Princess or Pig?

[TenSeven]

I bought a dirty, ugly looking 85 Ranger 2.8 that "used to run". Cleaned it up, replaced water pump and oil pump, a few gaskets including intake manifold and carb., tune up parts and enough new paint to make it look like it runs great.

Managed to get it started. Ran and idled great, no smoke in exhaust no gross leaks, awesome, stoked!, shut it down after a few minutes to check it over. Noticed a fog of moisture wafting out of the carb, no odor of fuel, heard sizzling/bubbling coming from beneath the carb and noticed the same bubbling outside from the carb base. Seems there is coolant in the intake manifold.

Fired it up again and let it idle. 195 degrees at the radiator inlet house from engine. Then, pop! The upper radiator hose blew off. Ok, wasn't tight enough. Tightened it back on. Started it up, idled for about 20 minutes, 200 degrees same spot the BOOM! The radiator filler neck with the cap still attached blew off. Shut off but it continued to violently!! diesel for several minutes then finally quit. Besides the obvious blown radiator there is also a few drips of coolant from the passenger header end

Radiator mechanic showed me that the upper tank was under so much pressure it bowed out before it blew. Hmmm, why didn't it vent first? Checked the vent hose, clear. Checked the cap, works, 13lbs, but, I think there was a 'possibility' that the cap spring could not retract far enough to allow pressure to bypass.

Read that coolant in the intake manifold could be caused by a poor fitting intake manifold gasket.

So, replaced radiator cap with one that for sure retracts far enough and dropped it down to 7lbs. Surgically replaced the intake manifold gasket making sure to add a thick bead of sealant front and back. Got it all cleane d up and looking good again.

It briefly started then would only turn over, nothing. Now, just from turning it over, there is coolant dripping from 'both' header ends! All plugs are wet.

So s**t. Just another bad intake manifold gasket install or much worse, cracked heads!?

To go from a short time of running great to blowing up the radiator and coolant leaking out of both exhausts, geezus. Was it just a poor fitted gasket or an incorrect radiator cap or an overheated and violently dieseling engine that cracked it's heads?

I'll do the 'glove test' and a compression test but I'm not hopefull at all.

What do you guys think?

Thanks

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

Coolant doesn't go through the intake so guess again on that...

Turn it over with a wrench and see which one is hydrolocked?

Just out of curiosity you might check the rotor...

If it came loose it could drastically change your timing and make all sorts of weird crap happening. When mine came loose it blew up the muffler with a backfire. It could have played a roll in your dieseling and possible blown headgasket too.

I have no idea how my engine lasted as long as it did. It seemed to take everything in stride and still kinda sorta try to run decent.

 

[TenSeven]

Coolant doesn't go through the intake so guess again on that...

Turn it over with a wrench and see which one is hydrolocked?

Just out of curiosity you might check the rotor...

If it came loose it could drastically change your timing and make all sorts of weird crap happening. When mine came loose it blew up the muffler with a backfire. It could have played a roll in your dieseling and possible blown headgasket too.

I have no idea how my engine lasted as long as it did. It seemed to take everything in stride and still kinda sorta try to run decent.

Thanks.

I couldn't see how coolant could be entering the intake manifold either but in researching the net I found a couple posts where guys had coolant in their intake manifold and supposedly it was caused by a poorly installed intake manifold gasket. The fix was making sure the very front and especially the rear of the gasket had to have a thick bead of silicone where the cork usually is. There is no coolant port on the ends but if I remember correctly those posters also mention removing the cork and using a thick bead of silicone sealer, perhaps this was because the cork was compressing enough and so not allowing a good seal elsewhere on the intake manifolds where the coolant ports are. .?

I was meticulous about installing the gasket but who knows maybe I screwed it up.

I still think I'm in store for at least new head gaskets if not having to replace one or both of the heads altogether. If after checking things out it appears it's the heads then after pulling them I'll definitely have them both cleaned up and magnafluxed.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

I never did the intake on mine, I know a lot of guys (myself included) pitch the end gaskets on 302's because it is so hard to keep them in place let alone keep them from leaking and just use silicone instead.

 

[don4331]

Humour me:

Engine still turns over, but had enough pressure to blow rad cap off? Plugs are wet with gas or anti freeze?

I would suspect blown head gaskets; they aren't design to withstand >?20? psi coolant.

Dieseling means combustion chambers got so hot (no coolant) that compression alone was causing ignition. Violent part is because unlike real diesel where fuel is injected at just right time; gas is igniting as soon as pressure hits the critical point and flywheel/torque converter mass is forcing to continue..

 

[kimcrwbr1]

Brings back memories you have a big air bubble in the upper cylinder block. The way I found to easily burp it is to cut the heater hose that goes to the intake manifold and put in a flushing tee. Leave the radiator cap off and pour water in the tee holding it above the radiator until water comes out the radiator and quickly put the cap on the tee. That primes the heater core, upper engine and bypass hose. Then the thermostat should hold the engine around 200 degrees. I bet the cab heater was not working either? You know it is burped when the heater works!

 

[kimcrwbr1]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Prestone-Fl...ash=item1eaaf9335b:g:NkkAAOSwbdpWV3N5&vxp=mtr

 

[TenSeven]

Humour me:

Engine still turns over, but had enough pressure to blow rad cap off? Plugs are wet with gas or anti freeze?

I would suspect blown head gaskets; they aren't design to withstand >?20? psi coolant.

Dieseling means combustion chambers got so hot (no coolant) that compression alone was causing ignition. Violent part is because unlike real diesel where fuel is injected at just right time; gas is igniting as soon as pressure hits the critical point and flywheel/torque converter mass is forcing to continue..

Thanks.

Not sure what you mean by 'engine still turns over, but had enough pressure to blow rad cap off?'

Plugs are wet with coolant.

Thanks for explanation of the deiseling. I've seen it before but it was always brief and not half as violent.

 

[TenSeven]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Prestone-Fl...ash=item1eaaf9335b:g:NkkAAOSwbdpWV3N5&vxp=mtr

Good info and thanks for the link.

Bought that same kit years ago to install in a girlfriends car (now my wife) but never did. I'll have to see if it's still out in the garage.

 

[TenSeven]

Here's the ugly results.

Glove Test: Cylinders 2,4 and 5 pump up the glove.

Compression Test: Cylinder...
1) 125lbs / spark plug wet with coolant
2) 98lbs / spark plug wet with coolant / +Glove
3) 120lbs / spark plug wet with coolant
4) 60lbs (initial readings would bleed down to 0) / spark plug wet with coolant / +Glove
5) 95lbs / spark plug wet with coolant / +Glove
6) 120lbs / spark plug dry

Oil doesn't look frothy or contaminated.

I'm assuming 'at least' blown head gaskets and that the only was to check the heads for cracks would be to have them Magnafluxed?

 

[kimcrwbr1]

A leakdown would only confirm the compression test results. Apply 30psi pressure to the cylinders on TDC for the compressing stroke. Stick your finger in #1 plug hole and turn the crank clockwise until you feel compression then line the timing mark on TDC. put pressure to the cylinder with the compression tester fitting adapted to a compressor. Listen to the exhaust, intake manifold, oil fill hole, and radiator. You will hear the hissing if it is a valve (intake-exhaust), rings the hissing will be in the oil fill (crankcase) or head gasket cracked head you will hear hissing or get bubbles out the radiator. The main thing the leakdown will tell you is if the rings are good. You will get a light hissing on all cylinders but if one or more is louder than the others you need to rebuild the block also. Once you find TDC on #1 just follow the firing order and stick a thin screwdriver in the next cylinder and turn the crank until that piston is all the way up.

 

[bobbywalter]

throw it in a dumpster.


you put the lipstick on it when it needed heads or head gaskets...

 

[bobbywalter]

Humour me:

Engine still turns over, but had enough pressure to blow rad cap off? Plugs are wet with gas or anti freeze?

I would suspect blown head gaskets; they aren't design to withstand >?20? psi coolant.

Dieseling means combustion chambers got so hot (no coolant) that compression alone was causing ignition. Violent part is because unlike real diesel where fuel is injected at just right time; gas is igniting as soon as pressure hits the critical point and flywheel/torque converter mass is forcing to continue..

what do you mean by that? you could have 300 psi coolant...it better not make a difference to those headgaskets. i assume you mean when the combustion gas instantly pop the radiator hose off due to pressure and the reason for radiator destruction.

 

[kimcrwbr1]

Actually I cant remember if I ever heard of both head gaskets going bad at the same time> I guess its possible both heads cracked but these small motors are pretty much bullet proof I dont find it likely. Keep us posted. Did you test the compression three times?
I allways check compression 1-6 1-6 1-6 and write the numbers down that accounts for any mistests! The crank must turn at least six revolutions I crank until the guage stops moving.

 

[TenSeven]

Actually I cant remember if I ever heard of both head gaskets going bad at the same time> I guess its possible both heads cracked but these small motors are pretty much bullet proof I dont find it likely. Keep us posted. Did you test the compression three times?
I allways check compression 1-6 1-6 1-6 and write the numbers down that accounts for any mistests! The crank must turn at least six revolutions I crank until the guage stops moving.

Only went through and checked the compression once, turning it over at least 4 until the needled stopped. I left the glove on the rad neck and the overflow plugged to double check.

Bummer to have running smooth, no smoke or leaks to what is now. But, that's the chance you take when buying a used engine off Craigslist. Thank God I got it for dirt cheap (cause that's probably what it's worth at this point)