89 Linked Ranger Build (LOTS of pics)

[kemicalburns]

I want to see some rear flex pics

 

[Mud-Nut]

I don't know why you're still trying to convince me that the trac bar mount is insufficient....? Are you unable to read?? Or do I need to bold it and enlarge it for you?

We also plan to put another plate (with a gusset or two) on the bottom (90 degrees of the main plate), so it can bolt to the bottom of the frame as well. But it was pretty impossible to do so when the truck was 60 miles away from our shop in the bush. And we'll only proceed with these plans if we use the trac bar setup for the front suspension whenever we redo it. But regardless of these possible plans, the new trac bar mount is still much stronger than the first one!!

But, just for the heck of it...... Let me evaluate the pics you posted of trac bar setups. That first setup really doesn't look all that great. How thick is the plate used? Looks to be about 1/4" thick.... Which, we found out is too thin!!!! I'd love to do a stress analysis on it, cause I'm willing to bet it wouldn't be much stronger than our original one (assuming that's 1/4" plate). And that second setup looks cool.... But, unless the frame is boxed in or strengthened somehow, I could see that tearing off the frame. Welding on the frame like that, especially all the way around, greatly weakens it. But judging by those welds, I'm sure the guy knows what he's doing!! So it's probably a good setup. I'd need more information to actually say it's good or bad.

Anyways... Here's what got me:

I've been doing this long enough that I'm not impressed by most cobbled together parts or builds.

So what are you trying to say here? I'm pretty sure that's a cheap shot at this particular project!?!?! Which led me to check out your own build thread..... From the way you're talking, I'd imagine it would be quite the build!!! And wow, was I wrong!!!! Looked like a pretty typical build.... But the best part was when I saw a picture of your trac bar setup..... Not only does it only go halfway up the frame, but it's also welded on!!!!!! And here you are trying to tell me to gusset ours?? No wonder you posted pics of someone elses setups!!!! HAHAHAHAHA!!!!

On the other hand... Regardless of all this arguing.... We will run it the way it is for now. If it breaks, then we'll build it stronger!!!!

what are you using for the coil buckets on the bottum?

We built them ourselves... Out of whatever steel we could find. We just so happen to have those cup looking things sitting in our pile of steel, which worked perfect.

I want to see some rear flex pics

There's LOTS of pics on the first page... What more could you ask for? More flexing pics will come when we redo the front.

 

[RangerRyan88]

LOVIN' the build!! I'm a desert-type of guy myself but I always like seeing 4 links and SAS's
2 questions too, any idea of how much wheel travel are you guys getting with those XJ coils?
And how did you figure out the geometry of the links? Like lengths, mounting points, that kind of stuff.
TIA and can't wait to see the front end as flexy as the back and all the work looks really good

 

[84projectFORD]

your truck is lookin pretty good. Like ryan above im real heavy in to the desert racing side of things but i like the idea you have of adjustable ride height, it would really have to be beefed up for my application but cool idea.

as far as the track bar mount, have the right idea to make the plate thicker but down the road it will probably still break, if not bend should he get the front tires in a bind somewhere and try to turn the wheels left or right. I know you made the plate go further down on the tube but in the pic i show below the bending/breaking point is still there as the tube is not against the frame to help spread the side load it is getting into the frame.

now by adding the gussets here it would eliminate that bending/breaking point. Just trying to help explain why that may still crack/break down the road. it may never break but when you 60 miles out like you said you guys were id rather know that bad boy aint gunna break again. From all the desert racing i do i find its better to overbuild than to think its strong enough as it is but to each his own. Hope this helps some

 

[ryan]

EDIT:
Here's a decent example of a home-brew track bar mount that "Nobody" built several years ago (It's in our own Tech Library):

Notice how much of the plate is consumed by the mount and it's gusseting? That helps distribute the load to all three steering box bolts, as well as through the two vertical bolts mounted underneath the frame. I'm not sure why there is a large gap in there, I would leave that out and weld completely around the corner of the frame. Many people also build a support arm to tie this mount back into the engine crossmember for extra insurance.

it's interesting to look back on his build - it was one of the better 44 swaps i had seen at the time, and now i look at his steering and cringe

 

[Rinny650]

The picture that 84ford posted is what johnny has been saying to do. What broke your bracket the first time is when the track bar pushed to the left side the truck it snapped the mount at the top of the bracket where it met flat plate. Just cut a few 90* pieces about 1"x1" to put on top of the square tube.

 

[hummer_maxxer]

ok first of all, that bend point makes no sence, it would have to break 2 bolts for it to bend there, very unlikely because there in tension. and you people got to learn to read what he wrote, it was a quick fix to get out of the bush, we plans on making it stronger when we rebuild the front suspention, witch is soon.
SO STOP WITH THE TRACK BAR MOUNT

 

[Mud-Nut]

LOVIN' the build!! I'm a desert-type of guy myself but I always like seeing 4 links and SAS's
2 questions too, any idea of how much wheel travel are you guys getting with those XJ coils?
And how did you figure out the geometry of the links? Like lengths, mounting points, that kind of stuff.
TIA and can't wait to see the front end as flexy as the back and all the work looks really good

Thanks dude!!!
We're getting quite a bit of wheel travel with the XJ coils.... Up to 2.5 feet, but that's including the front, which is only flexing 4 or 5 inches at best (stupid TTB coils, hahaha). So it's around 2 feet of wheel travel or so.
As for figuring out the geometry..... We just did some reading online!!!! There's TONS of information out there.

Thats all that was needed to be said. nut made it come off as though this was the final bracket and the guy would be runnin it like that till it broke again. Reading what he wrote is hard to do when things can be misunderstood. Being a smart ass about stuff does not help either

I said it once, and then quoted myself AGAIN.... Yet, you still misunderstood the fact that it'll get beefed up later on during this build??? I'm tempted to quote myself once more, just incase you can't find it up there, but that would probably be considered being a smart ass?!?!

The picture that 84ford posted is what johnny has been saying to do.

Yup, I realized that. Which is why I didn't bother commenting on the picture that he drew...... I completely understood what Johnny was saying (not once did I ask for more of an explanation or anything like that). So I didn't see the point of the picture!

 

[oatmealman]

Thanks dude!!!
We're getting quite a bit of wheel travel with the XJ coils.... Up to 2.5 feet, but that's including the front, which is only flexing 4 or 5 inches at best (stupid TTB coils, hahaha). So it's around 2 feet of wheel travel or so.
As for figuring out the geometry..... We just did some reading online!!!! There's TONS of information out there.



I said it once, and then quoted myself AGAIN.... Yet, you still misunderstood the fact that it'll get beefed up later on during this build??? I'm tempted to quote myself once more, just incase you can't find it up there, but that would probably be considered being a smart ass?!?!

stop coming off like a douche,Johnny u and most of the Sas guys here know more than you could ever learn.If welding to the frame is so bad,please explain why 90% of pirate 4x4 does it and most of them are running 38's + and they actually romp their ****ing shit.

 

[Mud-Nut]

stop coming off like a douche,Johnny u and most of the Sas guys here know more than you could ever learn.If welding to the frame is so bad,please explain why 90% of pirate 4x4 does it and most of them are running 38's + and they actually romp their ****ing shit.

That was a very mature post. Yet you want me banned? Haha! I gotta say, the vulgar language added much enthusiasm, unfortunately it diminished your intelligence.

But all hail Pirate4x4 guys!!!! They must know everything!!!! LOL!!! Did you know I'm a member of Pirate4x4, so does that make me a "pirate guy"? I mean, it's a forum, and it's free to join, so I don't think it makes me anything special. Don't get me wrong, I love Pirate4x4!!!!! Absolutely awesome community!!!! I'm constantly on there!!!! But the way your post came across just made me laugh. I'd like to know where you got that 90% statistic as well? Haha!

I'd also love to hear why all the "Sas guys" know more than I'll ever know?? I have nothing against the "Sas guys", but you seem to personally know ME and ALL OF THEM? I'm sure I could learn stuff from some of them, and I'm sure they could learn stuff from me (isn't that the point of a forum????).

P.S. We've welded on our frame, MANY TIMES!!!! It's done where it's appropriate. I never said it was a "bad" thing to do, it simply weakens it. Just as it weakens ANY metal. A frame is normally not very thick, hence the reasoning for boxing in a frame.

 

[oatmealman]

I'd like to think it was mature.I see nothing of the nature that was saying you should get banned? are you high? Just because your a member of pirate doesn't mean your smart enough to contribute.Your adjustable ride height will kill you (at least I hope so).You sure overbuilt your truck with that whole stop sign post material for your adjustable ride height.Even if they could learn stuff from you I'm sure they wouldn't want too.Welding the track bar mount to the frame is plenty appropriate,Go look at some competition buggys/trucks and I'll bet you they are all welded and they run harder in a day then you do in 10 years.If you wanna talk mature you can personally attack me all you want.I've just got one thing to say to you.Fighting on the internet is like competing in the special Olympics,even if you win YOU'RE still retarded.Enjoy have a nice night and have fun dying.

 

[oatmealman]

oh and I completely pulled that statistic out of my ass,just go browse pirate in the REAL tech section like oh lets see,jeep hardcore tech,and Toyota are the only real tech sections.Everyone else just kinda leeches off them.

 

[Mud-Nut]

The reason it's adjustable, is for trying out different spring rates. I don't see what is wrong with that? Yes, the ride height COULD be changed with it, but it wont be. The suspension was designed at that particular ride height, to work properly with that ride height. But what happens if we want to experiment with a 4" lift coil (for spring rate purposes). Then the suspension would have to be rebuilt without the adjustable coil buckets!!! Now, it's easy to bolt in the different coils and keep the exact same ride height. Who knows where this project will go...... So it's very possible that different spring rates will be necessary!

In some cases, yes, welding the trac bar mount is appropriate. Every single build is different. How could you compary a buggy to some truck frame? Haha!! Every frame is different. In the case of Johnny, it appears as though his trac bar runs halfway up the frame (no higher than ours), and it's welded to a frame that is most likely less than 1/4" thick. And now that he welded onto it, I think it would rip off much easier than ours did, if he abused the truck. But oh well.

As for the rest of your post, well.... I'm not gonna bother replying to it. Most of it is irrelevant to the project.

 

[Maverick]

Both of you need to chill out, enough of the personal attacks.

 

[Welder0800]

I just thought I would say that a weld will be stronger than the base material if done corretly but shoulden't weaken it. Now with that being said sometimes you will need to preheat and or post heat material to make sure neither one breaks. I am not attacking anyone's welding ability because for one a picture on the internet is not the best way to judge a weld.