spark knock/detonation

[Bob Ayers]

as the page specified, a CID and cam position sensor are the same thing. a "you say tomatoe" kind of deal.

from that site:





the cam sensor (or CID if you like) is used in determining ignition timing

It looks like you are only reading what you want to read! You completely missed this information:

"On other setups, such as the 2.3L Ranger, the PIP and CID signals are both generated from the crankshaft"

"EDIS, on the other hand, utilizes a single input from the crankshaft position sensor"


And to refresh your memory, the original poster has a 2.3L, AND EDIS!!!


We are still waiting for you tell us what vehicles( just one will do) ONLY have a CMP........

 

[Dave R]

the cam sensor (or CID if you like) is used in determining ignition timing

Yeah right, just can't quit can you.

- 2. The CID signal from the camshaft position sensor. The CID signal provides the DIS Module with the information it needs to synchronize the ignition coils in the proper sequence.

- 3. The SPOUT (spark out) signal back from the PCM. The SPOUT signal contains optimal spark timing and dwell time data.

Note the SPOUT provides the WHEN to fire the coil NOT the CID. It only supplies the which coil to fire info.

A loss of the CID signal will not result in shutdown. Instead, the system will remember the proper sequence and continue to fire the coils in order to maintain engine operation. If the DIS Module does not receive valid CID input during engine cranking, random coil synchronization will be attempted. Therefore, several start attempts (cycling the ignition switch from OFF to START) may be required to start the engine.

Any further questions? Quit picking out the parts you want in an attempt to save face.

 

[Wicked_Sludge]

good lord...i NEVER said the original posters engine used the CID/CMS for timing! i said many engines do....and that site specifies this is true.

i also NEVER said engines existed with only a CMS. maybe you guys should scan over my posts again...as your putting words in my mouth.

knowing which coil to fire as well as when to fire it is part of timing.

i know the CPS provides timing input and i know some engines only have a CPS. im not talking about those engines. im talking about engines that have a CID/CMS. in those engines, the CID/CMS is used to determine which coil to fire.....which is part of "timing".

i cant possibly make myself any clearer.

 

[Bob Ayers]

good lord...i NEVER said the original posters engine used the CID/CMS for timing! i said many engines do....and that site specifies this is true.

i also NEVER said engines existed with only a CMS. maybe you guys should scan over my posts again...as your putting words in my mouth.

knowing which coil to fire as well as when to fire it is part of timing.

i know the CPS provides timing input and i know some engines only have a CPS. im not talking about those engines. im talking about engines that have a CID/CMS. in those engines, the CID/CMS is used to determine which coil to fire.....which is part of "timing".

i cant possibly make myself any clearer.

To try and weasel out of where you have been wrong, you have messed up the terms for the sensors. Here is the correct designation:

CMP = Camshaft Position Sensor
CKP = Crankshaft Position Sensor

 

[Bob Ayers]

good lord...i NEVER said the original posters engine used the CID/CMS for timing! i said many engines do....and that site specifies this is true.

i also NEVER said engines existed with only a CMS. maybe you guys should scan over my posts again...as your putting words in my mouth.

knowing which coil to fire as well as when to fire it is part of timing.

i know the CPS provides timing input and i know some engines only have a CPS. im not talking about those engines. im talking about engines that have a CID/CMS. in those engines, the CID/CMS is used to determine which coil to fire.....which is part of "timing".

i cant possibly make myself any clearer.

Here is a statement you made (post #18) that is TOTALLY WRONG:

"since the ignition timing is usually determined baised on the cams position, changing your cam/valve timing would also change your ignition timing."


CLEARLY WRONG!!!!!

 

[Dave R]

knowing which coil to fire as well as when to fire it is part of timing.

Wrong, even if the CMP has crapped out the engine will still start and time itself just fine. When cranking it takes the computer a bit longer to figure out which coil to fire first but once it has the engine running it'll continue to run just fine.

Why don't you go out and pull the plug on your CMP and then take your truck for a drive.

 

[Wicked_Sludge]

To try and weasel out of where you have been wrong, you have messed up the terms for the sensors. Here is the correct designation:

CMP = Camshaft Position Sensor
CKP = Crankshaft Position Sensor

bob, did you know what i meant when i put "CMS" and "CPS"? if so then starting yet a new argument is pointless.

dave, i know the engine will still run with a failed CMP...i never said it wouldnt. but regardless, the PCM DOES use the signal to determine WHICH coil to fire.

which is exactly what ive said for the last 5 posts. im tired of going around in circles with you guys. ive literally run out of ways to explain my point, so im sorry if you dont understand.

 

[Bob Ayers]

bob, did you know what i meant when i put "CMS" and "CPS"? if so then starting yet a new argument is pointless.

dave, i know the engine will still run with a failed CMP...i never said it wouldnt. but regardless, the PCM DOES use the signal to determine WHICH coil to fire.

which is exactly what ive said for the last 5 posts. im tired of going around in circles with you guys. ive literally run out of ways to explain my point, so im sorry if you dont understand.

Why can't you just admit you are worng??????