84 2.8 swap into an 86 2.9 truck

[JoshT]

I'm looking to do a swap that I know is kinda backwards from the norm, and am hoping to pick y'alls brains a bit.

I have a good 5K mile 2.8 in a dead 84 Ranger. I have gotten a line on a good 86 Ranger with a dead 2.9 for $500. The 84 is a LWB, the 86 is SWB, and both are regular cab. Since I have my 2.8 set up with Duraspark II the wiring will be just like swapping in a V8 that shouldn't be a problem. In fact I'll probably just get a universal wiring harness and do away with nearly all of the factory wiring.

Q1) If the two were both LWB trucks I'd just swap the tanks, but this is not an option. What do I need to do with the 2.9 fuel system to feed the Holley 4bbl on my 2.8? I have considered a fuel cell and but it is an extreme last resort.

Q2) My understanding from the tech library is that both of these trucks use the TK5 transmission. As such I should be able to unbolt my motor from one transmission and have it bolt up directly to the other right? With the same transmission and practically the same motor the flywheel and clutch from my 2.8 should work on the 2.9 TK5 shouldn't it?

Q3) If this truck has ABS I want to keep it. That said how did the abs on these trucks operate was it mechanical using some sort of pressure differential or was it electronic? If the latter is there a way I can keep it while removing the engine computer and most of the wiring?

Q4) ... I forgot but when I remember it I'll add it to the list.

 

[BeaterMan]

i believe you could pull out the intank pump and put in just a fuel float for a non efi vehicle then run a frame mounted low psi(5-10psi) pump to feed the carb.

yes the trans from the other truck will interchange with the 2.8. All 2.8,2.9,and 4.0 use the same trans bolt pattern.

if either vehicle has abs, there will be a small sensor mounted on the rear axle, and it is electrical but i cannot tell ya what its wired to.

 

[alaskan155]

time to add the 3.8 tbi upgrade to the 2.8 then you dont gotta mess with the tank

 

[JoshT]

i believe you could pull out the intank pump and put in just a fuel float for a non efi vehicle then run a frame mounted low psi(5-10psi) pump to feed the carb.

I thought about that but aren't the fuel level sender units different according to the tank size and therefore wheelbase? I'm not to worried about a frame mounted electric pump for the carb, the 2.8 has a mechanical fuel pump and it alone has always supplied enough fuel to feed the carb.

time to add the 3.8 tbi upgrade to the 2.8 then you dont gotta mess with the tank

If I were to install EFI it would be an aftermarket system. That way it could easily be moved to a bigger engine if the need ever were to arise. For now I am sitcking with a carb on it.

 

[Psychopete]

I run an adjustable return style fuel pressure regulator for my Holley 4bbl.

 

[strvger]

i found a 27 gal. aluminum gas tank from a boat. fits right in my bed no problem. best part, $50 plus about that much more for new fittings, hose, etc.

 

[dangerranger83]

time to add the 3.8 tbi upgrade to the 2.8 then you dont gotta mess with the tank

Did this to mine works great and doing the same thing to my dads truck this weekend. The one thing you need is a fuel regulator, mine is a non return style but the TBI has a return on it, and costed me $28 total off ebay.

 

[JoshT]

Yes I am aware that you did it, I was heavy into your thread when it started and was already looking into the parts to do it my self when you started doing the install on your truck. Right now I can't even drive my truck, and I don't want to mess with EFI on it for the time being. If and When I do it will be either an aftermarket EFI (assuming I can find a unit small enough) or a cobbled together Mega Squirt system, the latter mostly because I want to play with MS. For now I am going to assemble this truck with the motor mostly as is, and focus on my suspension to begin with. I am only planning to run the 2.8 for a couple years because I aim to have one of the first EcoBoost first gens in a couple of years (aka as soon as I can afford to and hope not many if any have beat me to it). I don't want to set up a working EFI on the 2.8 only to rip it back out for that swap, which will also be accompanied by a few more custom items built specifically for this truck. The goal right now is to get the two trucks turned into one and back on the road for as little money as I can. On top of that I have the original 390 Holley Double pumper I would like to have professionally cleaned and rebuilt, because the truck ran it's best with that carb and has sucked with the vacuum secondary unit that's on it now.

First off I'll check out BeaterMan's suggestion and see if the sending unit from my 84 can fit into the 86, don't think it will but it's worth a shot. If that doesn't work I'll have to look at the unit but I have an idea that the pump could be removed and replaced with some type of tubing to locate the pickup in the same location. I plan to remove the bed to do the rear suspension work anyway.

As for the ABS I'll worry about it when the time comes because I think, not sure just think, that I am going to install an Explorer 8.8 w/Disc in a spring under configuration with 1" lift shackles to net a 3" drop.

Currently the plan is:
1) Remove bed, fenders, hood, grille.
2) Remove all I the 2.9 EFI wiring can get rid of
3) Lower front 3"
5) Install 1 1/16" front sway bar
6) Install Front Edelbrock IAS shocks
7) Install 2.8
8) Wire 2.8
9) Figure out fuel supply issue
10) Lower rear 3"
11) Install 1" rear sway bar
12) Install Rear Edelbrock IAS Shocks
13) Install Wheels & Tires from '84 Ranger which has the stock 16" ones from the '99

I am going to forget about the universal harness for now and stick withe the factory harness. I just need to figure ouw which wires to tap into for the 2.8L. I was about to ask when I remembered that swapping in a durasparked 2.8 is identical to a durasparked 5.0 in regards to wiring. I just need to dig into the v8 swap forum and find it since the only V8 swap instructions I can find in the tech library are for EFI engines.

 

[Psychopete]

I just need to figure ouw which wires to tap into for the 2.8L. I was about to ask when I remembered that swapping in a durasparked 2.8 is identical to a durasparked 5.0 in regards to wiring. I just need to dig into the v8 swap forum and find it since the only V8 swap instructions I can find in the tech library are for EFI engines.

The Helm Inc. diagram helped big time on my Durasparked 5.0L. Between this and having a diagram outlining a Duraspark/GM HEI hybrid system (but with a TFI-IV coil), that is all I really needed to do all of it. Including my new gauge cluster. If you have the wire, wire loom, and a soldering iron, have at it.. Just need to plan ahead on the wiring to do it cleanly. Mine's not bad, but I am looking at it now and thinking it could have been better. But not better enough that I am going to redo it LOL.

Pete

 

[dangerranger83]

I've compaired a 2.9 sending unit to an 2.8 sending unit and have to say there is a difference. The 2.9 has a bigger top on it then the 2.8. But since the 2.9 is a return system, just use the return line as your main feed line but take the little rubber peice at the end off and dont let you fuel level get to low or it wont get fuel and just plug off the one with the electric pump, I've seen people do this.

Another way is to remove the high pressure pump from the system and just use the intank low pressure pump.

Theres like 10 different ways of doing this, some easy some not. My ways I listed may save you money.

 

[JoshT]

Another way is to remove the high pressure pump from the system and just use the intank low pressure pump.

I am thinking about going this route my only concern is the pressure supplied by the in tank pump. 1) Would it be capable of constantly feeding enough fuel? 2) What pressure is it rated at?

For the record I can say doing this at low cost while making mods I mentioned above because I already have dream beams, sway bars, and all new bushings that were intended for the 84 sitting at the house. Exactly where they were a year ago.

 

[dangerranger83]

There are guys using the low pressure pump on carbed 302's they put in their rangers. It is rated a 7psi and if that is to much, a carb. fuel regulator doesnt run to much at autozone, advanced auto parts, etc..... it can take it down to 5.5 psi or maybe lower.

 

[JoshT]

yeah I looked at the holley site and they said minimum 5, max 7.5 PSI with a minimum 3/8 hose on my carb. Given that I'd want a regulator to bump the pressure down to about 6 psi.

My other concern for the fuel pump is how to power it. I can keep the Inertia switch, and the stock relay. I like how when you switch the key to on it runs for a second and switches off to prime the system, then stays off till you start the vehicle. From what I can tell this is done by the ECM which I will be removing. Is there any way to do this without the module, or is it something internal to the pump? If I am sitting there in a situation wher the truck is KOEO fro an extended period, for what ever reason, I don't want for the truck to be running the pump constantly with the engine off.

...more to post but I gotta leave for now...

 

[dangerranger83]

There are a few options. The factory relay keeps the pumps running after shutting the truck off/no, not the ECM, how I know this, my truck doesnt have the factory relay, and once the truck is shut off so do the pumps, as for my dads truck that now is converted over and has the factory relay. The factory relay has a capasitor in it that keeps the relay on for those few seconds keeping the pumps on, to A) prime the system when first turned on and to B) when shut off, to pervent vapor lock (FORD said that).

Another way is to get after market relays (4 prong) and hook the side that switches it to turn on to a 12v "key on" source and hook a 12v "live at all times wire" to the side that is made to hadle the higher current.

The inertia switch is just that, a switch but a safety one that can be hooked into the wiring for the after market set-up so it can perform its job. As for my truck and my dads, we just used a relay as the switch meaning no saftey (and it wired the same as the other switch mentioned above) The only thig with this set-up is when you turn the key on the pumps will be on, this allows you to prime the system yourself and when the key is turned the pumps turn off immedialty (I've not had a problem with vapor lock).

I know my words might be confusing but this is one of those things thats easier done then said.

 

[JoshT]

Well this swap is no longer a maybe, it's now going to happen. I went and looked at the truck today and it's now sitting in my back yard.

I think I have the wiring for the Duraspark II figured out but need to get another set of eyes on it. I'm going to attach a copy. The black wiring is stock. The red wire is stock that I think I can remove but I'm not sure. The green is the Duraspark system that I am adding, and how I think it should be tied in. I cobbled this together from an 86 2.9 wiring diagram, the diagrams in the tech library, a diagram I found on a mustang site, and my own modifications.

The second image I am attaching is a rough diagram of who I was thinking on powering the fuel pump. Just not sure how to accomplish it or if there's a better way.


click on images for larger pics