Electric conversions, are they happening now?

[MikeG]

Metal smelting is a filthy business. We outsourced it across the pacific, so it will take a while for the pollution that is dumped into the rivers there to end up in our food.

 

[don4331]

My issue with ford's ev ranger is 1, you're stuck with a 98-00 truck and two, without swapping out the ev side of things (motor and accompanying electronics) even with a brand new battery pack you'll have lackluster performance.
Instead, what interests me is swapping a truck (year of choice) with ev hardware meeting the current standard... More acceleration than you'd want, more torque than you need, and a range similar to what the truck is already capable of

The challenge for the kits, has been that they are installing all brand new hardware - new batteries, new electric motor and new controls.

So, you need to compare cost electric kit with cost of installing a new 2.3 EcoBoost ($6,550 retail), control pack ($2,050) + engineering mark up for a solution with all the pieces sorted out. If you figure installing a state of the art ICE solution will cost $10k, then the $7.5k solutions from places like evwest aren't that out of line.

Note: The cost of EV vs ICE components is bass ackwards. For ICE, the energy holding device (gas tank), is inexpensive to increase in size, while the power unit (engine) is expensive. For EV is the opposite, batteries are expensive, and electric motor(s) aren't. So, EVs can have gobs of power, but range is issue. But if you are frugal Ranger owner, you can reduce costs by reducing motor size​

The bigger question, is: How much have you drank the Kool-Aid?

As per the discussion a couple months back, if you are an evangelist and want to make an EV work, the technology is now at a level that it is possible.

Does it require changes in how you drive, absolutely. Are some people have issues with change, absolutely. (And older we get, the more difficult it gets). And is the EV solution, perfect, h3ll no.​

On the actual conversion: How fancy do you want your conversion? Do you want it to be like a factory set up or are you prepared to live with a "HotRod" solution??

A vehicle uses a significant amount of power accelerating; steady state power requirements are actually quite low. Factory EVs recover a significant amount of power, especially in city driving, by using the electric motor as generator before applying brakes. This requires brake by wire, and some sophisticated programming. Without that recharge, battery usage isn't great. So, an EV that functions like a factory solution is technically challenging = expensive. Which isn't to say it won't be done, it just needs people with higher abilities to do it.

The easier solution is hybrid: Add a front differential/knuckles to a 2wd Edge (ideally with 2.3 Duratech), use an electric motor to drive the front axle. With a 330W/h storage solution mounted to back of cab (ala Dodge eTorque), you should have enough power to make the local trip to 7/11 and back. If you need to go further, fire up the ICE engine. If you need more power run the ICE and motor combined. You wouldn't get the advantages of regenerative braking, but it would be move easily installed by DYI individual.

The one item I haven't worked out - how to lubricate the transmission output shaft when engine isn't running. Ford has an electric pump inside the new 10Rx0 transmission which would takes care of this for the start/stop function and works for PowerBoost. I suspect one would need to do something similar. Disconnecting driveshaft disconnects the speedometer on some models of Rangers, so disconnectable driveshaft would not be generic option.​

 

[RonD]

I like the idea of what the railroads did, diesel/electric
Electric motors have far more power than any liquid fuel engine, pound for pound
So electric motors turn the wheels and diesel engine running at constant pre-set RPM provides the electricity, no batteries

But in a vehicle you could use batteries, and a smaller diesel engine just for charging to extend the range
So rear axle electric motor conversion, or motor in wheel
A 2 or 3 cyl diesel generator in engine bay
Battery compartment between engine bay and rear axle
You could plug in to re-charge or run generator
So a hybrid that could push you out into the 400-500mile range, have to do the math

 

[MikeG]

We'd be MUCH better off with diesel / electric. There's a reason trains use it.... it works! If the railroads could find anything more efficient, they'd change. A small battery pack for acceleration / regenerative braking, and a little diesel engine would be all you'd need. The diesel engine would need hardly any more power than to run accessories, plus maybe 20 or 30 horsepower, with any sort of decent aerodynamics, for a commuter car. The smaller the battery pack, the less extra weight being carried around. Sort of defeats the purpose to have a long-range electric car, if the battery pack weighs a ton.

But the EPA in this country is dead-set against diesel, and the "100%-green" mandate in California (or whatever they call it) conspire to torpedo something that would actually reduce greenhouse gas emissions, and give basically unlimited range. Hey can we can make diesel from corn, at lot more efficiently than we can make ethanol from corn.

Evidently the rule-makers in California don't realize that it is a pretty big state! And not everyone lives within walking distance of work. I can see some terrible gridlock in LA or wherever, if everyone's electric car ran out of charge at once because of weather, etc. The wreckers would have to carry trailers full of AA batteries....

 

[Dirtman]

The answer is simple...

 

[don4331]

Diesel Electric is great for trains as locomotive needs weight. So, the fact that a diesel weighs more than a gasoline one, and generator/alternator weighs more than a gearbox isn't an issue. Making engine/transmission system lighter then adding weigh to be able to function isn't worth it. But in a car we want to add lightness.

But an ICE engine running a single optimized speed to drive a generator would allow efficiency ~20% better that current. Run ICE, charge batteries, then shut down until required is optimum*. And your talking small ICE engine - <20hp, would provide sufficient to exceed battery drain at reasonable speeds.

I didn't know you can make diesel from corn; was well aware that you can make biodiesel from soybeans though.

*For super mileage vehicles, we would run the engine at its most efficient setting to get us up to speed, then shut it down and coast until we needed to repeat the cycle. We managed over 2k mpg back in late 80s.

 

[DeathRanger]

being able to electric swap a tesla motor would be great but they won't allow modified vehicles on their charging network.

That might work if you stay close to home but would ruin any roadtrip.

RichRebuilds on youtube has messed with salvaged tesla for years but gave up because it's too much hassle

 

[MikeG]

Well a diesel car engine, combined with a battery pack and electric motor, wouldn't need to weigh what a 6 cyl cummins in a Dodge Ram 3500 does. And thermodynamic efficiency of a diesel is approaching twice that of a gas engine. So you'd still get much better mileage that a gas engine of the same (torque) output, despite a small weight penalty.

 

[MikeG]

Biodiesel is basically any vegetable oil, from what I understand. If can fry things in corn oil then recycle into diesel.....

 

[19Walt93]

I haven't heard anything about the national power grid being upgraded to handle charging all the electric vehicles we're supposed to drive.

 

[pjtoledo]

when we ALL hit the road at the same time for summer vacations

 

[RegularGuy]

Something crossed my mind today, on the 4x4 one could theoretically replace the front driveshaft and transfercase with an electric motor, then (I think) swap in the rear driveshaft from a 2wd. Hook up a small battery and you have a hybrid..... For the pedals, you'd need a potentiometer for each, then just set them up so the electrics get used primarily at the beginning of the throw. An oversimplification but you'd have regenerative braking

 

[RonD]

Be easier to just swap in electric motor wheels on the front of a 2WD or 4x4, or electric motor differential/axle

On a 4x4 you could then use the transfer cases's front driveshaft to power a generator when driving using the gasoline engine, to recharge FWD batteries

You would definitely want Neutral access for transfer case when using FWD

 

[stmitch]

EV conversions are happening at the "high-end Aftermarket tuner shop" level. The types of places that build 6figure custom cars. EVWest has some cool stuff, and Icon has done a couple of EVs now too. GM has shown some vintage stuff outfitted with modern tech from a Bolt at SEMA, which may indicate that they're considering some "crate motor" type of EV conversions. I saw an RWB 911 EV this week too. So, they're out there and will continue to gain popularity. But they're not really at the point where it's reasonable for a garage DIY skill set for an average wrencher.


EVs are cool, but it's super unlikely that your truck will be banned. There are proposals in place in some locations to ban the sale of new ICE vehicles by 2035 or so, but I don't see anybody realistically banning operation of older pre-existing ICEs. It's like older vehicles from the 50s, 60s, or 70s being allowed to operate on roads even though they don't meet current emissions regulations.

 

[RonD]

I agree, attrition, natural wearing out, of older internal combustion engines(ICEs) will be more related to time than being banned

And there are renewable gas/liquid fuel options that may be available long term for ICEs