T5 to 2.3

[bobbywalter]

Thats a good article, and for the most part is right, however there is some mis-info. First, The Fairmont never got the T5, dont know where they pulled that out of, second, there is a LOT of V8 cars running around with 4 banger T5's in them and they hold up just fine, Id even go out on a limb and say they arent any less strong than a V8 unit in practical use, The torque ratings are as they are from an engineering standpoint, just because the 4 cylinder has a lower ratio gearset and more force is applied to the bearings because of that. The part that everybody forgets about V8's is how smooth they run in comparison to a 4 banger or even V6. A 4 cylinder engine is much more harsh on a transmission than a V8, just for the fact that there is less overlap between combustion cycles. Either way, there is a lot of V8 cars (And built ones at that) that have had 4 cylinder T5's stuck behind them, and they live just fine. The idea that the 4 cylinder tranny is any less strong than the V8 doesnt hold water very well... Especially when there is 2.3T's out there that make more power than most SBF's and are still running through the stock T5.

Yeah, I didn't notice the Fairmont claim when I read it - good eye. As far as people using 4 cylinder trannies in a V8, I'm sure there are plenty of guys who use them and don't have issues. I won't ever use one because the pilot shaft is smaller and the input shaft is longer than a V8 trans. Those are the key differences. I'm sure you could add washers to make up the space, and might be able to find a pilot bushing to make it work. I'd rather just use a V8 unit though (unless I'm putting it in a 2.3 like the OP).

there was a time when eagle transmissions were easy to get, its why i always suggest the eagle type slave for hydro adaptation of the t5 in the 2wd trucks as a potential option.


key issues were still input shaft changes/pilots and some grinder/machine work with the ford bell, but the jeep 208 case or anny ford 208 case with an input swap bolt right in.


in reality, those older transmissions with stock v8 power with 4x4 and 33 in tires were grenades, and ime the t5 in a car over 300-330 hp is a time bomb too.


i had some fairmonts...one with a 351 that was a tire killer. i almost bought my sisters recently, and i remember a manual od but not a 5 speed....i assumed it was an srod. i cant say if the t5 ever came in them or not though...i never seen it stock, but seen it alot at woodhaven and milan. for some reason i like pintos and those fairmont things....idkw

 

[shane96ranger]

for some reason i like..... those fairmont things....idkw

I love the Fairmont's. This one that Latemodel Restoration Supply has is freakin' awesome. It's a 3V 4.6 liter.

Here's the build: http://www.mylrs.com/blogs/lrs/archive/2009/01/12/Ford-Racing-4.6L-3-Valve-Fox-Body-Swap-Part-1.aspx



Sorry OP, had to share this.

 

[--weezl--]

Thats a good article, and for the most part is right, however there is some mis-info. First, The Fairmont never got the T5, dont know where they pulled that out of, second, there is a LOT of V8 cars running around with 4 banger T5's in them and they hold up just fine, Id even go out on a limb and say they arent any less strong than a V8 unit in practical use, The torque ratings are as they are from an engineering standpoint, just because the 4 cylinder has a lower ratio gearset and more force is applied to the bearings because of that. The part that everybody forgets about V8's is how smooth they run in comparison to a 4 banger or even V6. A 4 cylinder engine is much more harsh on a transmission than a V8, just for the fact that there is less overlap between combustion cycles. Either way, there is a lot of V8 cars (And built ones at that) that have had 4 cylinder T5's stuck behind them, and they live just fine. The idea that the 4 cylinder tranny is any less strong than the V8 doesnt hold water very well... Especially when there is 2.3T's out there that make more power than most SBF's and are still running through the stock T5.

interesting point of reference, back home there was a company putting 5L HO's into b2200's and they were leaving the stock 7.5 and possibly even the stock stick in it (i think it was a t5, not 100% sure) and when i asked the shop who had been doing this, why they left the 7.5 in the rear, they replied with "the 7.5" will hold up to the 5L with no major issues, with 2 stipulations, 1) the 7.5 remains an open dif and 2) they don't go much wider than about a 225-245 tire on the rear" though if you were to do one tire fires constantly, your spider gears are going to blow up pretty quick IMO

 

[nova+rangerracer]

Dang I didnt expect this thread to be this informative, you guys are awesome and have helped me out a lot in both learning about the install and the actual t5 itself. One question tho.... Which would give better accelleration? and which would give better milage? As I drive back and forth to Ohio from Tennessee a lot. Im trying to decide weather to get the adapter plate or trade for a 4cyl t5. Also the truck is going to be turbo'd soon, starting at 7psi and when completed it will (hopefully) be pushing 25-28psi and around 350-400whp. Will the 7.5 hold up to that if I put an auto-locker or a LSD in it?

 

[--weezl--]

the 4banger t5 i believe has lower gears, so you will go through the gears faster, and spend more time shifting, but it will accelerate faster... there is a point where lower gears are NOT helpful, and actually hinder your acceleration, due to the engine not having an issue with torque... you will have to experiment... i know with the foxbodied mustangs and HCI motors (heads, cam, intake, and usually chips) people still notice an increase in power with 4.10's over the stock 3.73 or 3.45 gears (mine has/had 2.73)

though i will say that with my car, (2.73) i could still keep up with the guys running 3.45, even with more miles... when we got up to highway speeds i was owning them though... it was mainly off the line mine would stumble a little...

as for the 7.5, yeah, it will hold up a little, i wouldn't trust it with a locker or lsd in it... you're most likely going to start snapping axle shafts from the torque at that point, it also depends on the tire size... both height and width... if you stay with skinny tires, they won't have the traction to exert the force on the axle shafts to snap them, that being said, the 7.5 isn't a high end diff, and to the best of my knowledge (i could be wrong here) never came with an LSD stock... for the money that it would actually cost, i would just go swap in an explorer 8.8 with disks, 31 spline 8.8" diff, usually can be had for a few hundered... i think they are about $200 here, and those are beefier than what they put in the mustang HO's (and i know a lot of people who were running 300+hp on the mustang stock rear end)

 

[shane96ranger]

Also the truck is going to be turbo'd soon, starting at 7psi and when completed it will (hopefully) be pushing 25-28psi and around 350-400whp.

I would go with a V8 T5 for sure for gearing. The 86 SVO (only in 86) had a 3.50 first gear factory, and I think the other 2.3's had a 3.97 first gear. The V8 first gear is a 3.35 ratio. Just for comparisons sake, my Mustang has a 3.55 ring and pinion and the 3.35 first gear. It tops out at 37-38 mph in 1st gear at around 6200 rpm. IMHO, this is about perfect for my application. It sounds like you are running a 3.45 rear gear maybe? Where does the 2.3 redline?

 

[RacinNdrummin]

If I were you, Id go over to Turboford.org and see how many guys are running the V8 T5, and see what kind of results they are getting with those gears. On the top end, the 2.3T might like the V8 T5 a little better, but if you plan to do any in town driving, the 4 cyl T5 will be better for the 2.3 hands down.

 

[nova+rangerracer]

I actually have a tab open on turboford.org lol and its a mix, when Im in Ohio Im driving back and forth to class every day and when I have a week or so break from school I drive 7hrs interstate to Tennessee and while Im there I drive in town a lot so its kinda a toss up. Im wondering if I can run the 4cyl T5 and get some higher rearend gears or even rebuild it to have a taller OD for the interstate cause in town I never hit OD.

 

[--weezl--]

I actually have a tab open on turboford.org lol and its a mix, when Im in Ohio Im driving back and forth to class every day and when I have a week or so break from school I drive 7hrs interstate to Tennessee and while Im there I drive in town a lot so its kinda a toss up. Im wondering if I can run the 4cyl T5 and get some higher rearend gears or even rebuild it to have a taller OD for the interstate cause in town I never hit OD.

i think counteracting the difference in gears in the tranny, by changing the rear end gears is more or less pointless... it's not going to do much, other than cost you more for parts... though your thought for the taller OD is a good idea... i would love to change the 5th gear in my truck to a higher gear... going down the highway, i'm often running 2500 rpm+ often up to 3000 in 5th, which seems a little high to me... i would love it to sit around 1750-2000 at speed, a little higher if i'm driving fast...

 

[nova+rangerracer]

What would make it pointless? And Im wondering iI would have to macine a custom gear for the higher OD

 

[--weezl--]

basically, you wouldn't gain anything in the long run, the two would cancel each other out... your driveshaft speed would be different, but your rpm/gear to wheel speed would be the same, (depending on the gears you picked for the rear)

 

[shane96ranger]

I found a chart with all of the ratio's which should help you out. Also note the torque ratings listed.

http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2000/09/t5swap/index2.shtml

Looks like there's a Motorsport overdrive gear with the ratio of .63

EDIT: Also, if it has the tag on it still, the first column has the tag ID number

 

[--weezl--]

I found a chart with all of the ratio's which should help you out. Also note the torque ratings listed.

http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2000/09/t5swap/index2.shtml

Looks like there's a Motorsport overdrive gear with the ratio of .63

EDIT: Also, if it has the tag on it still, the first column has the tag ID number

5L mustang t5 5th gear=0.63

4=1:1

 

[shane96ranger]

5L mustang t5 5th gear=0.63

4=1:1

The factory 5.0 ratio for 5th is .068, rather than the .063 that was with the T5 out of the Motorsport catalog.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding your post though.......

 

[--weezl--]

no no... there's no zero after the decimal, it for sure is 0.6x and i'm 99% sure my mustang has a .68 5th, not .63

the difference between .068 and .063 is negligable, and even the difference between .68 and .63 won't be much...

i don't think you misunderstood what i was saying though