My New House & Workshop

[Shran]

Regarding your lights question - I used something real similar to that Home Depot link you posted when I did fixtures in my shop about 9 years ago. It turns out that Menards doesn't even sell that style anymore. I guess you just replace the whole fixture now instead of a bulb? What a waste. This is the closest thing I could find, probably what I'd use if I had to redo everything: https://www.menards.com/main/lighti...-80cri/p-1459474229643-c-1642874276495749.htm

Maybe I'm complaining about nothing, LED's seem to have an incredibly long lifespan but the average person isn't going to be able to replace an entire fixture. Soccer mom will have to hire an electrician to do something that used to take 30 seconds to swap bulbs - but maybe they'll never need to. I do have one fixture in the shop out of 12 that is really dim for some reason - but I also put drop in T8 LED bulbs in every fixture in my office and none of them have gone bad.

 

[Curious Hound]

There's things I still don't understand. Like, why doesn't a 220 have a neutral? (I'll Google it)

It can and often does. For your water heater, it isn't needed. They designed the controls to operate at 220v. If it had more complex controls that require a lot of human interface, they would probably use 120v controls and require a neutral. You could have run a 4-wire cable. But since the neutral isn't being used, that would have been unnecessary and more expensive. A fairly modern clothes dryer, however, has 120v controls. So most newer clothes dryers have a 4-wire supply. Black and red are the hot legs, white for neutral and bare or green ground. An electric range uses all 4 wires.

 

[Jim Oaks]

Regarding your lights question - I used something real similar to that Home Depot link you posted when I did fixtures in my shop about 9 years ago. It turns out that Menards doesn't even sell that style anymore. I guess you just replace the whole fixture now instead of a bulb? What a waste. This is the closest thing I could find, probably what I'd use if I had to redo everything: https://www.menards.com/main/lighti...-80cri/p-1459474229643-c-1642874276495749.htm

Maybe I'm complaining about nothing, LED's seem to have an incredibly long lifespan but the average person isn't going to be able to replace an entire fixture. Soccer mom will have to hire an electrician to do something that used to take 30 seconds to swap bulbs - but maybe they'll never need to. I do have one fixture in the shop out of 12 that is really dim for some reason - but I also put drop in T8 LED bulbs in every fixture in my office and none of them have gone bad.

Wow, that's a good price for an LED light.

I tried to look into the difference between get a light with the LED tubes like the old fluorescent lights used, and an integrated LED light fixture. I didn't find much although I did find discussion about the tube LED bulbs not lasting as long. Something about the electronics being crammed in the tube and heat killing them over time. It also seems like the integrated LED fixtures don't hang as low.

I ended up ordered these:

https://www.homedepot.com/pep/Commercial-Electric-8-ft-9000LM-90W-2-Light-LED-White-Strip-Light-Fixture-120V-Bright-White-4000K-Garage-Lighting-Non-Dimmable-4-Pack-54599191-A-4PK/316012834?cm_mmc=ecc-_-THD_ORDER_CONFIRMATION_BOSS_STH-_-V1_M1_CA-_-Product_URL&ecc_ord=WN41718611&em_id=5fc22363440ace1b27a14391af76681eac35224838426d6ece77c202dd6c33a2

They were on sales for $257 ($64.40 a light) and since I have a Home Depot card (I haven't used it in a couple of years) I was able to get the lights now instead of waiting until after Christmas and make payments with no interest for 12-months. I guess I could have just bought the lights and told my son, daughter, and their spouses that I bought a shop light for Christmas and named it after them. LOL.

 

[Snoranger]

Regarding your lights question - I used something real similar to that Home Depot link you posted when I did fixtures in my shop about 9 years ago. It turns out that Menards doesn't even sell that style anymore. I guess you just replace the whole fixture now instead of a bulb? What a waste. This is the closest thing I could find, probably what I'd use if I had to redo everything: https://www.menards.com/main/lighti...-80cri/p-1459474229643-c-1642874276495749.htm

Maybe I'm complaining about nothing, LED's seem to have an incredibly long lifespan but the average person isn't going to be able to replace an entire fixture. Soccer mom will have to hire an electrician to do something that used to take 30 seconds to swap bulbs - but maybe they'll never need to. I do have one fixture in the shop out of 12 that is really dim for some reason - but I also put drop in T8 LED bulbs in every fixture in my office and none of them have gone bad.

I have a 4’ LED in the basement of my old house that I haven’t shut off in over 12 years. It wasn’t anything special or expensive, just a Feit housing with non-replaceable bulbs.

 

[Jim Oaks]

FedEx finally delivered my lights around 8:45 pm.

 

[franklin2]

There's things I still don't understand. Like, why doesn't a 220 have a neutral? (I'll Google it)

The way I think about it, the word "neutral" in wiring is just a description of a wire that is grounded or has 0v potential to ground. The code likes to call a neutral a "grounded conductor".

But all devices, need a supply and a return. I think it is easier to think about A/C circuits being like DC. Power is supplied on the black wire, and returns on the white wire. The 220v water heater is no different, power is supplied on one wire, and returns on the other to make a circuit, the only difference is neither one of the 220v wires is tied to ground. I suppose in Europe where they use 220v 50 hertz, one of their 220v wires may be tied to ground somewhere and would be called a "neutral" wire.

 

[sgtsandman]

I just want to know why they can't call it positive and negative wires, like normal people. Darn spark chasers...

 

[Curious Hound]

I just want to know why they can't call it positive and negative wires, like normal people. Darn spark chasers...

Because the positives and negatives switch sides 60 times per second

 

[Curious Hound]

I suppose in Europe where they use 220v 50 hertz, one of their 220v wires may be tied to ground somewhere and would be called a "neutral" wire.

I’m pretty sure they just skip the 120v with neutral scenario.