just a thought, do they make a supercharger for 2.3s

[feellnfroggy]

well its a giving fact that turbo's use the air leaving the engine to run and cause no loss of power that a belt would but as he said its all about being different, resource $$$$$, and daily driving conditions.

With the turbo tho, you have to keep in mind its the expanding heated air, not the flowing of the air that turns the turbine.

With the supercharger its just a pulley that turns a gear, turning another gear that pushes air. While compressing air causes heat as well, more parasitic loss is due to hot air entering the combustion chamber. This is more robbing of power than the supercharger itself. The gains with a supercharger even with the parasitic drag are still gains. The instantatneous torque increase in the lower rpm band is a major plus too, though. A big neccessity for a 4 banger. This can be accomplished with a turbo though not as efficiently.

 

[turbo cat]

you seriously need to learn more about forced induction before you speak it

 

[Wicked_Sludge]

you need to stop talking down to everyone from way up there on your pedistal Mr. Self-Proclaimed Turbo Expert

 

[turbo cat]

heated air is not parasitic drag for one. Not to mention he stated that a blower just creates hot air. This is true if the blower is overspinning its range and or there is insufficient intercooling taking place by either a heat exchanger/ fmic/ air to water/ and or meth injection. So blowers justr blow hot ineffecient air and thats why ford, gm, mercedes, jaguar,and so on equip motors from the factory with blowers. Also if a turbocharger is setup right it will produce power down low like a roots blower. However it may be a trade off unless your possibly talking about sequential twin turbo setups liek the supras use from factory. A smaller turbo to get things going and then uses a larger turbocharger at a certain level. I am also no expert but when someone states something like that I may say something. Also if turbos cant produce torque down low how do turbo diesel engines make gobs of torque at low rpms?

 

[Ric]

bring this back to a civilized manner folks.

 

[Wicked_Sludge]

the act of compressing air creates heat. you cannot compress air without creating heat. roots blowers are well known for creating tons of heat for a given level of boost (more than a turbo or centrifugal blower). while its not parasetic drag, this heat does cost an engine power. just because he had his terminology wrong doesnt mean you need to jump on his case.

turbos can be set up to minimize lag...as i said before. they can even be made to perform quite well at lower RPM (at the cost of choking a high reving engine like a 2.3 in the upper RPM range). but they CAN NOT create the instantaneous boost of a belt-driven blower. physics denies this possibility.

deisels make gobs of low-down torque naturally asperated. turbos help them make up for their pitiful N/A horsepower numbers.

 

[turbo cat]

so your saying a diesel dosent make more torque with boost?

 

[anupaum]

The top of my blower outlet gets too hot to touch when the engine is running. I'm not talking theory here--I've been running a supercharger on my 2.3 for a LONG time!

 

[rangerpimpn84]

wel its good o hea the pros and cons of such a contraversial topic. Ive thought a lot bout it since the cobalt ss came out and just wondered bout my 2.3 with one. Mainly bcuz of the cost of turbo application. Also bcuz of the major upgrades needed to the engine and drive train.Ive drivn gtp's and other supercharged cars and liked it. My cuz has a supercharged scion tc and he loves it. He used to have a evo and he twin turbod it and he had to sell it cuz he wouldve killed himself wit it. Besides all that he likes the suprcharger so thats another inspiration. Im going to wyo tech in the fall and neeed to sart this transformation soon cuz i wont have time or money while im there. Ne one that has this done to their truck feel free to pm me or aim me go ahead. My screen name is vegasbeanhead666. Pics and info would help, plus dealers would help to. I just dont want to have to tear this thing all up and have to do all kinds of work to put a turbo in if i could achieve 50-60 horses out of this.

 

[turbo cat]

Generally a 2.3L turbo swap would be cheaper than a 2.3L supercharger setup. 2.3L turbo swap cars can be found for hundreds vs having to fabricate and beef up the internals on a NA 2.3L.

 

[rangerpimpn84]

yea but i f u do a turbo setup and have that much power u need to redo the rear end and tranny and the internals. on top of that all the labor when doing it. Im just lookn to not have all that headache and on top of that it was just a thought then we have everyone getn attitudes and name calln. For christ sake if u dont any possitive ideas or thoughts or even something productive to say keep ur trap shut. for all ya that were polite and not causn mayhem thankyou it was very much appreciated.

 

[Wicked_Sludge]

you dont have to touch the engine internals, transmission, or rear end for any boost numbers lower than 8-10 PSI. after that, forget pistons (stock rods and crank) will get you to 15 or so. id ditch the 7.5 at about 180 HP (12 PSI or so). a stock M5OD will handle whatever you can throw at it.

of coarse these numbers are all approximate. nothing is that black and white and there are too many variables to peg down an absolute number.

 

[RacinNdrummin]

the act of compressing air creates heat. you cannot compress air without creating heat. roots blowers are well known for creating tons of heat for a given level of boost (more than a turbo or centrifugal blower). while its not parasetic drag, this heat does cost an engine power. just because he had his terminology wrong doesnt mean you need to jump on his case.

turbos can be set up to minimize lag...as i said before. they can even be made to perform quite well at lower RPM (at the cost of choking a high reving engine like a 2.3 in the upper RPM range). but they CAN NOT create the instantaneous boost of a belt-driven blower. physics denies this possibility.

deisels make gobs of low-down torque naturally asperated. turbos help them make up for their pitiful N/A horsepower numbers.

The 2.3 isnt a high revving engine, especially for a 4 cylinder. As I have been saying a stock IHI turbo will get boost in before you know it and youll be able to redline a stock cammed engine without choking it off. Also, a stock M5OD, and even a 4 cylinder M5OD at that, will not handle anything a 2.3T will throw at it.

It seems like this thread is full of a bunch of people that have never driven a 2.3T car. I suggest you all try it at some point because youll realize how laughable the supercharger idea really is.

 

[turbo cat]

yea but i f u do a turbo setup and have that much power u need to redo the rear end and tranny and the internals. on top of that all the labor when doing it. Im just lookn to not have all that headache and on top of that it was just a thought then we have everyone getn attitudes and name calln. For christ sake if u dont any possitive ideas or thoughts or even something productive to say keep ur trap shut. for all ya that were polite and not causn mayhem thankyou it was very much appreciated.

power production can be controlled in a turbo charged setup by a couple simple devices called the wastegate and boost controllers. If you opverpowering many componets you can turn the boost down with the change of a spring/ wastegate arm adjustment/ and or controll of a knob or button on a controller.

 

[rurouni20xx]

sorry guys im w/ sludge on this one, and if the guy wants a super so be it his trk his money. the only thing i have to really input on this is make sure you understand how to tune the engine and do all your homework b4 you get started. a minor miscalculation can cost you the motor. the hypereutectic pistons can handle 12 psi w/ no probs if the tune is right super or turbo boost applied. the super can be done w/ that much boost and still maintain dd usage, just a decrease in economy when placing foot in throttle. the m50d trans can take a hella beating, i know, ive put one thru it. to help w/ heat generating id def look into intercooling, fmic would be my first thought and step. the cobalt ss super blows 5psi into the 2.0 and doesnt gen much hp, id look into an eaton m90 or something comparable to blow around the 10-12 psi range and generate the 50 or 60 hp your looking for, possibly more. yes your engine will have some drag on it, but if it costs 10 hp to make 80 per say, your looking at an 8% drag loss here, its still worth it imo. cooling the air that goes in will def help lower the drag loss coefficient. plus the blown in tq number will be fun for friday nite burnouts and sat nite lineups.