I'm so lost. Check this out and take a guess. Sounds like gravel in my bellhousing?

[iamlew]

So, I got this 87 ranger today and it was supposed to run, and need a new tranny. It runs, but not too good lol.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pcUtkIc8Lxg

Watch my video it's about 40 seconds long and shows the engine from start, then I go under and show the smoke/louder noise.

Any ideas? Oh btw I just put in oil and filter (K&N filter and 5 quarts of valvoline 10 w 30 max life). Mostly filled the coolant after I drained it (wouldn't suck more up at the time). Put in a new starter and solenoid. It wouldn't start and still doesn't unless I jump it at the solenoid. I'm thinking it has something to do with the neutral safety switch... not sure yet, but if I can't figure this out it's getting junked I think hah. I'm a student can't afford the time or money to do a overhaul right now =\

Thanks for any help =)

 

[IMenriched]

Is this Auto tranny or a Manual?? If stick/manual...it might be the throw out bearing?? IF Auto it might be the toruqe converter...

take the fan belt off the water pump...& restart it - breifly ...if it is quite, then its the water pump (doubtful, but then you can rule it out)

you mentioned that you've changed the starter....purhaps you've gotten the wrong starter ....not releasing far enough away from ring gear???

sounds like something got dropped down a cylinder and is banging around...just a guess A compression check would be a place to start....(if you got one or borrow one from a buddy)

take the plugs out 1 at a time, check for damage (restart for each plug removed) listen to see if it reduces the noise.

 

[Roy]

By youtube I see its an automatic. I have heard stater ring gear plates make a noise like that when they were cracked. Also what if you hammered on the cataletic converter will the noise change?
Roy

 

[mercman]

I'd pull the starter and have a look inside. Pay attention to the ring gear and bendix. There isn't much else in there that can sound like that. Most likely your bendix isn't retracting enough, or maybe a torque converter nut has fallen off? It's hard to say with out getting eyes inside. You might want to "feel" around with a magnetic pick up tool and see if you get any chunks.

 

[Psychopete]

You are probably close on the neutral safety switch. I just traced mine out last night and it was somewhat cryptic as to where it actually ran (but you probably won't have to get into it at that depth). Look on the round plug with 5 wires on the driver's side of the transmission. If you find a R/LB wire and a W/PK, those are likely the 2 wires for the NSS. The plug simply pulls up to disconnect. Sometimes they won't want to pull out, just don't pull on the wiring.

Keep in mind there is a splice in there. The NSS wiring on my '88 remained R/LB through a good portion of the circuit, but there is a section that is W/PK that splices back into 2 R/LB wires - one ran to the starter solenoid and the other the TFI module. The W/PK is the wire that is after having gone through the NSS. Since it runs, I'm not sure if/what the TFI needs from that part of the circuit. Maybe to signal some different timing stragey when you're starting the truck as opposed to just running? Either way, if you find that the wiring colors are the same there, you should be able to test with a DMM to figure out where the problem is.

Just took a look at the Autozone diagrams compared to what was in my '88 EVTM and there is a lot less detail in the Autozone diagrams.. They make little mention of the W/PK wiring. But looks like they are similar as far as the circuit. There is a whole mess of crap that wire goes though. It would have been nice if they routed the harness directly from the drivers side firewall, but instead it comes directly out of the engine's mainharness.

Pete

 

[pun]

couple of weeks ago i was working in my trans, apperantly when i put it back it didnt line up correctly and it made that same noise. I finally gave up and took it to a mech shop and said i cracked the fylwheel and that was rubbing on the bell housing. hope htis helps. good luck with your ride.

 

[LittleHorse]

I had a full size Bronco with a warped bell housing on a C6. The warped bellhousing caused the axis of the torque converter/input to the transmission not to line up straight with the crankshaft. That caused alternating pushing/pulling forces on the flexplate as it rotated, which slowly cracked the center of the flywheel all the way around the bolt flange in a rough circle. Since the piece that bolted to the torque converter was completely separated from the piece bolted to the crank - no go. It made nasty gravel noises leading up to it, at first I thought it was bottom end of the motor.

I say that to say, yeah check out the flywheel. May not be anything wrong with the transmission.

 

[iamlew]

Thanks for all the input so far, I can't do anything with it till around 4:30 when my friend gets off work, he's going to help me out since I need someone to jump the starter for me right now hah.

Sounds like we all have the same idea flywheel/bellhousing or transmission not lined up. This sounds right since I got it with the tranny nearly off, the transfer case is off, all the linakge off etc.

My GF's dad said maybe it was the crankshaft bearing busted from sitting, then it went when finally getting turned over.

BTW I took off the ac belt last night and no difference, I also tried the alternator belt, nothing, Skipped the water pump because we decided it's more of a squeal with those when they go out. I'll do it anyways can't hurt to try.

We banged on a few parts but not the cat. I'll try that next, it sounded like exhaust to me at first too, but no idea. Any clue what all the smoke can be from? maybe bad gas? just from sitting burning off some sludge or something?

transmission is an a4ld right? maybe a4od... which ever one is a real model haha. (87 ex cab automatic, 2.9L). Starter was model number 3088 I believe but that could be wrong. I know it was 3 numbers off from the starter in my f-150 =p

I'll get back with more info as soon as I get it

I noticed when I rev it up to 3000-5000 rpms then let off the noise stops almost completely until it gets back to idling. Not sure if that was in the video or not..

If you need any pictures videos let me know =)

 

[Tedybear]

Take the bolt out of the inspection cover. (it's an A4LD transmission with the sump pan)

Sounds most likely something caught in the ring gear, or somethings in the bell housing area. It might become clear when you look inside the inspection cover area. Check for each nut to the converter, and for any cracks in the flexplate/gear. (from what I could hear? This does not sound like a cracked flexplate....they do not normally sound like a marble spinning around a tin can...but it's worth a check)

You did ensure the rear plate is used, correct? That one gives you about a 1/16 space between the engine and the transmission. Forgetting to put that back in place, and the ribs on the rear of the torque converter actually make contact with the bell housing. (First Hand Exp. here...the PO with ours didn't replace it when he changed the transmission the first time--Severe wear pattern where the torque converters "ribs" where grinding into the bell housing)

S-

 

[iamlew]

No nuts on the torque converter. My friend dropped a nut past it somehow and we can't retrieve it yet.... lol

So anyone known off hand the nut I need? like size/thread ? if not my friend helping me works at the hardware store I can have him grab an array of nuts to try out.

We think the PO tried to remove the transmission without taking off the bell housing... which obviously wouldn't work, or at least for them

Can I use a different tranny if this one isn't easily fixed. I can get one from a 2.9L b2 from 86. looks almost the same just doesn't have OD I also have a 87 explorer 5 speed I'd really like to use =p

So this sound could be the converter nuts being off right? Also might explain why when I rev it up it stops, maybe adding pressure forcing it in place.

BTW the flywheel appears fine, the starter looks a little warn but hard to tell. there is a bit of metal flakes inside.Anything I need to do before running it after I get those bolts on or should I be alright? Keep in mind I want to test the tranny from what I know it just needs a new belt or the belt on it tightened =p

 

[koolmilds]

if you just put in a new starter and now it looks worn and you see shavings (metal flakes) in the bellhousing, id suspect either something is askew with the starter or the shim between the engine/trans is missing (like Tedybear suggested). if it wont start with the starter but will start by jumping the solenoid, your wiring needs to be checked. something else is automatics had a spacer between the crank flange and flexplate. if this was removed and not replaced by the previous owner, itll cause the flexplate and/or torque converter to rub the engine block.

and...belts on a transmission ? maybe frictions and steels or a new band, depends on how its acting (when you get there). and yes, it is an A4LD.

give us an update please.

 

[AllanD]

I got a Bronco2 like that as a junker.

"the trans is dead" actually it wasn't the engine wasn't turning the trans because the flex plate was broken.

AD

 

[johndeeregarner]

I had a friends f150 do something like that and it was just a crack in the manifold/exhaust pipe.

JDG

 

[iamlew]

Yeah I meant band not belt sorry =p

Anyways the noise is gone and I'm 90% sure the not starting is the NSS, I'm going to put it completely back together tomorrow or Sunday (in college so not a lot of free time). This way I'll have a better idea of the starting problem, and know more about what's wrong with the transmission. Right now I'm just relying on info from my friends coworker.

It's running good though so I'm at least to the point that worst case I put in a tranny with no OD or a 5-speed.

The tranny problem from what I understand is it was having trouble going into second from both 1st and 3rd, then it eventually just gave out. When it did the owner revved it up and it shifted into another gear, he drove home, and that was the last time it ran. I'm told it will go in reverse and the high gears supposedly work.

Now I just need to figure the linkage out, is it pretty self explanatory looking at it or what?

 

[cocoasranger]

Check the plastic clips that secure the ends of the shifter cable if you have a column shift. If one of them breaks there will be excessive play and the shift position on the indicator will not be correct.