Broken metal in lower oil pan

[adamtech1]

Hello, I have a 2005 Sport Trac that had the driver's side timing cartridge fail. I tore the timing cover off to replace the timing chains and noticed a piece of plastic off the cartrage was missing. I then removed the lower oil pan and found an odd piece of metal instead of finding a piece of plastic. I'm not familiar enough with the 4.0 SOHC to know what it could be. I'm hoping someone on the forum could help me identify it.

I appreciate any help you can provide.

Adam

 

[rubydist]

That looks like part of the timing cartridge.

 

[adamtech1]

Initially, I had the same thought. I'm almost 100% that is not the case. II believe the broken piece is cast aluminum so I'm guessing it might be part of one of the heads.

 

[Uncle Gump]

Looks to me more like part of the rear timing chain guide.

 

[adamtech1]

Ugh, you are correct. I just verified with a new rear timing chain guide. This project just got a little more complicated.

 

[Uncle Gump]

Well if it didn't totally let go... the engine is most likely still serviceable.

 

[adamtech1]

The engine was running, and I have compression on all cylinders. Not sure If I can pull the tranny and just change the cartridge or if I need to pull the engine.

 

[ekrampitzjr]

How many miles on the engine? Had the tensioners ever been changed?

My understanding is you're looking at pulling the engine to get to the rear cartridge. Pulling the tranny won't give you the access.

 

[sgtsandman]

The engine was running, and I have compression on all cylinders. Not sure If I can pull the tranny and just change the cartridge or if I need to pull the engine.

You will need to pull the engine.

 

[adamtech1]

Thanks for the videos; I got the front timing chains changed. Now onto the back.

 

[adamtech1]

So I got the tranny out and the rear cartridge replaced. Oddly enough, it wasn't broken. The broken metal must have been from a previously broken rear timing cartridge. A ton of unnecessary work...

Here is the next question, how often does the rear main seal go bad? Is this something I should replace? I only had to shift the tranny back a few inches, and I'm not sure if it's worth pulling the entire tranny and flywheel since it's not leaking.

If I do replace the rear seal, can I just replace the seal, or do I need a seal and sleeve?

Thanks again!

 

[RobbieD]

On my older trucks, when I've got transmission out or back, if the rear main seal is dry, I leave it alone. If has any sign of seepage, or obviously leaking, I change it.

Once the old seals out, I use the fine lead (graphite, actually) tip of a mechanical pencil and go around the crank journal, running tip back and forth on the journal surface. If he journal's grooved, you can feel it through the pencil. I do it that way because I've never been able to get a fingernail in there, to feel for a groove. You only need the sleeve if the journal is grooved or scratched where the seal lip rides.

 

[2011Supercab]

Here is the next question, how often does the rear main seal go bad? Is this something I should replace? I only had to shift the tranny back a few inches, and I'm not sure if it's worth pulling the entire tranny and flywheel since it's not leaking.

That's one of those you're damned if you do, damned if you don't things.

1. Leave alone it's not leaking at the moment, but it may start leaking tomorrow
2. Replace it now while you're there and possibly open a can of worms and it leaks, and you can never get it to stop no matter how many times you replace it

 

[adamtech1]

On my older trucks, when I've got transmission out or back, if the rear main seal is dry, I leave it alone. If has any sign of seepage, or obviously leaking, I change it.

Once the old seals out, I use the fine lead (graphite, actually) tip of a mechanical pencil and go around the crank journal, running tip back and forth on the journal surface. If he journal's grooved, you can feel it through the pencil. I do it that way because I've never been able to get a fingernail in there, to feel for a groove. You only need the sleeve if the journal is grooved or scratched where the seal lip rides.

@RobbieD - great idea on the mechanical pencil.

 

[adamtech1]

That's one of those you're damned if you do, damned if you don't things.

1. Leave alone it's not leaking at the moment, but it may start leaking tomorrow
2. Replace it now while you're there and possibly open a can of worms and it leaks, and you can never get it to stop no matter how many times you replace it

@2011Supercab - my thoughts exactly.