CAFE standards... rolled back

[85_Ranger4x4]

unless something changed, i think ford still uses them on 6.7s

but anyways, more or less just trying to prove a point

I guess the newer Rangers did use them too, not sure if they retained them for the '24 remodel or not.

By and large though they have gone extinct.

 

[djfllmn]

i remember when my one nephew looked at the ranger and asked, where the button is to open the window...i got a chuckle out of that one

 

[Uncle Gump]

I had or maybe still do... hopes for a small truck.

I am preparing to be let down though.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

I had or maybe still do... hopes for a small truck.

I am preparing to be let down though.

It sounds good... but then I see that fisher price cheap Toyota thing overseas and that doesn't really do much for me either.

 

[djfllmn]

I really wish ford would have brought the falcon ute here to the states

 

[Uncle Gump]

It sounds good... but then I see that fisher price cheap Toyota thing overseas and that doesn't really do much for me either.

The other thing...

Not sure I'd want to do any serious road tripping in one.

I also get a sick feeling while thinking about sharing the road with full size trucks an SUVs.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

The other thing...

Not sure I'd want to do any serious road tripping in one.

I also get a sick feeling while thinking about sharing the road with full size trucks an SUVs.

On one hand I agree.

Then I think about the tin box I road trip in these days

 

[stmitch]

They said that it adds up to 109 billion dollars in savings for consumers.

Over 5 years. These savings would (theoretically) come from reduced new vehicle prices, but that assumes the OEMs don't just pocket the difference. The total works out to under $1k on an average new vehicle which costs ~$49k these days. And then, after paying $1k less up front, you get to burn more for fuel for the life of the vehicle. Looks like a gallon of 87 octane is about $2.89 right now nationally. So the upfront savings would pay for 345 gallons of fuel. If you get 30mpg, that initial savings disappears in 10k miles, and then it starts to cost you more after that.

Trump fuel economy rollback may make cars cheaper, but higher gas bills will absorb savings

The Trump administration's proposal to roll back Biden-era vehicle fuel-efficiency standards may save automakers in the U.S. tens of billions of dollars and potentially lower upfront purchase costs for American car buyers.

www.reuters.com

The same report that estimated the initial savings also estimated that the reduced fuel efficiency would cost Americans $185 billion.

Here's the 144 page NHTSA report that is the source of many of these claims if anybody feels like digging:

https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2025-12/CAFE-SAFE-MY-2022-2031-NPRM-PRIA-tag.pdf

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

Over 5 years. These savings would (theoretically) come from reduced new vehicle prices, but that assumes the OEMs don't just pocket the difference. The total works out to under $1k on an average new vehicle which costs ~$49k these days. And then, after paying $1k less up front, you get to burn more for fuel for the life of the vehicle. Looks like a gallon of 87 octane is about $2.89 right now nationally. So the upfront savings would pay for 345 gallons of fuel. If you get 30mpg, that initial savings disappears in 10k miles, and then it starts to cost you more after that.

Prices have to come down eventually or they won't be making vehicles anymore...

$50k won't get you much of anything. A equivalent of my pretty boring 2016 F-150 XLT is mid $60k now. It was $50k when I got it in 2022...

I agree, automakers won't give up a dime. They have been busy "decontenting" so far as it is. Taking options away from vehicles to maintain the same price. Look at tires, they kept hiking up because the cost of oil was high. Now that oil is down have they gotten any cheaper?

 

[stmitch]

Prices have to come down eventually or they won't be making vehicles anymore...

$50k won't get you much of anything. A equivalent of my pretty boring 2016 F-150 XLT is mid $60k now. It was $50k when I got it in 2022...

I agree, automakers won't give up a dime. They have been busy "decontenting" so far as it is. Taking options away from vehicles to maintain the same price. Look at tires, they kept hiking up because the cost of oil was high. Now that oil is down have they gotten any cheaper?

Or, they'll just continue to turn Americans into debt slaves by extending financing windows forever like they recently considered with 50 year mortgages.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

Or, they'll just continue to turn Americans into debt slaves by extending financing windows forever like they recently considered with 50 year mortgages.

In a lot of ways I think that ship has already sailed.

 

[19Walt93]

Prices won't come down, we'll just get used to them.
I started working at a Sunoco station in April of 1972, 6 weeks before graduating high school. I was paid $1.85 an hour- a $.25 raise over my previous job. We had 8 grades of gas with 103 octane 260 being the super premium- no one bought it unless their car was a real animal because $.46.9 per gallon was too much for gas. If you factor in inflation, it's cheaper now.
My first new car was a 77 Mustang, 2.8 V6, 4 speed that cost $4450 when I was making about $4-5 an hour.
When Obama proposed a 52mpg CAFE, the car companies said it would add $9000 to each vehicle. Subsidizing EV's instead of letting market performance prove their worth was a mistake. A vehicle that turns into hazardous lawn art when the battery (that costs more than the value of the car) fails isn't worth buying. If higher MPG is the goal, step one ought to be getting the alcohol out of our gas.

 

[Uncle Gump]

Over 5 years. These savings would (theoretically) come from reduced new vehicle prices, but that assumes the OEMs don't just pocket the difference. The total works out to under $1k on an average new vehicle which costs ~$49k these days. And then, after paying $1k less up front, you get to burn more for fuel for the life of the vehicle. Looks like a gallon of 87 octane is about $2.89 right now nationally. So the upfront savings would pay for 345 gallons of fuel. If you get 30mpg, that initial savings disappears in 10k miles, and then it starts to cost you more after that.

Trump fuel economy rollback may make cars cheaper, but higher gas bills will absorb savings

The Trump administration's proposal to roll back Biden-era vehicle fuel-efficiency standards may save automakers in the U.S. tens of billions of dollars and potentially lower upfront purchase costs for American car buyers.

www.reuters.com

The same report that estimated the initial savings also estimated that the reduced fuel efficiency would cost Americans $185 billion.

Here's the 144 page NHTSA report that is the source of many of these claims if anybody feels like digging:

https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2025-12/CAFE-SAFE-MY-2022-2031-NPRM-PRIA-tag.pdf

Still seems like a win to me.

You're a smart guy... and you know to eat an elephant you do it one bite at a time.

This is just one bite of the elephant.

 

[oldgeek]

I heard something of "tiny cars". I had a 1994 Geo Metro. I loved that coffin on wheels. It was comfortable for this 6'3" guy. I could drive it all day. It was my 50's car. It got 50mpg doing 55mph with a 55hp 3 cylinder engine. It might take 13 seconds to get to 60, but it takes me at least that long no matter what I drive. Mileage dropped to 45mpg doing 70. And hybrid car manufacturers these days brag about getting in the upper 30's for mpg.

 

[oldgeek]

If higher MPG is the goal, step one ought to be getting the alcohol out of our gas.

But... But... The farmers...