Grout

[James Morse]

Another non-Ranger question.
I'm almost done prep in the mud room. It's 11.5" concrete tiles. The tiles were red or they were painted red at some point (some red paint remains otherwise they are red-pink). Then lino was glued over them. Then carpet was glued over that. I'm almost done getting all the old stuff off, and since the tiles aren't very consistent appearance I'm going to paint them brick red (like the original(?) paint) and likely I put that gritty stuff (really works) in the paint on the ones near the door. It will look way better.
Here's the question. After I paint, I need to re-grout. I experimented with some grouts I have. To me they seem to have no strength at all. Given they aren't holding the tiles, but it has to not just flake out. I know there's sanded, unsanded, etc... but they are supposed to have some kind of binder, right? I have stuff I add to sakrete when I patch the basement walls. I'm wondering what is it about the grout I'm not doing right? It just seems to me like it has to have some hold power.
I'd paint, then grout, then seal the grout. Seems straightforward, but I don't want to do the grouting then have the stuff immediately start coming out. House was built 1920.
I'm going to get Goo-gone they say that works on lino glue. Alcohol sort of works. You see there is the last of the remaining lino/carpet/glue, this is the worst, rest is done. Heat gun didn't seem to do much. I been chipping away at this like forever and ready to put it to bed. You see it every time you come in/out so it's worth prettying it up. Was using lacquer thinner before, but, it's expensive, and I don't like working around it.

 

[Vindictus]

You have to remove all the old grout. dremel works well.
They make grout removal bits for a dremel.
Use a polyamer based unsanded grout. AND SEAL it. that is important if you want your hard work to last

 

[RonD]

Epoxy grout will stay in place the best, but harder to apply

You can use a circular saw with concrete blade to remove old grout, correct width blade allows one pass
I would paint the tiles(and old grout) first
Then remove the old grout, Dremel is a good idea, for the edges, circular saw for the longer stretches
(you don't have to remove the old grout down to the sub-floor, just a deep enough trough for the new grout to grip)
And apply new grout in the color of your choice
Then seal whole floor

 

[Shran]

Can you heat that glue & paint up with a torch and use a wire brush to remove it when it's warm?

I hate carpet glue. It is a real pain to remove. I have hardwood floors in my house and some dipshit glued carpet, nasty low pile gray carpet, to the floor in every single room. I gave up on trying to remove it and decided that it was a lost cause - covered it up with more carpet and engineered flooring.

 

[James Morse]

Will try heat again, maybe I just wasn't aggressive enough. Concern on starting a fire under, probably unfounded, for that much heat to soak thru the thick tiles would be improbable.
Goo gone doesn't seem to attack the glue at all. Alcohol works a little. There's not that much left.
I think all the old grout is out of there, it's hard to see because of the straight-on pic, but there's a good 1/4" depth there maybe more. The old grout wasn't tenacious, it's 100+ yrs old, came out easily. My feeling is as long as there is sufficient depth and nothing loose underneath, grout should take. I'll take a good look at it after all cleaned up and grooves are vacuumed out, but it seems to go to a point then stops at a consistent depth. The tiles might have a rebate on them vs being spaced.
Skid-not really works, there's one cement step going into the mud room, and years ago I put sealer then just sprinkled the stuff on there. You cannot slip your foot on it.
I was lucky that all the interior wall-to-wall (now gone) was put in with tack strips, not glued. They can leave some little holes when you take them out but really not noticeable.
Why are you saying paint the old grout, I mean, if it's gone, then sure you want to get at least to the edges of the tiles but past that what does it accomplish.
There is a little square door with a hook/eye latch on the back of the house under the mud room. No idea why, because why would you want to get there, there's no electric or plumbing. Have never looked in there, now I'm curious.
House was built to last - thick concrete basement walls. The front porch is concrete floor (I imagine w/ rebar) covered with tiles (same kind as mud room). I know it's concrete because under the porch is a separate concrete-walled-off room with dirt floor (so the porch floor is its ceiling). There is also another room which I'm guessing maybe was a coal room but no evidence of that. Pantry upstairs is the only non-heated room with a load of wall cabinets. I figure they didn't heat it because they want stuff cool. Under porch could have been a root cellar maybe. Either of those basement rooms would make good tornado shelters if we ever had them. In the day they probably had a spring house, don't think they had refrigerator, invented 1913 so by 1920 they probably weren't readily available cheap. They used to build stuff to last and purpose-built. Even as to the eaves, you have a lot of overhang so you get winter sun in but not summer sun. Built on a hill so it's one story but full walk-in basement. Also has "sleeping room" - basically a small sunroom with all windows so you could get a little breeze through it (no ac then). I'm way off topic here, sorry. Just interesting that there are a lot of details in the construction that make you say, they had their thinking caps on.
I'll get the polymer grout probably, epoxy sounds good, but perhaps overkill for the purpose. Thank you very much for the help.

 

[RonD]

Painting the floor, and old grout, was assuming old grout was still there, so when you cut it out you would have nice clean grout lines with the new grout if that's what you wanted as "the look"

Since it's open underneth you could install pipe(PEX) under the mud room floor for a heated floor, lol, dry the boots and shoes faster

 

[James Morse]

AH. Smart!
Yeah I try to do decent work.
Hm, yeah, could put heat, an idea. Will pex stand up to 175-180 degrees? (approx high boiler temp)
Thanks.

 

[CrabGuy]

That sounds like an awful lot of work. We had about 700 sq.ft. of 10" ceramic tile that my wife absolutely loathed. Rather than go through the pain of removing that much tile we just laid a floating waterproof 8mm LVP floor over the tile using a 1/8" transition pad called Quiet Walk. That was 10 years ago and we have yet to have any problems at all even with the floor being in the path from the pool. LVP is warmer than tile, easier to clean, and so easy to install. There's even an electric radiant version of the transition pad we used at a neighbors home in Oregon. I wish I had done the same here, radiant floor is a great option for 1st floor applications.

 

[RonD]

Yes, you can get PEX for boiler use, 180-200degF

 

[James Morse]

Well, it is, but most of the demo/prep is done at this point. Painting is easy, and grout is, theoretically, easy, I've just never done it but I understand the technique.
Like most everything around here the prep is the worst part. When I paint rooms I first clean off all the overbrush on the woodwork, that's a pain, but I think it's worth it because then I tape off and get nice clean lines, I think it makes it look better overall.
This has been going on for ages (mud room). Sometimes I get partway into something then sick of it and start on a different thing so I have a bunch of stuff in various stages. Not the best strategy but that's what happens.
My take on house repairs/renovations is, most people do it just before they sell to to try to get the max price. But then you don't enjoy it, I think (in ideal world) it's better to have all these things done, then you not only get to enjoy it, but if it had to be sold right away, it's ready.
This place is so old, the original electric main had a box with one big fuse - 35A max. Replaced with 200A box at some point.
Wish I had a pool, I wouldn't mind one, especially in ground, but they cost a fortune and I think there's bedrock/shale pretty shallow. I've had above-ground other places, they're decent, a lot cheaper, just you have to have some kind of stairs to a deck or something.

 

[Curious Hound]

They make chemicals that react violently and turn that bedrock into rubble that can be shoveled out of the way.

 

[RonD]

Yes, trinitrotoluene(TNT) does that

 

[lil_Blue_Ford]

PEX is what’s run for the boiler system in my parents house, both in concrete and stapled to the wood floor

 

[lil_Blue_Ford]

They also make big power shovels…

 

[MISWFL]

You want a quality epoxy grout like Power Grout. Be advised that it cures much faster, so you have less working time. Follow the directions, don't use nasty hard mineral water and don't let the sun shine on the uncured grout.

Pex A with the plastic expansion rings is the best. I prefer Uponor brand. Don't cheap out and try to use the hand expander tool, get the power tool, even if it's used.