'89 BII, startin with leafs

[alpinestar]

First off, this is my first build, im 16 and i will be doing most of this build myself. The builds gonna start like this, im doing away with the TTB, this gonna be a trail rig, maybe alittle towards the rock crawlin' side. I would like to get a dana 30 out of wrangler that has already been leaf overed, but the odds of finding that near me are rather slim plus im trying to get one with 3.73's so i dont have to swap my rear axle just yet. so what i think i will have to do is get a cherokee front axle and take off all the mounts and re fab mounts for the leaf springs... SO... after all that, heres what i have for questions:

Transfer Case: what has everyone done transfer case wise? i was told i may need to pick up a newer one.

Driveline: im only planning on going up about 5" or so, what can my drive shafts handle? i got the CV drive shafts.

??? any other things that should be brought to mind, i know for sure im forgetting stuff cause i always am

oh and before i forget, this fabricator just told me today taht if i do this my camber angle is gonna be way off and its gonna be expensive to fix. WTF??? camber angle? this isnt independent suspension its a straight axle! please tell me hes just an idiot and i really dont have to worry about that....

thanks in advance guys....

 

[nunnya503]

Have you looked into using coil springs? I will tell you from exp. coils are easier and you can find axles for Cherokees allover. Leafs just get in the way, I would do some research. And as far as the camber angle, don't worry... Pinion angel is what you pay attention to when you get to it. Good luck, use the search option lots of people have posted nice builds using leafs and coils lots of good info

 

[alpinestar]

the only reason im going with leafs now is i plan to learn how to build long arms soon. i have a buddy who builds them and was originally gonna do mine, but ive decided i would like to learn how to do it myself than have him do it, so the coils are gonna have to wait.

that was one of the questions i forgot, what do i match my pinion angle to, i was told to make it the same as the yoke coming out of the transfer case, right? and i have clarified that i DO need a transfer case from a 92 or newer ranger. thats next on the parts list.

thanks for the reply

 

[Toreadorranger]

long arms as in links or radius arms (ford style). If you want to eventually go with coils I think it would be alot easier to run some stock length fullsize ford radius arms, then when you build your long arms just move the rear mounts. That way your not totally changing the suspension twice. Would make the second phase alot easier. I just dont understand guys who are already setup for coils who go to leafs when radius arms are practically bolt in.

 

[nunnya503]

It is kind of intimidating to go with coils\radius arms at first. But when you get into it a little its not bad. Just make sure you you read everything you can and do all the research possible, it really isnt that bad and like Toreadorranger said it will make the II phase much easier. I think it looks better too.

 

[alpinestar]

i totally agree with you guys and thats the route everyone usually goes, and i have thought about it dozens of times. but the problem with that is, i want the straight axle now, which means i cant use the stock ford radius arms just cause they wont mount right up to a straight axle. and i really want to get all the machinery and the skills that i need to be able to make my own long arms like what rusty's make for the XJ's and do it all on my own. so that will be atleast a few months before i get that far. in the meantime i just got a dana 30 out of my buddy's bronco II so the steering is already all setup which is just the normal jeep steering and its all ready for leaf springs for $70. it has 3.55's and i have 3.73's so its a step backwards in the way but for the deal im gettin on it its worth it to me. i already wont have 4WD for a while since i need a driveline adapter or a new transfer case. my buddy that i just got this axle from also has all the mounting hardware for the leaf springs, hangers and what not so i will get those tomorrow or friday as well. then it begins... CANT WAIT!!!

just some specs:
im moving the front axle forward atleast an inch. and maybe moving the rear later. i also know someone who has a 2wd parts ranger, its a newer one. he said i can have the rear axle out of it, so im gonna go see what the gears are in it and see if its an 8.8 maybe. i would be set if that happens to be 3.55 or 4.10's or something much better like that. i plan in the future to just go ahead and buy yukon 4.88's...

thanks for the help guys. i'll try to get some pics up sometime before this weekend. and i'll start hackin the fenders sometime soon

 

[alpinestar]

long arms as in links or radius arms (ford style).

sorry i didnt answer your question in that last one... i think i read what you said wrong the first time i read it...

but what i mean is long arms as in what Rustys sells, basically this right here http://rustysoffroad.com/mm5/mercha...duct_Code=RK-LT10-XJ&Category_Code=sus_xj_kit

a wheeler buddy of mine makes some almost exactly like that but i think their actually longer. they flex AMAZINGLY, so thats basically the design im after. its gonna be adapted to how i want it to be on my B2 tho..

 

[LittleBigFoot]

Leaves are a bigger pain in the ass then you'd expect.

To get some decent articulation, you'd wanna run extended shackles. If you street this rig you'll have some issues.

And "Jeep steering" won't work with leaves. All the SA heeps I've seen have been a drag link that connects from the pitman arm to the knuckle and a tie rod that runs driver side knuckle and intercepts the drag link. Pretty much a Y.

The leaves get in the way. Unless you go with a jankety ass Z link style steering it won't work and i'd say avoid that. I ran that just for a few miles but it was 1.5" solid bar tapped for TREs.


I just switched to high steer and I'll tell ya that was expensive and a bitch.


Above some one said pinion angle was important but caster is must more important. You can survive with a shitty pinion angle. Your U joints and drive shaft might suffer but how often is the front engaged at 40 miles an hour?

If your caster is off you can get a gnarley death wobble, no return to center, and shitty steering response. At a horrible caster you don't turn the wheels, you lift the truck. It's hard to explain. But it's bad.

Camber is necessary to take into consideration. A lot of cars run negative camber to improve grip while cornering.

Big ass off road shit will use a positive camber to lower steering effort.

Just keep it simple and keep shit like that in spec and figure out the proper caster angle and use an angle finder on the top of the Cs to measure it.

 

[Toreadorranger]

i totally agree with you guys and thats the route everyone usually goes, and i have thought about it dozens of times. but the problem with that is, i want the straight axle now, which means i cant use the stock ford radius arms just cause they wont mount right up to a straight axle. and i really want to get all the machinery and the skills that i need to be able to make my own long arms like what rusty's make for the XJ's and do it all on my own. so that will be atleast a few months before i get that far. in the meantime i just got a dana 30 out of my buddy's bronco II so the steering is already all setup which is just the normal jeep steering and its all ready for leaf springs for $70. it has 3.55's and i have 3.73's so its a step backwards in the way but for the deal im gettin on it its worth it to me. i already wont have 4WD for a while since i need a driveline adapter or a new transfer case. my buddy that i just got this axle from also has all the mounting hardware for the leaf springs, hangers and what not so i will get those tomorrow or friday as well. then it begins... CANT WAIT!!!

just some specs:
im moving the front axle forward atleast an inch. and maybe moving the rear later. i also know someone who has a 2wd parts ranger, its a newer one. he said i can have the rear axle out of it, so im gonna go see what the gears are in it and see if its an 8.8 maybe. i would be set if that happens to be 3.55 or 4.10's or something much better like that. i plan in the future to just go ahead and buy yukon 4.88's...

thanks for the help guys. i'll try to get some pics up sometime before this weekend. and i'll start hackin the fenders sometime soon

All you need is a set of weld on wedges to use the fullsize radius arms.

 

[LittleBigFoot]

I've got a good set of radius arms from a 79 Bronco. I'll let them go cheap.

 

[alpinestar]

The dana 30 that i just picked up for it was just in a bronco II, he ran stock wrangler leafs and he said he would outflex any TTB lift. the steering he used was the stock wrangler steering, had no problems with the drag link running into the leaf springs. i might have to pick up a drop pitman arm but no big deal. thats $35 at "the jeep guy".

the only parts i dont completely understand is the caster camber set up. i got a guy that knows how to set up that shit so he'll probably expain it to me tonight. other than that, im gonna play it step by step. worse comes to worse, i wont be able to drive my truck next week... darn, gonna have to drive the jeep to school...

thanks guys..

about to hack the fenders last night then the god damn northwest weather kicked in. so i got lazy and decided to call it a night.

 

[alpinestar]

started this last night, Friday. Almost done now suprisingly. i'll finish tomorrow and post some pictures. for the most part i just need to install it and set the caster angle and i'll be almost done. all in all, the axle moved forward close to 3 inches. gives it quite the stance...

 

[alpinestar]

So far its been the little things here and there thats taking forever. its near completion tho, school cuts into my working time way too much. im gonna get the perches welded on the axles in the morning. maybe i'll have enough time to get the brake and steering hooked up too. but the problem i faced earlier was that my mounts were a half inch too narrow on the axle and it was running into the pumpkin on one side. i think i worked the problems out of that now tho and it should be driveable...

 

[JohnnyU]

I'm interested to see how you are running your steering with the axle pushed forward 3"....

 

[alpinestar]

its the stock wrangler steering. i have my axle rotated to 84 degrees negative? i think. the yoke is pointing upwards slightly and the steering reaches just fine. also my leaf spring perches are pretty tall to help clear the steering. one of these days when im not still working on it i'll put up a ton of pics. been really busy lately.