little bit more power??

[Daniel_187]

Stickers, lot of stickers I have a NOS one on mine (got that beauty from Wally world) Added about 25HP J/K. Just reg. tune ups. For most of the things I do the power is fine.

 

[Yellowsplash]

Not sure how Ford did it but the Mustang version of the 4.0 SOHC makes 240 hp, so there's more power in there somewhere.....

It is actually rated at 210hp also...

I don't know, but im guessing a different cam profile... The Mustang doesn't need low down torque like a Ranger does...

...But has plenty of it, even with the 3.31 gears it comes with. My girl has a '09 Mustang V6. I cant wait for the warranty to expire so I can throw a set of 3.73s and LS in it. Both engines were rated at the same hp level, but the mustang has a more aggressive tune. As far as it having a more aggressive cam...I have yet to see true evidence of this. I also own a '01 and '08 Sport Trac with the SOHC engine and I dont notice any difference in the powerband of the engine. One thing to keep in mind is that trucks are much heavier than the mustang. The mustang also doesnt have balance shafts. That frees up alot of reciprocal weight...and wait for it....It has an E-fan.

IF a filter change would actually allow MORE air (and hence more fuel) into the chamber... The engine would ping and clatter from too much compression!! (there can be NO arguement to this fact!!)
The result of this would be the computer would attempt to STOP the pinging.. which would result in retarded timing.. and even a richer mixture. So the NET result of MORE AIR would be worse performance.. Got that? Worse performance!
So all these ads for K&N and such are simply LIES!

However you are correct.. If it were possible to get more air you would then NEED more exhaust.. More exhaust without that "more air" is also a waste and MIGHT make the ride run worse.

Without changing the camshaft ANY modifications to the intake, heads, valve train or exhaust will result in zackly the same performance or perhaps WORSE.
Big JIm

The stock system fills the chamber to the amount that makes the desired compression at spark. ANY MORE flow would make MORE compression! Which would them make ping... at the ping the system would then retard the timing and richen the mixture..
GOT IT! The cylinders FILL at every stoke from the factory! If they DIDN'T then ANY improvement would cause that dreaded pinging..
Even now just a little bit of carbon on the pistons makes these engines ping, so we know for sure any more AIR FLOW would do the same thing.

The existing intake flows far more air than the engine can injest.
Big JIm

haha....wow. I remember now why I dont browse as often as I used to.

There is no "desired compression at spark". More air ingested in the engine only changes cylinder pressure. If the engine and ignition system can work efficiently under 10 pounds of boost (which causes much higher cylinder pressures and higher IATs), then changing your intake pipe or air filter isnt going to prevent efficient spark or cause predetonation. Detonation is caused by poor maintenance and tuning. The factory spark advance tables themselves are pretty tame and leave room for improvement (and ya wonder how tuners make more power).

The amount of air entering your engine is limited based upon the engine's volumetric efficiency, which is determined by engine design, cam, heads, etc. The cylinders dont "fill" completely contrary to your belief...in fact, probably only 80-85%. How do you improve upon that...yep, you guessed it. You modify it beyond what the factory did in their venture to build a reliable engine that could be produced cheap enough not to drive the cost of the vehicle up significantly. Cause we all know if it did, we wouldnt buy it. You must remember that 80% of the consumers out there arnt fanatics about their vehicles like us here on the forum. They dont care how well they perform, as long as they make decent enough power to accelerate on the on-ramp of the freeway and dont cost them an arm and a leg to drive they're just peachy. With increasing government pressure on the vehicle manufacturers to produce vehicles within certain regulations and trying to keep the cost of production down they tend to spend their time and money focused on other things, especially when it comes to performance.

Mass production and high manufacturing tolerances also dont allow manufactures to fine tune parts that are tweaked for performance to extract every bit possible. Its just not gonna happen without paying a pretty pricetag (ex. GT500 - for $50,000 you can own this beast, or for $127,000 you can own the 700hp Super Snake straight from the factory). Believe it or not, these vehicles come with all those aftermarket performance parts straight from the factory, some of which are made directly by Ford to replace their OWN factory parts. These cars make some serious power.

Lets take for example the new Mustang V6. Its a smaller displacement engine that produces more power. How? Its a DOHC engine with 4 valves per cylinder. For you guys that arnt familiar, that means more airflow and higher volumetric efficiency. Add variable cam timing that allows it to adjust valvetrain opening/closing events and overlap between both valves at every point in the rpm range and your really starting a brew for success. Add more compression....wait? I thought you said more airflow and compression wasnt good for more power? Add a compression ratio of 10.3 and you've got yourself a peppy 305 horsepower and 280 ft.-lb. of torque on demand. How much you wanna bet it doesnt "ping"? Did I also mention it also gets better gas mileage, at 19/30 mpg?

Like I have said a million times, its not what an individual part will do to give you gains, but rather the combination of parts working together that do. An intake system alone wont yield you much power...but doesnt mean they wont net you any gains whatsoever. You must realize that the chain is only as strong as the weakest link. There is no engine that comes off the assembly line through mass production that cant make more power...There is always room for improvement. It doesnt always lie in an intake system or muffler. Forget about the throttle body spacers and tornado devices as they wont do anything. What I will say is that gears seem to be widely overlooked when it comes to the power you crave, because its torque that you want. Im sure a set of 4.10 gears will make you happier about your truck and would be the first modification I would recommend before doing anything else...

 

[jeffw920]

yellowsplash

 

[hondaxr650]

It is actually rated at 210hp also...

Yep, you are correct. Looks like I read some bad info somewhere along the line.

 

[Big Jim M]

Howdy YP!

Sounds to me like you have drank the coolaid! If you think having more fuel in a cylinder than it was designed for won't cause PINGING and other bad things you need to think again..

No matter what the Ve is in any particular engine THAT Ve is what the engine was designed to injest! ANY more volume added WILL give problems!

The FACT that these problems don't exist after these so called "improvements" are added to our engines simply means there was NO GAIN!

Sure they are nice and bright yellow and red... but that is all they are, EYE CANDY!

You need to stop reading magazines that are PAID to write articles, and stop watching TV shows that are PAID to advertise..

Getcha a few books about how engines work. That would be a good start.
Big JIm

 

[Penghi]

Sounds to me like you have drank the coolaid! If you think having more fuel in a cylinder than it was designed for won't cause PINGING and other bad things you need to think again..

No matter what the Ve is in any particular engine THAT Ve is what the engine was designed to injest! ANY more volume added WILL give problems!

The FACT that these problems don't exist after these so called "improvements" are added to our engines simply means there was NO GAIN!

Sure they are nice and bright yellow and red... but that is all they are, EYE CANDY!

You need to stop reading magazines that are PAID to write articles, and stop watching TV shows that are PAID to advertise..

Getcha a few books about how engines work. That would be a good start.
Big JIm

Where are you getting your info? I would like to hear of an experience you have had, where you put a higher flowing filter on a truck and caused it to ping.

 

[Big Jim M]

You made my point!!

Where are you getting your info? I would like to hear of an experience you have had, where you put a higher flowing filter on a truck and caused it to ping.

Zackly what I an saying!!! IF a higher flowing filter actually DID flow more the damn engine would have a higher Ve and would go to hell!

Can'tcha get that into your bean? ANY more flow INTO the cylinder will change the VE of that engine and the damn thing will COMPLAIN! If the engine and computer are built for a 85% Ve then a 86% Ve will cause a PING and reterded timing..

So MAYBE there is a filter out there that WILL flow more than stock...SO? The engine itself WILL NOT flow more than AS BUILT! Even without a filter all together.. Ya got what ya got!

Quit drinking that koolaid and THINK about your mechanics.
Big JIm

 

[Bird]

Well, I can defintely tell that someone in this thread has never worked on / tuned supercharged engines that add more fuel as the engine goes past normal VE.................


Bird

 

[Big Jim M]

Oh yeah!

Well, I can defintely tell that someone in this thread has never worked on / tuned supercharged engines that add more fuel as the engine goes past normal VE.................


Bird

When the supercharger is turned on the tuning is changed to accomodate the extra cylinder filling. WITHOUT that extra tuning the damn thing would clatter out of it's mind!
We are speaking of a normal engine with a simple "high flow" filter added. My point is the "high flow" doesn't make a damn bit of difference. If it MADE a difference the tuning we are speaking of would have to be done.
So far as I can see NOBODY that has simply added a "high flow" filter has had to have the tuning changed.
Got it?
Big JIm

 

[1996DANGERRANGER]

IF a filter change would actually allow MORE air (and hence more fuel) into the chamber... The engine would ping and clatter from too much compression!! (there can be NO arguement to this fact!!)
The result of this would be the computer would attempt to STOP the pinging.. which would result in retarded timing.. and even a richer mixture. So the NET result of MORE AIR would be worse performance.. Got that? Worse performance!
So all these ads for K&N and such are simply LIES!

However you are correct.. If it were possible to get more air you would then NEED more exhaust.. More exhaust without that "more air" is also a waste and MIGHT make the ride run worse.

Without changing the camshaft ANY modifications to the intake, heads, valve train or exhaust will result in zackly the same performance or perhaps WORSE.
Big JIm

im sorry but youre jumping into a hole without a rope. most power adders really do imporve power like they say. aalot dont but some legitament ones will. for example the air swirl cones you put in your intake. . junk...cold air intake . . good. .
when you add more air to the fuel mixture youre gonna get more power. the problem with the rangers is the valves are small so air cant flow as well without forced induction. but it does change the performance very little. i changed my exhaust and put a programmer and a different air filter and my truck runs great. when i remove the programmer it actually runs worse in my opinion. and i know diesels are alot different but you can ut an intake and exhaust ona truck and pick up some hp. a gas truck is a little differnt casue most dont have turbos but the theory is still them same

 

[Penghi]

Without changing the camshaft ANY modifications to the intake, heads, valve train or exhaust will result in zackly the same performance or perhaps WORSE.

Big JIm


Wow more flow= worse performance. That's a new one. Sounds like you've done quite a lot of experimenting with the 4.0. You should open up your own performance shop and sell books on the subject so that more people can read your "fact filled" ideas. The whole world should be open to your vast knowledge instead of just this forum.

 

[igiveup]

Hello

NO!!! NO!!!! You got it all wrong!! The Tornado goes in the exhaust!!!

It would whistle pretty good also. My 06 F150 had one on it when I bought it and it whistle pretty good and I took it off and noticed I had a bit more HP and better fuel mileage. My truck also came with a CAI on it and it looks pretty but thats about it. It came with a Roush exhaust on it and sounds good but does it help I don't know. I did by a used Edge programmer (1/2 price 2 months old) for it but used it to reprogram my speedo (larger tires) and monitor my transmission temp since I use it as a tow rig. A lot of the crap you see out there that claim more Hp is just wanting your money.

igiveup

 

[Big Jim M]

That' easy for you to say.

Without changing the camshaft ANY modifications to the intake, heads, valve train or exhaust will result in zackly the same performance or perhaps WORSE.

Big JIm


Wow more flow= worse performance. That's a new one. Sounds like you've done quite a lot of experimenting with the 4.0. You should open up your own performance shop and sell books on the subject so that more people can read your "fact filled" ideas. The whole world should be open to your vast knowledge instead of just this forum.

So you do agree with the posts I have made? If NOT then lets hear where I am wrong. Give intelligent comments on just what it is that DOES happen when this or that modification is done to a modern internal combustion engine.

It's easy to make REMARKS about my posts! But I'm betting very hard to positively show where I'm incorrect.

The problem here is you do read my posts and you KNOW they make good sense. You KNOW I am correct and have no response but to make snide remarks..

If you do understand engines and what and when they do this or that then give a bonafide example of how and why I am incorrect.

Just don't mimic the TV show you watched last Saturday..

Big JIm

 

[igiveup]

Hello

Just don't mimic the TV show you watched last Saturday..

Big JIm

What TV is wrong? LMAO

Just like watching CBC and Fox they are always right. Sell you a bunch of cow patties.

igiveup

 

[Penghi]

Without changing the camshaft ANY modifications to the intake, heads, valve train or exhaust will result in zackly the same performance or perhaps WORSE.

Big JIm

IF a filter change would actually allow MORE air (and hence more fuel) into the chamber... The engine would ping and clatter from too much compression!! (there can be NO arguement to this fact!!)
The result of this would be the computer would attempt to STOP the pinging.. which would result in retarded timing.. and even a richer mixture. So the NET result of MORE AIR would be worse performance.. Got that? Worse performance!

Big JIm

It's easy to make REMARKS about my posts! But I'm betting very hard to positively show where I'm incorrect.

The problem here is you do read my posts and you KNOW they make good sense. You KNOW I am correct and have no response but to make snide remarks..

If you do understand engines and what and when they do this or that then give a bonafide example of how and why I am incorrect.

Just don't mimic the TV show you watched last Saturday..

Big JIm

I get my info on the 4.0 from my experience with the 4.0, your experience is only with pulling "facts" out of thin air. I HAVE fully improved the flow in my engine, with NO tuning, and my truck has a better performance than before. I use 87 octane and guess what? NO PINGING. It's not hard for me to explain where i'm coming from, the real challenge seems to be for you to explain where you get your "facts".

Penghi