Baja 1000 Budget Build Plan

[rickf92592]

Not to rain on your parade but I've been doing this almost 35 years.
From the other thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlie brown
the only way to make a million in offroad racing is to start with 2 million. HAHA

seriously, get a bike with lots of friends. you may be able to do it for that. Check out a tour type rid like “the rip to the tip”. That’s a group ride with full on support and trailers to help.

or start snooping around the race forums like on dezertrangers.com or racedezert.com baja 1K is not a good race to start with. if your set on racing in baja you would want to hook up with a team first, make friends then after you learn more, maybe start laying out your plans. baja is as you know a another country and it is by far not the safest place to be. you have to know how to travel, when to travel, places to stay at. its not the usa, there is not a search party that comes look for you if you missing. i been going there for over 25+ years and it is a bit different every time.

Rip to the Tip is invitation only and, trust me, unless you are a current, top-notch desert racer Cameron won't take you for your own good. (I've ridden with Cameron and I'm about 15 years past my expiration date)


Quote:
Originally Posted by charlie brown
there are some racers that will sell you a right side seat for part of the race. that would be a great way to check it out. that way you get to prerun with them, ride in the truck and be part of it.


This is the best advice on here.
Your entry fees for the 1000 (entry, tracker, etc.) will be about $3000.00.
You have to have your truck teched and tagged by SCORE (Bill Savage) and I can't remember what that fee is.
You need a full driving set-up (pumper helmet, suit, gloves, shoes, underwear, etc.) about $1500.00 - $2000.00.
Pitting; unless you can talk 25 of your friends to bring 5-6 chase rigs down and all for free, you'll spend at least $2500.00 (plus fuel) on a pit service.
You'll need at least 2 spares on the truck and 12 spares scattered down the course.
Chase truck: You'll need at least one chase truck and crew loaded with spares. tools, radios and GPS.
Lights: Unless you have a sponsor, you'll need at least $2000.00 worth of lights. We are sponsored by KC and run 12 of their $1200.00 each 70W PODS on the front of the Trophy Truck.
How much do you have budgeted for the required fuel cell? $1500.00 might buy a current used one.
DON'T BELIEVE THE MOOKS THAT SAY YOU CAN DO THIS ON THE CHEAP, MOST HAVE NEVER RACED!
I'd beg a large team to let me help pitting and chasing the first year and buy a seat (Baja Challenge are great) the next year.
After that, save about $50,000.00 and you might do a competive 5-1600 effort.
Sorry to rain on your parade but each year we see a lot of broken dreams starting out this way.

Oh, and if you are a competent dirt-bike rider, consider a Baja tour. The only tour company I recommend is Tim Morton's Baja Bound.

 

[rickf92592]

I think this is an awesome idea. I can't wait to see what you come up with. It'd be nice if you had a full build thread in the build forum (you could probably ask a mod to move this one for you if you wanted).

Someone mentioned a 93-97 Supercab with a 4.0 & 5speed. I think that is a very good place to start. Pretty well built pickup from the factory. The front end is TIB (2wd) or TTB (4wd) and pretty stout. The 4.0 is very reliable with pretty good power. And I agree that the 5 speed is a better way to go than auto (I've never understood using an auto for desert race trucks).

For modifications:
Super heavy duty clutch for tranny (replace slave cylinder while you're in there) and make sure the tranny doesn't have a leak near the shift rails (common M5OD-R1 problem)
I think rather than a lift kit, you'll want to go homebuilt to save some money and perform better than most kits can offer
Good shocks, but you already know this.
Skip body work except for enlarging your fender openings for larger tires (this also keeps center of gravity low compared to just lifting the truck higher to fit them on)
Disc brake rear axle from '95+ Explorer (31 spline, larger axle tubes), add some type of locker or spool. I won't give you advice for which one since I'm undecided which would be better.
Do some other stuff, too. (I'm very helpful, aren't I?)

Nobody I know successfully runs a clutch with a manual in a truck, too hard on gearsets, ring and pinions and driveshafts in the rough stuff. Everyone runs a spool.

Cruise around some of the builders sites like Camburg, there's good reasons these trucks are built this way. A stock axle housing should last you, oh, say about 50-75 miles.

 

[TheUndeadRanger]

party pooper. sad day. well if you can't race it, friggin drive it on your own. make your own course haha


BTW thats a joke.

 

[TheUndeadRanger]

but rickf(bunchanumbers) is right, its a damned expensive sport and it has to be done right the first time. you don't get second chances to race once its a go.

but hey, make yourself your very own "race truck" and have fun with it. there are more than enough places to go screw around in any given town at any given time.

 

[rickf92592]

Sadder still to blow a bunch of dough and not get there.
Why don't you guys get together and plan a trip to one of the Baja races?
If you plan it out you can work for one of the pit crews.
Be sure and go to contingency so you can get a good look at the various vehicles.
You'll have fun, learn a ton and come back with a much better idea of what is required and possible.

25th MasterCraft Safety Tecate SCORE San Felipe 250
San Felipe, Baja, Mexico
March 11-13, 2011

(San Felipe is NICE in March and you'll see one of the roughest Baja races there is, one section is 43 miles of continuous whoops)

 

[rickf92592]

The SNORE rulebook is here http://snoreracing.net/images/rulebook/2010snorerulebook.pdf
and they are bit bit more lax than SCORE. The SCORE Sportsman truck class would be class 1450 in SNORE. Actually a pretty good group to race with.

 

[Oldschooljeep48]

This is damn good advice. We were having so much fun dreaming about the build we didn't even stop to think that you actually have rules to follow to even enter the race.

This in mind, it's probably best to pick a class that fits the level of modification you want to do for your budget before you even buy a vehicle. For example, some of the classes would rule out a Supercab Ranger but allow a regular cab and others might allow the Supercab but not the regular cab due to wheelbase restrictions.

You can order a Score rule book here: http://www.score-international.com/webresources/files/RuleBk.pdf for $27.75.

I agree on the rulebook, I do need to pick one up. I mentioned before that I really don’t care what class I run, I just want the best chance at finishing. So I'm my opinion, a 9" rear with a spool gives me a much better chance to finish without breakage. What your post made me think more about is the safety needs of each class. So while the 9” rear end might be bullet proof, a 4.0 would be a great motor, and the ext cab may be a better ride, that may push me to the next class. Going up a class in terms of racer isn’t a problem for me, but it may mean I need the next step in roll cage protection and other safety gear and that will really eat into the budget. So thank you for pointing that out.

I’m still optimistic about the whole plan though. I just am happy to be gathering extra info here and I really appreciate the extra comments from people who have been there and done that.

 

[strvger]

^ good for you!! don't give up the dream, ever.

 

[rickf92592]

Sportsman truck in SCORE is where you want to be.
Its cheaper and more open because its not a Pro class or a money class, more for people like yourself.
Building to class rules (7,7sx,6, etc) will always cost more.
That being said, you still have to comply with a ton of safety rules and that isn't cheap.
The SNORE rules for 1450 are a pretty good guideline for what you'd be looking at until you get your SCORE rulebook.
Don't underestimate the support needs, generally for every dollar you spend on the race vehicle you'll spend two on support (spares, chase, etc.).

I know it seems like I'm trying to discourage you but ever since Dust to Glory came out we've seen a ton of under-prepared efforts and disappointed people.

Why do I care? There is a very limited amount of rescue/SAR/assistance resources in Baja. So someone who is under-prepared might consume resources that may be needed for a more serious situation.
Every year, we lose some lives at the 1000.
I wish it wasn't so but that's reality.
I have personally lost friends down there.

Please seriously consider my idea of getting a bunch of guys together and coming down to the San Felipe 250, you can't buy the kind of knowledge (and good time) you receive.

Oh, and start practicing your welding now. You've got a bunch of metal to melt together.

Health permitting (I had a truck crush me, 12 broken ribs, punctured lung, 9 fractured vertibrae, AC separation), I may do a pit at the 250. If its a visual (unplanned, emergency pit) and you guys aren't a bunch of Richard Craniums (weatherman joke), I'd probably be willing to have you out there and show you the ropes.

 

[TheUndeadRanger]

haha i wonder how many out there actually caught that joke. my bet, about 3% that'll ever read this thread. and i would love to head out to the races, anyone have a say in making a trip to the races sometime in the next couple years? haha got too much crap on my plate to make it any time soon sadly or i'd help organize a trip to the next race in line!

 

[Oldschooljeep48]

Sportsman truck in SCORE is where you want to be.
Its cheaper and more open because its not a Pro class or a money class, more for people like yourself.
Building to class rules (7,7sx,6, etc) will always cost more.
That being said, you still have to comply with a ton of safety rules and that isn't cheap.
The SNORE rules for 1450 are a pretty good guideline for what you'd be looking at until you get your SCORE rulebook.
Don't underestimate the support needs, generally for every dollar you spend on the race vehicle you'll spend two on support (spares, chase, etc.).

I know it seems like I'm trying to discourage you but ever since Dust to Glory came out we've seen a ton of under-prepared efforts and disappointed people.

Why do I care? There is a very limited amount of rescue/SAR/assistance resources in Baja. So someone who is under-prepared might consume resources that may be needed for a more serious situation.
Every year, we lose some lives at the 1000.
I wish it wasn't so but that's reality.
I have personally lost friends down there.

Please seriously consider my idea of getting a bunch of guys together and coming down to the San Felipe 250, you can't buy the kind of knowledge (and good time) you receive.

Oh, and start practicing your welding now. You've got a bunch of metal to melt together.

Health permitting (I had a truck crush me, 12 broken ribs, punctured lung, 9 fractured vertibrae, AC separation), I may do a pit at the 250. If its a visual (unplanned, emergency pit) and you guys aren't a bunch of Richard Craniums (weatherman joke), I'd probably be willing to have you out there and show you the ropes.

Well Rick, I apreciate your input and offer. If i can make it there, I will let you know! The bad part is that from Chicago, its about 2500 mi one way, so gas would be a killer. Also, Im in Landscaping, so even though Im not out in the field, March is really hard to take any time off in and Im guessing id need a week or so.

So what are the entracne fees for these races? Even if I cant build a truck and compete for what I want, Im still curious how far off I am and what it takes. I know you mentioned pit crews and chase veh, but would I really need that many? What would be a bare minium? And you number for lights, is that top of the line or something? It just sounds really high. Wouldnt some good KC daylighters work? Man if you were closer Id try to take you out for a beer and pick your brain...

 

[rickf92592]

Well Rick, I apreciate your input and offer. If i can make it there, I will let you know! The bad part is that from Chicago, its about 2500 mi one way, so gas would be a killer. Also, Im in Landscaping, so even though Im not out in the field, March is really hard to take any time off in and Im guessing id need a week or so.

So what are the entracne fees for these races? Even if I cant build a truck and compete for what I want, Im still curious how far off I am and what it takes. I know you mentioned pit crews and chase veh, but would I really need that many? What would be a bare minium? And you number for lights, is that top of the line or something? It just sounds really high. Wouldnt some good KC daylighters work? Man if you were closer Id try to take you out for a beer and pick your brain...

This is based on a peninsula run, a loop is moderately cheaper.

Fees;
The 2010 Baja 1000 Sportsman entry fees were $2000.00, plus $75.00 membership for each competitor, plus $425.00 lease for IriTrack (plus $375.00 mounting kit), Baja Pits charged $895.00 plus you needed to provide 11 gallon dump cans ($120.00 each) with your fuel in them (2-3 per pit X 10 pits), at least 2 satellite phones (1 in the race car and 1 in the head chase vehicle) $200.00, insurance on all the vehicles you take down (including the race car if you're smart).

The reason you need so many chase crews ( 2 bare minimum, 4 is better) is the difficulty getting around (especially during a race) and staying ahead of the race car. You really need to spend some time in Baja to fully appreciate this.
Because to don't know where you'll need stuff, you end up outfitting all the vehicles with tools, spares, consumables, at least 2 spare tires, etc, etc, etc.
The bare minimum you'll need for tires is;
6 on the race car
2 on each chase truck (4 is better)
1 at every pit X 8-10 (2 is better)
+2 at scheduled rear changes (probably twice)
+2 at scheduled front changes (probably once)
That means you need 24 to 48 tires and wheels.
Now some of you think I'm exagerating but think through the math. You won't use all of them (some spares are a race old) but you don't know where you'll use them because you WILL have flats.

Pre-running:
One week is a absolute minimum for pre-running. Pre-running isn't just about being able to go fast; it is about placing pits, spotting access for chase vehicles, etc, etc. It is also about being able to race and chase safely come race day.
Do NOT pre-run in your race vehicle unless you have personally repealed Murphy's Law. For a lot of us, bikes are a good option but require support.

I cannot understate the importance of good comms. Most of Baja (where you'll race) does not have cell coverage and many cellular plans don't work worth a crap in Baja.
Race radios (75W 2 meter HAMS that are modded, shush) with a mag mount antennae for the chase rigs can be had for about $250.00 ea.
You MUST have GPS in your chase trucks as well (obviously) in the race car.
A lot of GPS units don't support GOOD Baja maps. The maps aren't that expensive but a lot of them only cover the major towns.

Safety gear is pretty cut and dry. If you buy used (which is fine) make sure items aren't out of date for competition.

You need to have relief drivers and co-dawgs ready. We had a co-dawg in the 6 truck start puking (inside his full-face helmet with the dust-sealing skirt)10 miles into his stint. His name is now Chuck. Another guy at the next pit had to scratch together enough gear and ride to the following pit where a regular co-dawg could climb in.

There's a ton more but I'm tired right now.

 

[TheUndeadRanger]

well i have a HAM radio operators licinse and i have a few myself, in storage in Page Arizona, set aside for such an occasion, or you can buy one cheap for around $100 modded to the max and ready to use for long distance communication. and about biking across the baja, done it, its nuts, there is this thing called monkey-butt, believe me, its hot sweaty and ridiculously dry, have your crew handy at all times if you choose that route, either way have some help near by and be ready for some sh*t.

 

[Bennybooster]

I would start with a smaller closer race, maybe consider tuff trucks, its cheaper and an easy in to motor sports

 

[alwaysFlOoReD]

This is based on a peninsula run, a loop is moderately cheaper.

Fees;
The 2010 Baja 1000 Sportsman entry fees were $2000.00, plus $75.00 membership for each competitor, plus $425.00 lease for IriTrack (plus $375.00 mounting kit), Baja Pits charged $895.00 plus you needed to provide 11 gallon dump cans ($120.00 each) with your fuel in them (2-3 per pit X 10 pits), at least 2 satellite phones (1 in the race car and 1 in the head chase vehicle) $200.00, insurance on all the vehicles you take down (including the race car if you're smart).

The reason you need so many chase crews ( 2 bare minimum, 4 is better) is the difficulty getting around (especially during a race) and staying ahead of the race car. You really need to spend some time in Baja to fully appreciate this.
Because to don't know where you'll need stuff, you end up outfitting all the vehicles with tools, spares, consumables, at least 2 spare tires, etc, etc, etc.
The bare minimum you'll need for tires is;
6 on the race car
2 on each chase truck (4 is better)
1 at every pit X 8-10 (2 is better)
+2 at scheduled rear changes (probably twice)
+2 at scheduled front changes (probably once)
That means you need 24 to 48 tires and wheels.
Now some of you think I'm exagerating but think through the math. You won't use all of them (some spares are a race old) but you don't know where you'll use them because you WILL have flats.

Pre-running:
One week is a absolute minimum for pre-running. Pre-running isn't just about being able to go fast; it is about placing pits, spotting access for chase vehicles, etc, etc. It is also about being able to race and chase safely come race day.
Do NOT pre-run in your race vehicle unless you have personally repealed Murphy's Law. For a lot of us, bikes are a good option but require support.

I cannot understate the importance of good comms. Most of Baja (where you'll race) does not have cell coverage and many cellular plans don't work worth a crap in Baja.
Race radios (75W 2 meter HAMS that are modded, shush) with a mag mount antennae for the chase rigs can be had for about $250.00 ea.
You MUST have GPS in your chase trucks as well (obviously) in the race car.
A lot of GPS units don't support GOOD Baja maps. The maps aren't that expensive but a lot of them only cover the major towns.

Safety gear is pretty cut and dry. If you buy used (which is fine) make sure items aren't out of date for competition.

You need to have relief drivers and co-dawgs ready. We had a co-dawg in the 6 truck start puking (inside his full-face helmet with the dust-sealing skirt)10 miles into his stint. His name is now Chuck. Another guy at the next pit had to scratch together enough gear and ride to the following pit where a regular co-dawg could climb in.

There's a ton more but I'm tired right now.

I'm glad you're taking the time to educate us, please don't stop. I'll never have the money to do the 1000 unless I win a lottery.... but I can still dream and live vicariously through someone like 'O...48'. I also have started racing short course up here in Canada, which can be done a whole lot cheaper than Baja. So far I've spent about C$6,000.00, half of which is safety related. I don't expect I would be even close to competitive in the states but it's all new up here and still 'grassroots' racing. I've been on the track [ in Canada] with guys that race in the states, and their trucks range in cost from C$30,000.00 to C$60,000.00, never mind support vehicles and fuel and, and, and..... But most of the people I'm racing are mainly people like me, racers on a tight budget. I'm having some relatively cheap fun, and if all of them crash [God forbid], I might win! One thing I have found out, and was told by many people, is that it's much cheaper to buy a used race truck rather than start from scratch.
'O...48', don't give up the dream, even if the dream changes slightly.

Richard