5.0 with auto eec used with a manual trans

[kmalcom]

I have a 89 5.0 out of a grand marquee. I am wanting to put a t-18 behind it. Is there going to be problems with the eec without the auto trans and cruise control. ?

 

[RangerSVT]

It will run, but you will have a surging idle and timing will be slightly different, but it will still operate. You can run it to get you on the road, but look for an A9L soon...

SVT

 

[shane96ranger]

I've done 3 AOD to T5 swaps on Mustangs. Two were A9P ECU's (mass air), and the other was an 86 GT with speed density. The two A9P's were fine from the get go. But my 86 GT took a couple times driving it to adjust, but ran great afterwards. All 3 of the Mustangs idled at about 700 rpm. By comparison my 89 GT, which is a factory manual trans, idles at about 550 rpms. Also, when pushing in the clutch, the auto computer takes longer to return to idle.

Maybe with it being a Grand Marquis computer it's a bit different than Mustangs though.

 

[kmalcom]

Thanks for the replies. Mine is a speed density for now. When I get around to doing the mass air conversion I would assume the a9l would be the best ecu for the total package.

 

[WerxRacing]

From what I know( been build on mustangs for 30yrs ). The A9P in a 5spd runs great. So many post in the mustang forums will support that. It helps on race car to gain 3 to 5 tenths on the track . No surge issues. But I am looking & trying to dig up info on ecu ideas. I am wondering if the F150 ecu would or would not be a better choice since it is about tow power & toque . Plus a mustang ecu is for HO. 351 firing order over the 302 firing order. So if going A9L or A9P would need to put a HO cam . But the F150 is non -HO. So thinking it would be a better choice. Working on researching this.

 

[WerxRacing]

So I been all over google this week. I have 30yrs in the mustangs & know that HO ecu will not fire the NON-HO engine. Well after joining & reading post on grand marquis forums , f-150 forums & t-bird ones as well they are the same as the mustangs. Will not happen.

SO if kmalcom goes with a 86-88 SD HO or the 89-93 MAF HO he needs a HO cam as I expected

Also from what I know with SD to MAF conversion The SD HO ecu is better than MAF unless a person goes BIG cam like F-303 or more. Or if going boost.

Also from being on the grand marquis forums. They seem to like f-150 cames with there ecu. 441/447 lift. The HO stang cams are 444/444 . But the pain to rewire for a lil hp is not worth it. So once they built up the engine they then go mustang maf.

So why not stick with the gmq ecu & put in a f-150 cam if your looking to toque over hp. crawl them rocks & pull & all better. even put a set of 1.7 on the f-150 cam to make it 468 / 474 lift

 

[shane96ranger]

Whoooa there buddy. It will work. It is not optimal, but the fuel will get there. It is the same principal as a batch fire system, like the F150 uses. The fuel will wait its turn. It could also be rewired rather easily.



Sent from a Commodore 64 using a 300 baud modem

 

[RangerSVT]

Shane, your right. That's the problem that the blue jeep had when it came to me. It ran fine, idled great, but once you drove it and it had a load on the motor, it was popping bad. Turns out it had a non ho truck ecu (87) with an ho motor (95 f150). I was going to edo the harness and swap ecu's but I came across a help of a deal on a 97 ex 5.0 package and went with that...


SVT

 

[WerxRacing]

So shane ur saying all the guys in the GMQ group. cougar group & f-150 are wrong. You can put a HO ecu on a non-HO motor the firing order would be wrong. car would not run right unless you put a HO cam into the non-HO motor to wrk with that ecu.

AS for SD HO or MAF HO. Just to be cost effective I would think the SD HO ecu is a better choice for kmalcom

MAF ecu 100.oo, to rewire to put a MAF plug in 25.oo. A MAF meter 20.oo from salvage yard

SD HO ecu 30.oo to 50.oo. a lil time to movie a few wires.. DONE.

But I still think leave it non-HO & get a f-150 ecu over his GMQ one. If he wants to up te power a bit the rockers will help. But think he not care for performance hp. But tq for the climbs & trails or towwing

 

[shane96ranger]

So shane ur saying all the guys in the GMQ group. cougar group & f-150 are wrong. You can put a HO ecu on a non-HO motor the firing order would be wrong. car would not run right unless you put a HO cam into the non-HO motor to wrk with that ecu.

AS for SD HO or MAF HO. Just to be cost effective I would think the SD HO ecu is a better choice for kmalcom

MAF ecu 100.oo, to rewire to put a MAF plug in 25.oo. A MAF meter 20.oo from salvage yard

SD HO ecu 30.oo to 50.oo. a lil time to movie a few wires.. DONE.

But I still think leave it non-HO & get a f-150 ecu over his GMQ one. If he wants to up te power a bit the rockers will help. But think he not care for performance hp. But tq for the climbs & trails or towwing

OK, a batch fire fires 2 injectors at once. The F150's use a batch fire. So, when one of them shoots fuel, one of those intake valves is closed. When it opens, the motor sucks the fuel in. That said - running an HO ECU on a non-HO motor may not run as optimal as it should. So, what you do is repin the injectors when using the A9L or other HO ECU's. Here is a little info in the link below on how to do it. The HO ECU is much better, it has better spark/timing tables - particularly the A9P. Also, I don't know why you would want to use a speed density system. They may have a little more oomph on some of them, but not all of them. Most of why the SD cars were quicker though was the cam, not the ECU.


http://oldfuelinjection.com/?p=92 <---- click me for detailed instructions

 

[WerxRacing]

I understand all the batch fire & that you can repin. But my point is why go threw so much headache to rewire like i said before.

Also the A9L is better than the A9P in a 5spd stang. So IF he does rewire to go MAF HO ecu I would think the A9L would be a better pick. I am looking at this as cost effective & simplicity.

Plus before I would do all the re pinning wrk, I would think of a non-HO is 155hp & if put a HO cam in your up to 200hp. So why not get a cam. Then either of the HO ecu in there.

Oh.. the link i have had in my book marks for a few yrs. I know the site..
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Plus a side note. WOW.. Like the build thread on the pony.. SWEET.

 

[RangerSVT]

Most likely I'll head over to Kayle's and do an ex efi system swap on it, its better than both the non ho and ho obd1 systems, plus I can get everything (ecu, harness and all related sensors) cheap and plentiful around me, much easier and cheaper than an ho or mustang harness ecu. Kayle, hit me up when your ready to upgrade, I can have you up and running in a few hours...

SVT

 

[WerxRacing]

Hey was talking to me about A9P when we was on trail last weekend. I told him I was thinking a truck ecu would be a better choice. but if going with a stang one the A9L. His ride is so so sweet. He has did a lot to it. This is why I got into researching. I would like to help him find the most effective working set-up.

SVT the day you all do the rewire work I would be glad to help. Since you know whats up. I'll pass the tools & beers. I would be glad to learn. I have a post now of my own. I want to build a crawler / trailer as well

 

[shane96ranger]

I understand all the batch fire & that you can repin. But my point is why go threw so much headache to rewire like i said before.

Also the A9L is better than the A9P in a 5spd stang. So IF he does rewire to go MAF HO ecu I would think the A9L would be a better pick. I am looking at this as cost effective & simplicity.

Plus before I would do all the re pinning wrk, I would think of a non-HO is 155hp & if put a HO cam in your up to 200hp. So why not get a cam. Then either of the HO ecu in there.

Oh.. the link i have had in my book marks for a few yrs. I know the site..
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Plus a side note. WOW.. Like the build thread on the pony.. SWEET.

The A9P is pretty dang good in a 5 speed Stang. The timing advances quicker, and that really is the biggest difference between the A9P and A9L. One of these days, I'll finally find an A9P for a decent price, and it's going in the Stang. It was very noticeable in the two MAF AOD to T5 swaps I've done. Here's a spark table - if you notice, the A9P has an extra 10 degrees of timing advance right off the bat. The X3Z is the ECU used in the 93 Cobra.

A9L
RPM______0____0____1,000___1,800___2,150___2,600___3,500___5,000___16,384
Degrees___8____8_____8______18.5____21.5____22.5_____22______25_____25
A9P
RPM_______0____0____0______1,600___2,250____2,600___3,500___5,000___16,384
Degrees___18____18____18_____18______22______23______22______26______26
X3Z
RPM______0____0____1,000___1,800___2,150___2,600___3,500___5,000___16,384
Degrees___8____8_____8______18.5____21.5____22.5_____22______25_____25

 

[WerxRacing]

The A9P is pretty dang good in a 5 speed Stang. The timing advances quicker, and that really is the biggest difference between the A9P and A9L. One of these days, I'll finally find an A9P for a decent price, and it's going in the Stang. It was very noticeable in the two MAF AOD to T5 swaps I've done. Here's a spark table - if you notice, the A9P has an extra 10 degrees of timing advance right off the bat. The X3Z is the ECU used in the 93 Cobra.

A9L
RPM______0____0____1,000___1,800___2,150___2,600___3,500___5,000___16,384
Degrees___8____8_____8______18.5____21.5____22.5_____22______25_____25
A9P
RPM_______0____0____0______1,600___2,250____2,600___3,500___5,000___16,384
Degrees___18____18____18_____18______22______23______22______26______26
X3Z
RPM______0____0____1,000___1,800___2,150___2,600___3,500___5,000___16,384
Degrees___8____8_____8______18.5____21.5____22.5_____22______25_____25

WoW. Well I been in the stang game for 30 yr (the last 8 kind on the side lines but still in) & a Company called Interactive Systems did a dyno & track test on a 92 LX 5spd. Passes with the stock ecu & then plugged in a A9L & the stang gained like 5tenths on the track & 3-5 hp & tq on the dyno pulls. But that was back around 1996 or 1997 time frame.. Wish I had the book in hand but its at my shop some place.

Can you find or show charts for all the other mustang ecu's? I would really like to see more info.. Knowledge is power. LOL And helpful

X3Z 5.0 93 Cobra MAF / Manual
A9L 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Manual
A3M 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Manual
A3M1 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Manual
S0Z 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Manual
D3D1 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Manual
A9M 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Auto
A9P 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Auto
C3W 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Auto
C3W1 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Auto
A9T 5.0 89-93 Mustang MAF / Auto
A9S 5.0 88-93 CA Mustang MAF / Manual
8LD 5.0 88-93 CA Mustang MAF / Manual
8LF 5.0 88-93 CA Mustang MAF / Auto
DA1 5.0 87 Mustang SD-SFI / Manual
DB1 5.0 87 Mustang SD-SFI / Manual
DC 5.0 Mustang SD-SFI / Auto
DE 5.0 Mustang SD-SFI / Auto