What did you do to your Ranger today? (Part Deux!)

[Rick W]

The antennas behind the cab appear to be high enough over the roof to work pretty well but Eric is correct that the one on the roof is better. If you are going to use only one of the duals, use the one on the passenger side since that will angle the strongest transmission lobe toward oncoming traffic. The driver's side would do the opposite. A lot of antennas use the vehicle body as the opposite side of the antenna. So, if the antenna is in one corner, the the focus is going to be in the opposite corner, roughly.

As far as the connector, I don't know enough about split systems to be of any real help there since I've never had a vehicle big enough to use dual whips. I'm guessing you should really use the connector designed for a single antenna. This is the point where I would refer you to a radio shop that deals with customers who drive big trucks. They should know if using only one side of a split will work or not. There may be something in the radio requiring the load the be balanced off of that connector but that is only a guess on my part.

@ericbphoto, remember this is all for play, a big toy. I’m not looking for the best performance, I’m just looking for SOME performance. But I’m trying to maintain the cool dual antenna look.

@sgtsandman, I understood everything you said. Just conceptually, go with me here.

I don’t have it at my fingertips, but the correct spacing is something like seven or 8 feet, and I couldn’t get that unless I move the antennas out like 18 or 20 inches from either side of the cab which would look ridiculous.

I sort of know the reason why, but a correct dual antenna cable has the 50 something ohms on the single legs to the antennas; but the base of the Y is 70 something ohms for it to work right. I have the exact numbers, but I don’t have them handy, but that’s not important. The other option is to run the two single cables all the way to the connector on the back of the radio and have them join at the connector. That is actually the set up I have.

If you think about it, the center signal strand in the coax is shielded the whole distance of the wire. Theoretically, nothing in or out until it gets to the exposed antenna. If I plug the set up into the back of the radio, but I disconnect one leg at one antenna, would you agree the other antenna should work OK as if it was on a single wire?

I think the only thing that would make a difference there is if I had the “Y” set up and if only one antenna was connected, there would be a portion of the connection going through the higher ohm wire. With the “V” set up I have, one leg would just be dead/neutral, and the other one should work properly as a continuous 50 ohm wire. Yes, no?

And I agree, that without moving mine, there should be enough of the antenna exposed that it should work “OK” even though part is shielded by the cab. However, I was thinking that the driver side would project best to the left rear, side and front left (oncoming traffic) and vice versa for the passenger antenna. Was that a typo?

One last thought. If one of the twins has no cable on it, the wire in the antenna is not attached to anything, not grounded. So I’m thinking if I leave it in place, that shouldn’t interfere with anything.

And the second last thought, but my headache rack, and all the lights, and the racks on the roof, are a large mesh of aluminum and obviously it’s all grounded. I don’t know how to say this correctly, but is there a point at which it could be “over grounded,” and actually suck the signal out of the air? I don’t think so, I think grounded is grounded, and, that you can have too little, but you can’t have too much. Again, that should make the signal from the driver side antenna work best straight out at 90°, pretty good heading backwards, and adequately heading forwards. Yes no?

And I am interested in the theory and the input and I greatly appreciate it, or I wouldn’t be asking the question. I can relatively easily try every option simply by connecting and disconnecting connectors. But I would have to ride up and down the road and chat with whomever to check it out.

Whadda ya think?

 

[Bgunner]

Went to O'Reilly and got the belt for Beer Fetcher. I checked online before going and saw they had an Idler Pulley in stock for it but it was a different style pulley than what was on there. The one that was on there was a flat plastic pulley with a ridge on both sides of it so I wasn't sure it was correct. I decided before I went there I would just change the belt there and if the pulley was bad change that too since I am right there. I did think of sending @ericbphoto a message and ask what pulley style he has on his engine since they are the same engine and only 1 year different but I didn't want to inconvenience anyone with something I can just measure and figure it out.

After removing the belt I spun the idler and the bearings felt great, spun smoothly and no extra force need to get it to spin. When I checked in and out play there was none but I noticed a little movement. It would rock at an angle to the motor and I knew this was not correct so I went in and had them pull the pulley they had and used their caliper to measure offset, diameter, bearing hole size, you know all the measurements to insure it would work properly. This pulley was a metal one with a rounded outer edge and no ridges on the sides. Because it was so different in that aspect I wanted to measure and be sure it would work properly. There was a slight difference in offset of 1/10th of an inch moving the pulley outward but everything else was with in tolerance on working. I finally said I'll take it and if it didn't work I'd just go back in and return it and order the other option.

I installed it and it "appeared" that the center of the pully was moved back towards the motor a little, the belt rode a little forward in the the pulley that was on there, so I was skeptical it would work but decided I'll put the belt on and see where it rode on the new pulley after starting the engine. After staring it I looked and the belt was riding dead center of this pully and, No squeak! I let it idle for a minute and gave it a few revs increasing the rpm's each rev and still no squeak. I finally found the issue! Wrong pulley was installed when my friend changed it when the original went about 8 years ago. The pulley was changed then because the bearings in it went so it was squeaking then and has squeaked ever since.

I went back in and grabbed a deep well 15/16 socket and wrench since I need to retorque the eyelet bolts for my rear springs and wasn't sure I had the deep well socket and a wrench that size, If I do it wont kill me to have more than one.

When I came out I called my friend because I was so excited the squeak was gone that I needed to share it with someone, he is a mechanic, and was the one that changed it in the first place when it went bad all those years ago. Of course I got the friend response from him, "Nice!". I stayed on the phone with him all the way home and no squeak but this is only a 3 mile drive but enough that it would have squeaked if it was going to.

I call this one, 3 belts and an idler pully later, Fixed... Finally!

Now on to the clunk from the springs, snug up the front wheel bearings and a light check since next month I have an inspection due. It's only a safety inspection due to its age but keeps me making sure everything is in good condition... and their way of making me pay more to own a vehicle that's on the road.

 

[sgtsandman]

@ericbphoto, remember this is all for play, a big toy. I’m not looking for the best performance, I’m just looking for SOME performance. But I’m trying to maintain the cool dual antenna look.

@sgtsandman, I understood everything you said. Just conceptually, go with me here.

I don’t have it at my fingertips, but the correct spacing is something like seven or 8 feet, and I couldn’t get that unless I move the antennas out like 18 or 20 inches from either side of the cab which would look ridiculous.

I sort of know the reason why, but a correct dual antenna cable has the 50 something ohms on the single legs to the antennas; but the base of the Y is 70 something ohms for it to work right. I have the exact numbers, but I don’t have them handy, but that’s not important. The other option is to run the two single cables all the way to the connector on the back of the radio and have them join at the connector. That is actually the set up I have.

If you think about it, the center signal strand in the coax is shielded the whole distance of the wire. Theoretically, nothing in or out until it gets to the exposed antenna. If I plug the set up into the back of the radio, but I disconnect one leg at one antenna, would you agree the other antenna should work OK as if it was on a single wire?

I think the only thing that would make a difference there is if I had the “Y” set up and if only one antenna was connected, there would be a portion of the connection going through the higher ohm wire. With the “V” set up I have, one leg would just be dead/neutral, and the other one should work properly as a continuous 50 ohm wire. Yes, no?

And I agree, that without moving mine, there should be enough of the antenna exposed that it should work “OK” even though part is shielded by the cab. However, I was thinking that the driver side would project best to the left rear, side and front left (oncoming traffic) and vice versa for the passenger antenna. Was that a typo?

One last thought. If one of the twins has no cable on it, the wire in the antenna is not attached to anything, not grounded. So I’m thinking if I leave it in place, that shouldn’t interfere with anything.

And the second last thought, but my headache rack, and all the lights, and the racks on the roof, are a large mesh of aluminum and obviously it’s all grounded. I don’t know how to say this correctly, but is there a point at which it could be “over grounded,” and actually suck the signal out of the air? I don’t think so, I think grounded is grounded, and, that you can have too little, but you can’t have too much. Again, that should make the signal from the driver side antenna work best straight out at 90°, pretty good heading backwards, and adequately heading forwards. Yes no?

And I am interested in the theory and the input and I greatly appreciate it, or I wouldn’t be asking the question. I can relatively easily try every option simply by connecting and disconnecting connectors. But I would have to ride up and down the road and chat with whomever to check it out.

Whadda ya think?

I'm still not sure on hooking one antenna to one leg of the Y and leaving the other disconnected.

Leaving a dud/dummy antenna just sitting on the rack, not being hooked up to anything shouldn't hurt anything.

Having the driver's side antenna will focus one of the lobes to your left rear, yes. The other would be pointed to the right front, toward the shoulder of the road. That is my I have my 102" whip on the passenger side of the bed so that the front lobe points toward on coming traffic. I'm not overly worried about what is behind me but I can still communicate with someone behind me well enough. I'm more worried about oncoming traffic and any reports they may have about the road behind them. For best coverage, my antenna should be on the center of my cab roof. But that eliminates the ability to use a roof rack and even though the antennas are different bands, having the antennas too close together will cause interference. That is why mine are spaced out the way they are and on the perimeter of the truck. Not ideal but almost every setup is a compromise if you deviate from the center of the roof.

I'm trying to find some diagrams to illustrate the point.

EDIT: I'm having difficulty with that at the moment. Too nerdy for google I guess. Anyway, they are other signal lobes being projected around the vehicle. The ones that will be strongest will be opposite of where a side mounted antenna is toward the front and projecting in the opposite direction to the rear.

 

[Bgunner]

I know that pulley is probably a sealed bearing, but when you have it all apart, tie a rag like a scarf in the V of the pulley, and then spray penetrating oil/WD-40/lithium grease around the bearing and work the pulley a little tiny bit and it may penetrate. It may make the squeak go away. if it goes away and comes back, you know that was the culprit.

The purpose of the scarf is to keep the lube out of the belt channel. Put some brake cleaner on a rag and wipe up that channel before you put the belt on.

Also, if you can see anything that’s not supposed to be there or is inconsistent in the channel of that idler, if possible, use about a 4 inch wire wheel on a drill, assuming you can get it in there, and just drive the pulley with that wire wheel at a slight angle for a minute. That should clean out anything on the surface.

When I say turned at an angle, there was a sweet spot between just turning the pulley, and angling the brush so it cuts across the pulley. If you angle it too much you don’t drive the pulley. If you’re only driving the pulley, it’s not scraping the channel clean.

EDIT: if you can’t get a drill in there, you may be able to rig a wire wheel on an angle grinder and slide it down there.

I use that technique with all kinds of things on my bench grinder/wire wheel

my two cents, hope it helps

When I changed the tensioner back on 4/7/2019, I did try to lube the bearings and see if it made a difference but it didn't. Although putting a new belt on then did get rid of it for a few miles at least.

Thanks for the tips I do appreciate them. It's nice when someone is willing to share experience and explain the do's and whys of it.

 

[lil_Blue_Ford]

Progress has been made on the hitch bumper for the green Ranger. Unfortunately still a bunch of welding and Fab to do, have to get some bracing on the back side of the hitch, have to get the frame brackets set in place and welded, finish out the top after the bracing goes in, and that’s not even counting more grinding and welding and drilling holes. I’m probably just going to get the frame brackets and bracing done, drill my holes, soak it in WD-40, and finish it after the 25th anniversary. I’m almost out of shielding gas, money, and time.

That said, I love how this bumper is coming together.

 

[MaicoDoug]

Co-phased antennas do require a "Y" harness of 50 Ohm coax. If one connector is unconnected, there should be a 50 ohm resistor connected w/ enough to cover the output (5 watts). You may consider grounding the unused antenna. It will give you an additional parasitic element if grounded. Director or reflector depending on if it's length is 2% over or under the operating frequency. At best a near field test should be employed measuring field strength with an allowable amount of SWR say <1.5:1. Vertically polarized of course.

The best antenna is the one that works best for you, which one is that? I would say the one at the highest point and the one in the center. The base loaded one on top of the cab. But I do like to experiment......

One whip at the front & one at the back, you can have your 1/4 wave separation (102 inches). I would run a switch and ground one of them and drive the other. This way you would have a vertical beam switchable in 2 different directions, up & down the road (ahead & behind) giving you 6db gain! 5 watts will give you 20 effective radiation (ERP). Use "Mini 8" type coax or better.

 

[Curious Hound]

Went to O'Reilly and got the belt for Beer Fetcher. I checked online before going and saw they had an Idler Pulley in stock for it but it was a different style pulley than what was on there. The one that was on there was a flat plastic pulley with a ridge on both sides of it so I wasn't sure it was correct. I decided before I went there I would just change the belt there and if the pulley was bad change that too since I am right there. I did think of sending @ericbphoto a message and ask what pulley style he has on his engine since they are the same engine and only 1 year different but I didn't want to inconvenience anyone with something I can just measure and figure it out.

After removing the belt I spun the idler and the bearings felt great, spun smoothly and no extra force need to get it to spin. When I checked in and out play there was none but I noticed a little movement. It would rock at an angle to the motor and I knew this was not correct so I went in and had them pull the pulley they had and used their caliper to measure offset, diameter, bearing hole size, you know all the measurements to insure it would work properly. This pulley was a metal one with a rounded outer edge and no ridges on the sides. Because it was so different in that aspect I wanted to measure and be sure it would work properly. There was a slight difference in offset of 1/10th of an inch moving the pulley outward but everything else was with in tolerance on working. I finally said I'll take it and if it didn't work I'd just go back in and return it and order the other option.

I installed it and it "appeared" that the center of the pully was moved back towards the motor a little, the belt rode a little forward in the the pulley that was on there, so I was skeptical it would work but decided I'll put the belt on and see where it rode on the new pulley after starting the engine. After staring it I looked and the belt was riding dead center of this pully and, No squeak! I let it idle for a minute and gave it a few revs increasing the rpm's each rev and still no squeak. I finally found the issue! Wrong pulley was installed when my friend changed it when the original went about 8 years ago. The pulley was changed then because the bearings in it went so it was squeaking then and has squeaked ever since.

I went back in and grabbed a deep well 15/16 socket and wrench since I need to retorque the eyelet bolts for my rear springs and wasn't sure I had the deep well socket and a wrench that size, If I do it wont kill me to have more than one.

When I came out I called my friend because I was so excited the squeak was gone that I needed to share it with someone, he is a mechanic, and was the one that changed it in the first place when it went bad all those years ago. Of course I got the friend response from him, "Nice!". I stayed on the phone with him all the way home and no squeak but this is only a 3 mile drive but enough that it would have squeaked if it was going to.

I call this one, 3 belts and an idler pully later, Fixed... Finally!

Now on to the clunk from the springs, snug up the front wheel bearings and a light check since next month I have an inspection due. It's only a safety inspection due to its age but keeps me making sure everything is in good condition... and their way of making me pay more to own a vehicle that's on the road.

Never hesitate to ask. I'll do whatever I can to help. Without going out to look at the moment, I'm pretty sure my idler pulley is as you described - a metal flat pulley with no edge guides. If I recall, there are 2 diameters of idler pulley for our 3.0l's. I got the wrong diameter once. Though a small difference, it affected belt fitment and tension and was obvious.

Edit: just went out and looked. My tensioner pulley is the same style, but different diameter than the idler. These pulleys are flat because the flat back side of the belt rides on them. The pulley surface is usually wider than the belt. So a little bit of lateral misalignment won't hurt anything. Guide ridges on the sides really aren't necessary because the other ribbed pulleys are so close they will keep the belt centered as long as all the bearings are good. Once a bearing goes bad and gets wobbly, all bets are off there is going to be noise and failure.

 

[MT_PLS]

Ordered Walker cat-back exhaust to replace the factory original system that has decided to give up the ghost.
God I love living in a part of the US that doesn't know what rust is!

 

[Rick W]

I'm still not sure on hooking one antenna to one leg of the Y and leaving the other disconnected.

Leaving a dud/dummy antenna just sitting on the rack, not being hooked up to anything shouldn't hurt anything.

Having the driver's side antenna will focus one of the lobes to your left rear, yes. The other would be pointed to the right front, toward the shoulder of the road. That is my I have my 102" whip on the passenger side of the bed so that the front lobe points toward on coming traffic. I'm not overly worried about what is behind me but I can still communicate with someone behind me well enough. I'm more worried about oncoming traffic and any reports they may have about the road behind them. For best coverage, my antenna should be on the center of my cab roof. But that eliminates the ability to use a roof rack and even though the antennas are different bands, having the antennas too close together will cause interference. That is why mine are spaced out the way they are and on the perimeter of the truck. Not ideal but almost every setup is a compromise if you deviate from the center of the roof.

I'm trying to find some diagrams to illustrate the point.

EDIT: I'm having difficulty with that at the moment. Too nerdy for google I guess. Anyway, they are other signal lobes being projected around the vehicle. The ones that will be strongest will be opposite of where a side mounted antenna is toward the front and projecting in the opposite direction to the rear.

You’ve done enough, my son. I guess the thing I’m not clear about is how those broadcast lobes work relative to the ground plane. I’ll look that up, I’ve seen it before so I’m sure I can find it.

Thank you, thank you thank you!

 

[Rick W]

View attachment 116286
Progress has been made on the hitch bumper for the green Ranger. Unfortunately still a bunch of welding and Fab to do, have to get some bracing on the back side of the hitch, have to get the frame brackets set in place and welded, finish out the top after the bracing goes in, and that’s not even counting more grinding and welding and drilling holes. I’m probably just going to get the frame brackets and bracing done, drill my holes, soak it in WD-40, and finish it after the 25th anniversary. I’m almost out of shielding gas, money, and time.

That said, I love how this bumper is coming together.

WOW!!

 

[Rick W]

I did think of sending @ericbphoto a message and ask what pulley style he has on his engine since they are the same engine and only 1 year different but I didn't want to inconvenience anyone with something I can just measure and figure it out

I’m still on the new side in this forum, but I can tell it’s a very good team with a lot of expertise and knowledge. I know a lot of the purpose of the forum is to share that knowledge. So let me offer this:

I have no problem how many times you bother @ericbphoto with questions, big or small, sensible, or not. Don’t ever hesitate to ask him!

hope it helps

 

[Rick W]

I'm still not sure on hooking one antenna to one leg of the Y and leaving the other disconnected.

Leaving a dud/dummy antenna just sitting on the rack, not being hooked up to anything shouldn't hurt anything.

Having the driver's side antenna will focus one of the lobes to your left rear, yes. The other would be pointed to the right front, toward the shoulder of the road. That is my I have my 102" whip on the passenger side of the bed so that the front lobe points toward on coming traffic. I'm not overly worried about what is behind me but I can still communicate with someone behind me well enough. I'm more worried about oncoming traffic and any reports they may have about the road behind them. For best coverage, my antenna should be on the center of my cab roof. But that eliminates the ability to use a roof rack and even though the antennas are different bands, having the antennas too close together will cause interference. That is why mine are spaced out the way they are and on the perimeter of the truck. Not ideal but almost every setup is a compromise if you deviate from the center of the roof.

I'm trying to find some diagrams to illustrate the point.

EDIT: I'm having difficulty with that at the moment. Too nerdy for google I guess. Anyway, they are other signal lobes being projected around the vehicle. The ones that will be strongest will be opposite of where a side mounted antenna is toward the front and projecting in the opposite direction to the rear.

You are correct, and I was mistaken! (you may want to mark this day down in your calendar.)

So I did a little search for broadcast patterns and broadcast lobes.

Right away, I found this:

my eyeball fell out of my head from the brain pressure.

When I looked a little more, a smart guy named @Jim Oaks has it written up on the website called therangerstation.com

“Radiation Pattern of CB Antennas”
Most people think that antennas mounted on vehicles are omnidirectional. This is mostly true, but the radiation pattern is influenced greatly by the body of the vehicle. Remember we stated that the body acts as the “radials” for the antenna? Well, we know that the body does not extend around the base on the antenna equally. Figure 2 shows how the radiation pattern of a whip is influenced by the body of the vehicle. As you can see, the shape of the pattern depends on where you mount the antenna. The pattern is “pulled” to areas where there is the most vehicle body. The pattern is the worst in directions where there is no metal body for a radial.

Figure 2 – The dashed line shows a omnidirectional pattern you would expect from a CB antenna, but as you can see, the pattern gets distorted from the car body not being even around the base of the antenna. This is why you should try to mount the antenna as close to the center of the vehicle as possible unless you desire a pattern that stresses a certain direction. Do not think of this as gain in a certain direction, this effect is actually detrimental to the overall efficiency of the antenna.

I had assumed the strongest signal would be opposite the direction of the vehicle, but it-the vehicle/ground plane- is not a “wall,”. Rather it acts to help focus the signal from the free part of the antenna. Hence, the antenna on the passenger side would do best to broadcast further up the road into oncoming traffic.

My duels are 6 foot. The bottom 1 foot is blocked forward by the cab and to the right by the headache rack. The next couple feet up are free going forward, but still blocked by the Aluminum headache rack, and contraptions, and the top 3 feet is clear in all directions. I’m going to do some research on how those variations in vertical height might affect the signal.

I’ll hook up the double cable again, disconnect the driver side antenna, and do some testing as I ride around with Lincoln. I’ll keep you posted.

THANK YOU GENTLEMEN!

 

[Curious Hound]

I have no problem how many times you bother @ericbphoto with questions, big or small, sensible, or not. Don’t ever hesitate to ask him!

hope it helps

You're all heart, Rick. That was very helpful.

 

[Curious Hound]

Ok. Second pizza dome has been manufactured.

Ranger received a quick-n-dirty alignment this morning that is proving to be pretty darn good. I'll drive it some more today and double check it tomorrow. Plus, retorque fasteners tomorrow. I still have grocery shopping and packing to do, plus a few minor details. But the pressure has been relieved. I feel good. Let's get this circus on the road.

The new dome is deeper than the first, so they will nest for easier packing.

 

[Broosedamoose]

Using my rubber bed mat as a template, I cut out a piece of plywood for the bed because it's rotting through. The rest of the truck is great! It's just the dang bed that's rotting out from underneath. New brakes came in today so that's my next project.