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Help with a "built" long block project for my '88 BII.
- Thread starter Peter Griffin
- Start date
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2007
- Messages
- 1,731
- City
- Wa, Bremerton 98310
- Vehicle Year
- 1987
- Total Lift
- Ranger 5" (1½" Hiryder/3" body), BII 4" Procomp
- Total Drop
- Ranger 5sp, BII A4LD
- Tire Size
- Ranger 32"/4:10LS, BII 33"/3:73LS
- My credo
- Deengineer until it is how Blue Oval should have sold it!!
@Peter Griffin
There are more than one way to skin a cat but this "recipe" has been working for me for quite some time; not as a race vehicle but a daily with substantially improve efficiency. A true pleasure to drive. It was a little cheaper for me to go this route than to replace the original engine with a crate engine (by a little cheaper, I mean at least $1.00 after tax); given, I performed as much of the work as practical.
Three areas where I spent the most time were:
• deburr, chamfer and buff on the crankshaft, bearing caps, piston rods and block interior
• deburr, chamfer, increase oil orifice and buff the rocker arms + rockers. I even went as far as to balance the rockers to within 0.01 grams.
• deburr, chamfer inlets to headers and each successive piece of the exhaust
- jacketing the headers required patients
- having the piston rods peened took extra time
- I needed 2 sets of piston to be able to properly balance them
- I put a lot of thought into how and where to route the oil filter/thermal valve/cooler lines (hoses)
- I experimented with each thermostat from 192° F to 160°F in 2.5° steps; 185° yielded the highest performance in my set up (by performance, I am referring to fuel economy).
In the end I expected to either save money on fuel or have a product with improved efficiency; in this case I received both.
There are more than one way to skin a cat but this "recipe" has been working for me for quite some time; not as a race vehicle but a daily with substantially improve efficiency. A true pleasure to drive. It was a little cheaper for me to go this route than to replace the original engine with a crate engine (by a little cheaper, I mean at least $1.00 after tax); given, I performed as much of the work as practical.
Three areas where I spent the most time were:
• deburr, chamfer and buff on the crankshaft, bearing caps, piston rods and block interior
• deburr, chamfer, increase oil orifice and buff the rocker arms + rockers. I even went as far as to balance the rockers to within 0.01 grams.
• deburr, chamfer inlets to headers and each successive piece of the exhaust
- jacketing the headers required patients
- having the piston rods peened took extra time
- I needed 2 sets of piston to be able to properly balance them
- I put a lot of thought into how and where to route the oil filter/thermal valve/cooler lines (hoses)
- I experimented with each thermostat from 192° F to 160°F in 2.5° steps; 185° yielded the highest performance in my set up (by performance, I am referring to fuel economy).
In the end I expected to either save money on fuel or have a product with improved efficiency; in this case I received both.
Last edited:
Need to find a vendor for a proper cam...
My previous research for performance/flow matched heads/intake is around here somewhere.
Short block is going to be a re-manned. I don't have someone local to build a custom block and/or to spend a lot of money, relatively speaking, for a little improvement over a quality re-manned block. Jasper or similar from O'Reilly's is what I'm thinking.
I have a TON of money, relatively speaking, into this build up to this point and left the motor alone because it compression tested well and was doing...OK. Spending about what I did on the transmission/transfer case/driveshaft rebuild/replacement is about the max I want to spend, labor included, so that's $5K.
Can I save a ton of money doing the work by myself? The simple answer is no because I don't have the tools/ability and I'm certainly not going to risk experimenting that it would work out with so much money already in the project.
A fresh, factory spec/rebuilt or re-manned shortblock, factory heads flow matched to the intake with a larger throttle body, performance/torquey cam, high output ignition and high flow short tube headers with a 2.5-inch custom exhaust all for $5K+ including labor should be do-able based on the math I've done.
I'm sure there's more HP/torque to be made but it's a rate of return issue and picking up another few HP for hundreds of dollars isn't worth it. Getting back to factory level output with a little extra kick in the pants by way of 25-35 maybe 40 additional HP/torque would be enormous in this vehicle. The only DIY I'm capable of at this point is ordering the parts and dropping the truck off at my mechanic's place!
My previous research for performance/flow matched heads/intake is around here somewhere.
Short block is going to be a re-manned. I don't have someone local to build a custom block and/or to spend a lot of money, relatively speaking, for a little improvement over a quality re-manned block. Jasper or similar from O'Reilly's is what I'm thinking.
I have a TON of money, relatively speaking, into this build up to this point and left the motor alone because it compression tested well and was doing...OK. Spending about what I did on the transmission/transfer case/driveshaft rebuild/replacement is about the max I want to spend, labor included, so that's $5K.
Can I save a ton of money doing the work by myself? The simple answer is no because I don't have the tools/ability and I'm certainly not going to risk experimenting that it would work out with so much money already in the project.
A fresh, factory spec/rebuilt or re-manned shortblock, factory heads flow matched to the intake with a larger throttle body, performance/torquey cam, high output ignition and high flow short tube headers with a 2.5-inch custom exhaust all for $5K+ including labor should be do-able based on the math I've done.
I'm sure there's more HP/torque to be made but it's a rate of return issue and picking up another few HP for hundreds of dollars isn't worth it. Getting back to factory level output with a little extra kick in the pants by way of 25-35 maybe 40 additional HP/torque would be enormous in this vehicle. The only DIY I'm capable of at this point is ordering the parts and dropping the truck off at my mechanic's place!
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2007
- Messages
- 1,731
- City
- Wa, Bremerton 98310
- Vehicle Year
- 1987
- Total Lift
- Ranger 5" (1½" Hiryder/3" body), BII 4" Procomp
- Total Drop
- Ranger 5sp, BII A4LD
- Tire Size
- Ranger 32"/4:10LS, BII 33"/3:73LS
- My credo
- Deengineer until it is how Blue Oval should have sold it!!
@Peter Griffin
You could prep the block, rods and valve train with a simple Dremel, though a higher power rotary tool and rasp would be much faster and cheaper in the end.
Instead of buying a cookie cutter off the shelf cam, just have yours custom reground. OREGON CAM GRINDING of Vancouver Washington will do the job for just over $200 including shipping both directions. Your machinist should be able to select the best profile based on your head/intake flow or you can use the specks my machinist chose for mine
For quality flow bench port/polish work call David Endrigo of DAVE'S AUTO MACHINE of Pousbo Washington:
• 360.990.1713
• david.endrigo@gmail.com
DELTA CAMSHAFT of Tacoma Washington for improved rockers (cup inserts).
You could prep the block, rods and valve train with a simple Dremel, though a higher power rotary tool and rasp would be much faster and cheaper in the end.
Instead of buying a cookie cutter off the shelf cam, just have yours custom reground. OREGON CAM GRINDING of Vancouver Washington will do the job for just over $200 including shipping both directions. Your machinist should be able to select the best profile based on your head/intake flow or you can use the specks my machinist chose for mine
For quality flow bench port/polish work call David Endrigo of DAVE'S AUTO MACHINE of Pousbo Washington:
• 360.990.1713
• david.endrigo@gmail.com
DELTA CAMSHAFT of Tacoma Washington for improved rockers (cup inserts).
Last edited:
@gaz posted some awesome info almost a month ago, sorry I'm only responding now!
I THINK I've located a short block:
With the bottom end new/refreshed, having the heads and cam handled with the info gaz provided should provide a pretty solid foundation. I spoke to my mechanic about it and he said it'd be around $1K to R&R the motor, which I thought was pretty fair. I'd have him pull the heads/cam first to get them worked on and once they're back I can get the short block on the way with the other components. I know with projects like this the expenses can really get away from you, but with the short block @ $2K shipped (with the upgrades I want) I'd REALLY like to think my goal of keeping it under $5K should be readily obtainable.
At that point would I have a TON of money tied up in this project? I sure would! But the engine is really the only thing left to do, and having a fresh motor with a lil more power and renewed reliability is a good "investment" and addresses the elephant in the room that the old/stock motor is getting a little long in the tooth and just waiting to give up the ghost...
I THINK I've located a short block:
With the bottom end new/refreshed, having the heads and cam handled with the info gaz provided should provide a pretty solid foundation. I spoke to my mechanic about it and he said it'd be around $1K to R&R the motor, which I thought was pretty fair. I'd have him pull the heads/cam first to get them worked on and once they're back I can get the short block on the way with the other components. I know with projects like this the expenses can really get away from you, but with the short block @ $2K shipped (with the upgrades I want) I'd REALLY like to think my goal of keeping it under $5K should be readily obtainable.
At that point would I have a TON of money tied up in this project? I sure would! But the engine is really the only thing left to do, and having a fresh motor with a lil more power and renewed reliability is a good "investment" and addresses the elephant in the room that the old/stock motor is getting a little long in the tooth and just waiting to give up the ghost...
RobbieD
2.9l Mafia
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2007
- Messages
- 4,940
- City
- Georgia
- Vehicle Year
- 1984,1990,1994
- Transmission
- Manual
- My credo
- Toonces drives a Ranger . . . . just not very well.
Just my own humble opinion, but I wanted to throw it out there . . .
I have followed your journey on here, with this truck, and I like what you've done to it, and done with it, and how you've done things.
It seems like you're at the last major hurdle on it, it's mechanical heart- the motor. I like the idea of building a fresh 2.9L for it. After all, that's what it came with.
Your truck is kinda a hybrid. Not "restored", but rather "renovated" (as in a "Renaissance") It's still in the basic form of how Ford originally built it, but you've logically and tastefully renovated and updated it, so that it's like it has the "Spirit of '88" but also having its own relevance almost 40 years later. It's a unique truck.
I say "Go For It", and May the Force be with you!
edit: year model
I have followed your journey on here, with this truck, and I like what you've done to it, and done with it, and how you've done things.
It seems like you're at the last major hurdle on it, it's mechanical heart- the motor. I like the idea of building a fresh 2.9L for it. After all, that's what it came with.
Your truck is kinda a hybrid. Not "restored", but rather "renovated" (as in a "Renaissance") It's still in the basic form of how Ford originally built it, but you've logically and tastefully renovated and updated it, so that it's like it has the "Spirit of '88" but also having its own relevance almost 40 years later. It's a unique truck.
I say "Go For It", and May the Force be with you!
edit: year model
Thanks @RobbieD! I appreciate your kind words and the metric ton of help I've gotten here from you and other folks. That's why I call it a resto-mod; I've restored parts of it and modified others to bring it up to speed. The only technology that I really "needed" was a BlueTooth capable stereo so I can safely make/receive phone calls and stream music...because I LOVE listening to music; all types...
Being a desert rat I wanted it to fit the role, which it does nicely, but I know how much it'll benefit from a fresh motor with a little more power. I'm sure with what I have planned that it'll put out a solid 30+ more HP/torque over what it has now, and in a vehicle this size/weight, that's game changing!
The reliability issue with the original motor really is the elephant in the room. I definitely have had a few people raise an eyebrow when I tell them it's the original motor (as far as I know if course, and there's no reason for me to think it isn't) with all of the other work done, so it's just a natural progression at this point.
Had the transmission not gone out in such a massive way I probably would have done the motor already, but I left it alone as everything seemed fine...until it wasn't (when the transmission and transfer case went south bigly)!
It'll certainly be another adventure and I'll likely wait until the summer creeps up to do it as my mechanic's availability will be much more open, this time of year he's got his hair on fire dealing with snowbirds...
Being a desert rat I wanted it to fit the role, which it does nicely, but I know how much it'll benefit from a fresh motor with a little more power. I'm sure with what I have planned that it'll put out a solid 30+ more HP/torque over what it has now, and in a vehicle this size/weight, that's game changing!
The reliability issue with the original motor really is the elephant in the room. I definitely have had a few people raise an eyebrow when I tell them it's the original motor (as far as I know if course, and there's no reason for me to think it isn't) with all of the other work done, so it's just a natural progression at this point.
Had the transmission not gone out in such a massive way I probably would have done the motor already, but I left it alone as everything seemed fine...until it wasn't (when the transmission and transfer case went south bigly)!
It'll certainly be another adventure and I'll likely wait until the summer creeps up to do it as my mechanic's availability will be much more open, this time of year he's got his hair on fire dealing with snowbirds...
Well well well, a MAJOR worm has turned, the one most critical to the motor/engine project...
My wife approved it!
I told her basically what I told y'all and she's enough of a gearhead herself to get it. I can start buying the odds and ends (ignition, throttle body, etc.) and contacting the folks that @gaz suggested to get the ball rolling so I'm ready to do this around Memorial Day, which is pretty much officially when the snowbirds leave around here, at the latest.
I'm likely going to be down again with another back surgery come summer time so it'll be a good time to get it done. While I have no idea what the engine is putting out right now power wise, I can only go off the compression test where it's 90% across all 6 cylinders, so it was probably mid-120s at the crank, which would barely squeak 100 at the wheel...!
I know there are different/better ways to make power than the 2.9 and I'm only looking to restore it to it's original power levels with the fresh short block, and add a reasonable amount of useable power on top of that with the heads/cam, etc. I'm fairly certain I should be around 170-180 HP with this build, which would net near 150 +/- with driveline loss, which would be a massive difference compared to where I'm at now. I likely won't dyno it, but with a potential/maximum 50% increase it really will be a day/night difference.
Port matching/heads and matching the new cam profile/torque curve will be critical to producing usable power, I'm certainly not going through all this trouble to just bench race it!
My wife approved it!
I told her basically what I told y'all and she's enough of a gearhead herself to get it. I can start buying the odds and ends (ignition, throttle body, etc.) and contacting the folks that @gaz suggested to get the ball rolling so I'm ready to do this around Memorial Day, which is pretty much officially when the snowbirds leave around here, at the latest.
I'm likely going to be down again with another back surgery come summer time so it'll be a good time to get it done. While I have no idea what the engine is putting out right now power wise, I can only go off the compression test where it's 90% across all 6 cylinders, so it was probably mid-120s at the crank, which would barely squeak 100 at the wheel...!
I know there are different/better ways to make power than the 2.9 and I'm only looking to restore it to it's original power levels with the fresh short block, and add a reasonable amount of useable power on top of that with the heads/cam, etc. I'm fairly certain I should be around 170-180 HP with this build, which would net near 150 +/- with driveline loss, which would be a massive difference compared to where I'm at now. I likely won't dyno it, but with a potential/maximum 50% increase it really will be a day/night difference.
Port matching/heads and matching the new cam profile/torque curve will be critical to producing usable power, I'm certainly not going through all this trouble to just bench race it!
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2009
- Messages
- 27
- City
- Missouri
- Vehicle Year
- 2001
- Engine
- 4.0 V6
- Transmission
- Automatic
I've been out of this game for a bit, but most of you will probably recognize the name. Getting around 200hp out of one of these, takes a bit of work, but nothing out of the ordinary, it'll get you into the 4L SOHC power type levels, with a little less torque, but more fun to spin in my opinion. One of the harder issues I had was making it daily friendly, the old speed density system only had so much adjustment. It got to the point to make it daily friendly I was running a lot more fuel pressure, and an IAT sensor with an inline variable resister for fine tuning my fuel delivery. It ended up working great, but would be a nightmare for anybody but me to troubleshoot a problem. There's aftermarket computer systems now that would of made my life so much simpler from way back then. Also keep in mind the 2.9 is a small engine, thus any gearing advantage you can give it is a great thing. I used to run mine on 4.56's with 30" tires. 200 hp + a 75hp nitrous hit+ 4.56's in early to mid 1990's, it did fairly well for a 4wd automatic. Never got it into the 14's in the 1/4, but it would get close.
Pat Kunz
Pat Kunz
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2007
- Messages
- 1,731
- City
- Wa, Bremerton 98310
- Vehicle Year
- 1987
- Total Lift
- Ranger 5" (1½" Hiryder/3" body), BII 4" Procomp
- Total Drop
- Ranger 5sp, BII A4LD
- Tire Size
- Ranger 32"/4:10LS, BII 33"/3:73LS
- My credo
- Deengineer until it is how Blue Oval should have sold it!!
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2009
- Messages
- 27
- City
- Missouri
- Vehicle Year
- 2001
- Engine
- 4.0 V6
- Transmission
- Automatic
Kunz Korner was a fun time. I had a good time with those little V6's, and met a lot of great people. The funny part is I went from 2.9's to Big Block Chevy's, so totally opposite end of the spectrum. 4wd trucks to Corvettes as my hobby vehicle of choice. But I always had a Ranger or something on the same platform since I was 16 and will always have a soft spot for them.
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2007
- Messages
- 1,731
- City
- Wa, Bremerton 98310
- Vehicle Year
- 1987
- Total Lift
- Ranger 5" (1½" Hiryder/3" body), BII 4" Procomp
- Total Drop
- Ranger 5sp, BII A4LD
- Tire Size
- Ranger 32"/4:10LS, BII 33"/3:73LS
- My credo
- Deengineer until it is how Blue Oval should have sold it!!
@Pat Kunz
Both of my primary mechanic mentors have been Bowtie authorities; all of the principles they have taught me about massaging 350's have improved the efficiency of the 2.9l splendid.
It just goes to to show "if you desire to learn new tricks, go talk with an Old Dog"!! The number 1 example, with a bell is setting the base timing.
One day I asked my Marine buddy, Staff Sargent Bowman if he thought that advancing the timing on my EFI, PCM controlled 2.9l could/would reap near the same benefits from vacuum advance that he taught me for his Bowtie powered 1972 Camaro...he said, "I don't know why not", so we tried it. What an improvement!!
Both of my primary mechanic mentors have been Bowtie authorities; all of the principles they have taught me about massaging 350's have improved the efficiency of the 2.9l splendid.
It just goes to to show "if you desire to learn new tricks, go talk with an Old Dog"!! The number 1 example, with a bell is setting the base timing.
One day I asked my Marine buddy, Staff Sargent Bowman if he thought that advancing the timing on my EFI, PCM controlled 2.9l could/would reap near the same benefits from vacuum advance that he taught me for his Bowtie powered 1972 Camaro...he said, "I don't know why not", so we tried it. What an improvement!!
Last edited:
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2007
- Messages
- 1,731
- City
- Wa, Bremerton 98310
- Vehicle Year
- 1987
- Total Lift
- Ranger 5" (1½" Hiryder/3" body), BII 4" Procomp
- Total Drop
- Ranger 5sp, BII A4LD
- Tire Size
- Ranger 32"/4:10LS, BII 33"/3:73LS
- My credo
- Deengineer until it is how Blue Oval should have sold it!!
@Peter Griffin
Just saying,
I have only ever used wrecking yard pull donor engines to rebuild. The improvements to make on the bottom end are simple:
• grind off the flashing from the block interior, caps and rods
• then put a 45° on all edges
• a light buff out and your done
• a further step would be to peen or have your rods heat treated (annealed)
• no matter what, because of the increased power and torque, use ARP rods bolts
You could go a step further and remove all flashing/markings and fair in all crankshaft angles. This is recommended in our boy Sven Pruett's book "How to Modify the Ford 60°V6 for Power". He later advocates a crank polish and the total bottom end balance but that's only going to begin to pay dividends above REAL 3k RPM.
Just saying,
I have only ever used wrecking yard pull donor engines to rebuild. The improvements to make on the bottom end are simple:
• grind off the flashing from the block interior, caps and rods
• then put a 45° on all edges
• a light buff out and your done
• a further step would be to peen or have your rods heat treated (annealed)
• no matter what, because of the increased power and torque, use ARP rods bolts
You could go a step further and remove all flashing/markings and fair in all crankshaft angles. This is recommended in our boy Sven Pruett's book "How to Modify the Ford 60°V6 for Power". He later advocates a crank polish and the total bottom end balance but that's only going to begin to pay dividends above REAL 3k RPM.
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2007
- Messages
- 1,731
- City
- Wa, Bremerton 98310
- Vehicle Year
- 1987
- Total Lift
- Ranger 5" (1½" Hiryder/3" body), BII 4" Procomp
- Total Drop
- Ranger 5sp, BII A4LD
- Tire Size
- Ranger 32"/4:10LS, BII 33"/3:73LS
- My credo
- Deengineer until it is how Blue Oval should have sold it!!
@Peter Griffin
Oh, there is one more often unmentioned expense associated with this new level of power... suspension improvement
Oh, there is one more often unmentioned expense associated with this new level of power... suspension improvement
I'm not touching the suspension at this point, everything has been completely replaced already.@Peter Griffin
Oh, there is one more often unmentioned expense associated with this new level of power... suspension improvement
I really don't consider a freshened motor that's mildly warmed over and likely putting 150+/- HP to the wheels to be game changing to the point the suspension needs to be modified; if that was the case then it was on the ragged edge to begin with.
New front/rear shocks, coil/leaf springs, EVERY bushing replaced, new body lift/mounts and hardware and an admittedly ridiculous dual steering stabilizer.
HARD nope on anything beyond what I have planned for the motor. I have an obscene amount of money in this to begin with (with me doing the vast majority of the labor/work) and it's far from the only vehicle/hobby that gets my (financial) attention and I'm fortunate at this point my wife hasn't murdered me...
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