990RangerinSK]

Sounds like oil pressure ia just fine.

So either A) somethings worn or B) somethings plugged and that oil isnt getting up top.

Google says normal oil pressure at idle is 20-30psi. So, yes, 22 is fine, although (and I'm not a mechanic!) I would like to see it 25 or better.

So... how would he figure out whether or not one of the oil passages is blocked?

 

[scotts90ranger]

There is only one oil passage on a 2.3L from the bottom to the top, I don't remember how the oil passages changed in '95 with the new oil pump location and haven't looked at my '97 close enough to know but the heads are interchangeable I believe so the oil port has to be in the same spot... the oil to the top is in the back by the oil pressure sensor port, it goes through the head gasket there up to the cam bearings and lash adjusters. Yes that's normal oil pressure, if you were getting the gauge to not move then that would mean under 5-7psi which isn't good... some people don't consider having 5psi of oil pressure on a small block chevrolet at idle to be a reason to rebuild yet... (in those that means the cam bearings are shot). Oil pressure isn't an exact science, having a reasonable number is all that's important...

If you have pressure and noise it's probably something on the top end, lash adjusters are cheap last I checked (when I bought a set a few years ago they were $2-4 each I think), I wouldn't expect a flat cam unless a roller failed on a follower...

 

[rusty ol ranger]

There is only one oil passage on a 2.3L from the bottom to the top, I don't remember how the oil passages changed in '95 with the new oil pump location and haven't looked at my '97 close enough to know but the heads are interchangeable I believe so the oil port has to be in the same spot... the oil to the top is in the back by the oil pressure sensor port, it goes through the head gasket there up to the cam bearings and lash adjusters. Yes that's normal oil pressure, if you were getting the gauge to not move then that would mean under 5-7psi which isn't good... some people don't consider having 5psi of oil pressure on a small block chevrolet at idle to be a reason to rebuild yet... (in those that means the cam bearings are shot). Oil pressure isn't an exact science, having a reasonable number is all that's important...

If you have pressure and noise it's probably something on the top end, lash adjusters are cheap last I checked (when I bought a set a few years ago they were $2-4 each I think), I wouldn't expect a flat cam unless a roller failed on a follower...

Isnt it 10psi per 1000rpm the old rule of thumb? Or is it 5 psi per 1000rpm

 

[scotts90ranger]

10 per 1000 is a better rule of thumb, much more than that and you're wasting power pumping excess oil, some newer engines use computer controlled bypass valves or something that reduce the oil pressure...