Household Electrical Question

[High Desert Ranger]

I have three questions.

1.) Do outlets on the exterior house need to be on a GFCI or is it not required. I have no outlets on the front of my house and would like to add one, I have an outlet on the back of the outside of the garage and would either connect to it or connect to the eletrical plug in the roof of the garage.


2.) I plan on putting a 100A subpanel into my garage. Before I go to the city to pull a permit and look like a nit-wit I'd like to know the best way to do it. The panel is on the opposite end of the house and it's probably 60 up the wall, across the attic and down into the garage. I was initally thinking off running 1 1/2" conduit from panel to sub-panel and running the wires (whatever size is necessary) thru there. Is this the best way and what size wire should I use?

3.) I am also planning on installing a set of flood lights on the end of the house opposite the garage, do I have to run a nuetral wire all the way from the garage or can I pick up the nuetral from the main panel?

 

[Speedwagon]

I have three questions.

1.) Do outlets on the exterior house need to be on a GFCI or is it not required. I have no outlets on the front of my house and would like to add one, I have an outlet on the back of the outside of the garage and would either connect to it or connect to the eletrical plug in the roof of the garage.

Depends on local coding requirements. In California, probably.

2.) I plan on putting a 100A subpanel into my garage. Before I go to the city to pull a permit and look like a nit-wit I'd like to know the best way to do it. The panel is on the opposite end of the house and it's probably 60 up the wall, across the attic and down into the garage. I was initally thinking off running 1 1/2" conduit from panel to sub-panel and running the wires (whatever size is necessary) thru there. Is this the best way and what size wire should I use?

3.) I am also planning on installing a set of flood lights on the end of the house opposite the garage, do I have to run a nuetral wire all the way from the garage or can I pick up the nuetral from the main panel?

Other 2, don't really know.

 

[High Desert Ranger]

Depends on local coding requirements. In California, probably.



Other 2, don't really know.

Yes. In California.

 

[99RangerBoss]

hey there im an electrician in canada and the plugs on the outside of your house have to be gfi protected unless their six feet or more off of ground level, this is because of people getting electricuted using electric lawn mowers and hedge trimmers, and your looking around a one gauge so you will need 1/3 aka 1 gauge 3 wire and for your flood light just run a 14/2 from your garage panel since your garage panel will already have the neutral any other questions just pm me code for canada and the usa is basically the same.

 

[Cheaplabor]

Yep, 99 covered it pretty good. What are you planing on running off the new panel?

 

[Nhaz]

its also a good idea to mount the gfi in a weather proof box.

 

[warrior24]

And depending on how far apart you run the gfci's you might wanna run separate lines. I know if you have extremely long runs it will trip even if there is no problem dont remember what the limit is.

 

[skippy]

Hire an electrician and let him pull the permit.I seriously doubt the permit office is going to issue a permit without a state license.Get estimates.

 

[High Desert Ranger]

Yep, 99 covered it pretty good. What are you planing on running off the new panel?

Eventually will be:

220v Air Compressor
220v Welder Plug
Dedicated RV Plug on the outside of the garage
Shop plugs at work table height spread around the garage.
Flood lights on the outside of the garage.
110v Plug on the outside of the garage at roof level for holiday lights.

 

[High Desert Ranger]

Hire an electrician and let him pull the permit.I seriously doubt the permit office is going to issue a permit without a state license.Get estimates.

I did it at my old house. I did all the work. Ran 40 feet 20" underground in 1 1/2" conduit to the garage. Insepctor only came for the final, saw the pipe (uncovered at the time in the ground), took a 5 second look inside the new sub-panel and said " You know what your doing" and signed it off.

And as long as the work is on your own house the permit office is pretty easy going, because they know that if you are there you are trying to do it right and not scabbing it in without a permit.

 

[Will]

And don't bond the neutral in the sub panel.

 

[PeteyGrizz]

Per national code NEC all outside, garage, and basement, and kitchen outlets must be GFCI and exterior outlets in weatherproof box. For the flood lights all circuit conductors have to be routed together so you need to run the neutral from the same source as the feed. For the sub panel be sure you run 4 wires from the main panel, Hot Hot Neutral Ground and as someone said earlier do not bond(connect) the isolated neutral bar to the sub panel enclosure or grounding bar. Do the work neatly and you should have no problem with an inspector. And unless you live in an enormous pallacial compound, distance is rarely a factor in resisential installations.

I am an electrician in NJ but the national code is adopted by almost every municipality in the country, local codes usually add requirements which exceed the NEC basic requirements.

 

[High Desert Ranger]

Per national code NEC all outside, garage, and basement, and kitchen outlets must be GFCI and exterior outlets in weatherproof box. For the flood lights all circuit conductors have to be routed together so you need to run the neutral from the same source as the feed. For the sub panel be sure you run 4 wires from the main panel, Hot Hot Neutral Ground and as someone said earlier do not bond(connect) the isolated neutral bar to the sub panel enclosure or grounding bar. Do the work neatly and you should have no problem with an inspector. And unless you live in an enormous pallacial compound, distance is rarely a factor in resisential installations.

I am an electrician in NJ but the national code is adopted by almost every municipality in the country, local codes usually add requirements which exceed the NEC basic requirements.

I had two initial thoughts on the subpanel to main panel wiring, I'm leaning towards the first choice because of familiarity.

Choice 1) 1 1/2 conduit running the 4 necessary wires thru it.

Choice 2) I've heard of stuff called service wire (I believe) which IIRC is much like romex.

What size wire will I need to run for the sub panel? #1 for the red, black and white and what size ground bare wire will I need?

Wiring the inside the garage will be easy and I plan on using 12/2 romex.

 

[PeteyGrizz]

The service wire you are referring to is generally called SER, "Service Entrance-Round". This is ideal for what you are doing as long as it is all run inside your house and will also be much easier to install than conduit. It is not for use underground and if this is the case use conduit and either aluminum XHHW or copper THHN type wire.

As far as size you will need to use #2 for the Hot and neutral conductors and no smaller than #6 for the ground wire if you use aluminum XHHW in conduit. The SER would be aluminum and you would order as #2 SER. If you want to use copper THHN in conduit (more $) you can use # 3 for hot and neutral but still #6 for the ground. The #6 ground has to be green color or uninsulated as this is part of the code.

I recommend the SER for ease of installation and low cost, provided it will be run inside and in a place where it will not be damaged( attic or parallell to floor joists in basement. If you are going underground to a detached garage you could transition to the XHHW in a junction box, 8" x 8" x 6".

It is important with aluminum conductors to use oxide inhibitor such as NOALOX or De-OX at all connection points to prevent heating due to corrosion.

Note: my experience is in the state of NJ and there is a small chance that different wire types are required by local codes in your area. Some areas may prohibit the use of aluminum, although 99% of home services(not branch circuits) and utility wiring are done with aluminum. Copper SER type cables are available.

 

[Nhaz]

Ive seen more electrical fires due to aluminum wire then just about anything else. Luckily the boxes contained the fires.

Ive also ripped out alot of aluminum electrical wire and replaced it with copper. I have a low opinion of aluminum wire. I consider it unsafe in any household application.