83 Ranger Idling at 20 BTDC

[Jason_1984]

Hello I'm new to the website. I have a 1983 Ford Ranger 2.3 manual 4 speed that is idling extremely rough. I lined up all the timing marks on cam and crank and rotor was pointing at cylinder #1. Undid the Vacuum line to the distributor. According to the timing light I am at 20 BTDC at idle. If I am not mistaken this is supposed to be at 6BTDC at idle. If I put to 6BTDC with timing light it almost dies (and doesn't seem to really line up with #1 one anymore) . I have triple checked cam and crank timing marks and that the rotor points at #1. I am getting a pretty strong exhaust smell but no visible smoke. If I am not mistaken there should not be a "tooth off" situation because I can turn the distributor right?? Anyways I need some help. If anybody has any insight please let me know.


Recently did head gasket. Had valves machined by a machine shop. New plugs, wires, cap, and rotor. New Coil. New Distributor. New timing belt. Replaced the PCV valve. New Carburetor. Most vacuum lines replaced. Has compression. Also replaced the ignition module.

I am thinking there is a component that is delaying my ignition. If anybody has any input/ideas it is greatly appreciated. Its driving me crazy!!!

 

[94RoadkillRanger]

This reminds me of something I did over 20 years ago, twisted the crankshaft. The timing marks all lined up and the distributor was in the correct tooth but the timing was way off. Also the crankshaft to harmonic balancer key was half sheared so I replaced it but it would not run unless I put the damaged key wedge back into place.

However, check the points, gap/dwell. Try your old points and condenser. I have had brand new generic condensers not work. Feel for play between he distributor and the cam / intermediate shaft which ever you have. The intermediate shaft could be a tooth off (bad). On my 94 it only runs the pump so it does not have to be on any particular tooth, but yours matters.

 

[Jason_1984]

Well that doesn't sound like any fun. Forgive me I'm no mechanic. Does my distributor have points?? If so how do you set them? Also can you explain why being a tooth off is any different then rotating the distributor. Again forgive my lack of knowledge on this topic.

 

[black_demon69]

No points so no dwell to check
I would make sure that the roll pin on distributer gear isn't sheared
double check timing marks on the timing belt (cam & crank)
verify that cylinder 1 is at tdc on compression stroke before reinserting distributer
set timing per procedure if memory serves my 78 Mustang II 2.3l was set to either 8 or 10 degrees atdc could be wrong though. It should be on emissions sticker under the hood

 

[Jason_1984]

Hey I appreciate the input. I have had a heck of a time with this thing. Made sure I had the compression stroke and timing marks lined up. Rotor points at #one. I have a pretty new distributor in there. (within 6 months) Is there something inside the distributor that needs to be lined up specifically or pointing at #1 other than the rotor? (perhaps a dumb question) I have for the most part free range to turn my distributor when trying to set the timing. Meaning there isn't any engine components stopping me from turning the distributor from side to side. A buddy of mine told me to pull the connector to the distributor and also the vacuum advance to set the timing. When I pull the electronic connector the car will die and not start. Plug it in and she will idle rough and the timing is at 20*BTDC. I'm really leaning towards a component trying to compensate and tricking the computer into retarding the timing. Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[black_demon69]

Hey I appreciate the input. I have had a heck of a time with this thing. Made sure I had the compression stroke and timing marks lined up. Rotor points at #one. I have a pretty new distributor in there. (within 6 months) Is there something inside the distributor that needs to be lined up specifically or pointing at #1 other than the rotor? (perhaps a dumb question) I have for the most part free range to turn my distributor when trying to set the timing. Meaning there isn't any engine components stopping me from turning the distributor from side to side. A buddy of mine told me to pull the connector to the distributor and also the vacuum advance to set the timing. When I pull the electronic connector the car will die and not start. Plug it in and she will idle rough and the timing is at 20*BTDC. I'm really leaning towards a component trying to compensate and tricking the computer into retarding the timing. Any help is greatly appreciated.

the electrical connector on the distributor is for the pick up coil inside and there is nothing to adjust internally so maybe you just need to turn it....

 

[Jason_1984]

I am able to turn the distributor clockwise until it eventually dies. I am also able to turn counterclockwise until it eventually dies. (thinking it gets too far from the contact). There is really no sweet spot in between. It does get a little better in a certain spot but idle always stays rough. Even when I find the best running spot I can visually see the truck shaking the idle is so bad. Engine mounts seem ok.

 

[Big Jim M]

Jason it sounds to me like that engine has a "spout" which needs to be disconnected before the timing can be set. The spout is a disconnect that is between the computer and the distributor.
Most times it is on the passenger side of the engine sort of below the air cleaner.
What it looks like is two wires hanging with a PLUG on the end. This PLUG simply connects one of the wires to the other making the connection complete from the computer to the dist. So what you do is disconnect the PLUG and start the engine and then set the timing to where it belongs. Then start the engine and the timing should be correct as the computer thinks is needed. 20* is not higher than what I usually see in computer timed engines.
After properly setting the timing go ahead and check it again and you will most likely see the same timing as before resetting the timing.
Big Jim

 

[Jason_1984]

I thought I found the spout and pulled it yesterday. I pulled the plug coming directly out of the distributor. The truck died and would not restart. Is this perhaps the wrong connection?? Some history of the vehicle: I would also like to add that I have heard this truck run great in the past. At first it ran perfect then after a while seemed to develop a slight miss. Then carb went (had black smoke coming from tailpipe. put on new carb and smoke did stop. Had to get carb adjusted a few times as the air mixture was off. Finally got it to idle good then about 2 weeks later at random it would start to have a minor rough idle. The idle eventually got worse and worse. Finally I had enough and I noticed timing marks weren't lined up at that point so I corrected that. replaced a bunch of parts(listed first post) Now the marks line up but idles like a piece of junk still. I smell a strong smell of gas coming from the exhaust but no visible smoke just scent...... I could be missing something here but if I am correct the only components that are not new is the EGR valve, PCV pipes, I did bench test the idle mixture control solenoid and It clicked when I applied power. I plan on having someone help me try to pull codes tonight with the OBD1.

 

[huh?]

is the plug wire order going in the correct direction? following the rotation of the rotor?

a few years ago someone broke into my sentra and took the distributor and plug wires. i got another from a good friend and quickly threw it on but instead of 1-3-4-2 i put them in 1-2-4-3. ran like doodoo but it did drive. i was so sure that i had done the installation correctly that i went through a ton of other things before i realised what should have been obvious from the get go- that i screwed up. switched wires 2 and 3 around and i would like to say that the sentra and i lived happily ever after but one of the rods was screwed by then.

so, yeah, the questions are just something to consider.

the story just for everyone's entertainment.

 

[Jason_1984]

I've had a few of those oops moments myself. I will triple check the wires but I am almost positive they are correct. When the engine above 2000 RPMs just sitting in the driveway it seems to smooth out. Or if I'm in gear and driving down the road I don't notice the rough idle. only when coasting in neutral and when stopped at idle.

 

[AndyB.]

The spot is a single wire connector (probably a yellow wire). It sounds like you unplugged the harness from the TFI module.

 

[Jason_1984]

I think your right...... I did look for that SPOUT connector but was not successful. Traced from PCM to distributor and nothing really stuck out to me.(no single wire in-line connectors) ......There is a single wire coming from a roughly 4 inch by 4 inch box above the fender (not the ignition module I think the regulator if not mistaken) but it doesn't go anywhere just hanging there....another thing is I can find the obd1 plug but I cannot find the single wire that is not part of the plug. (I don know the technical term for the wire) I looked on the internet for locations and descriptions for both wires but my old ranger unfortunately isn't that popular : ( Any ideas on locations of these 2 wires and perhaps a description of what they may look like.

 

[Big Jim M]

Once more

I think your right...... I did look for that SPOUT connector but was not successful. Traced from PCM to distributor and nothing really stuck out to me.(no single wire in-line connectors) ......There is a single wire coming from a roughly 4 inch by 4 inch box above the fender (not the ignition module I think the regulator if not mistaken) but it doesn't go anywhere just hanging there....another thing is I can find the obd1 plug but I cannot find the single wire that is not part of the plug. (I don know the technical term for the wire) I looked on the internet for locations and descriptions for both wires but my old ranger unfortunately isn't that popular : ( Any ideas on locations of these 2 wires and perhaps a description of what they may look like.

Jason reread my last post. What you are looking for is a wire just hanging (usually under the air cleaner that ends in a plastic thingy that can pull apart. Once apart the computer cannot control the dist advance. THEN you set the timing to 10* or whatever and then you put the plug back in. There ain't that many wires to look at!
Big Jim

 

[Mazda]

I don't know where the spout connector is on your year ranger but I can give you a pretty good idea of what it will look like.

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