The autumn years of the ICE should be the golden years for the ICE.

[PetroleumJunkie412]

Why would I wanna see your backside? Under ANY circumstances?

Says the guy who wrote this post on either a laptop or a mobile phone, with a battery, that sourced materials for said battery from................

The same <censored> place that the raw materials for an electric car battery came from.

Do lithium mines use child labour? I'm not about to dispute that fact. In fact, I did some fact checking a few weeks ago, and that fact was NOT disputed by the site I checked. HOWEVER, the site that I checked points out that All Lithium-Ion batteries get their Lithium (and other raw materials) from the same place as the battery found in an electric car.

You might wanna try a different argument.

 

[PetroleumJunkie412]

other news about EVs my apologies for the frightening picture
Michigan plans 1st US electric vehicle charging road by 2023 | WOODTV.com

You had to make me look at her, didn't you?

 

[DeathRanger]

The thing is. All vehicles are expensive. The average new car price in the U.S. in December was $47,077. My Ranger and Tesla were basically the same price.

Here's build and spec now

Ranger Tremor - $48,590
Tesla Model 3 Long Range - $52,490

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

The thing is. All vehicles are expensive. The average new car price in the U.S. in December was $47,077. My Ranger and Tesla were basically the same price.

Here's build and spec now

Ranger Tremor - $48,590
Tesla Model 3 Long Range - $52,490

View attachment 71857

Price comparable vehicles though, like a camry or whatever. Not a high end offroad pickup.

Might as well of picked a wagoneer that starts in the mid 70's so we can marvel how the electric car is cheaper than gas...

 

[bobbywalter]

The Hummer is a bargain...

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

The Hummer is a bargain...

Yeah, you can snag nice looking ones for like $5-15k surplus. Makes for a pretty cheap 3/4 ton.

 

[RonD]

Electricity was "Known" as early as 2,700BC in writing about what we now know as "electric fish, eels and rays" and of course "static electrical" shocks
In 1600's a British scientist named it, he was rubbing Amber to create static charges, Latin for Amber is electrum or greek elektron, sound familiar, so he called it electricus mean "of Amber"
So electrons and electricity got their names from Amber
Yet no one built an electric car for 300 years, WTF????

Learn something new every day


Heck, I could "hack" your old cars with a few bottles of hooch and a good story
Be honest, that's all it would really take

All your base are belong to us

 

[bobbywalter]

Yeah, you can snag nice looking ones for like $5-15k surplus. Makes for a pretty cheap 3/4 ton.

https://www.gmc.com/electric/hummer-ev



Lolz

It's gotz da crabz crawl and da skidz.

 

[scotts90ranger]

There's one fact that I think everyone can agree on here, the bureaucratic BS that is being fed to everyone is dumb... At work we certify engines through EPA and sometimes CARB (when they aren't too dumb for their own good), the EPA knows engines and how they work, if you use engineering judgment they will likely listen. The CARB dummies don't know what an engine is, tried to make a universal document once and the person didn't know what a "boosted application" meant... heard about another with a CNG compressor v8 engine using half the engine to power it say that it wasn't an engine since nothing was attached to the back...

Then there's the reason I'm on the east coast right now... the dumbest thing I've ever heard of, I mean it's a cool setup but dumb that it's a thing... They have an engine with a vacuum pump putting a suction on a retired coal mine pulling the methane out of the mine instead of it naturally venting to atmosphere... that sentence has potential, but I haven't gotten to the dumb yet... They in turn pump the methane into a burner to be burned off as completely as possible, still not dumb yet... they do this to generate carbon credits for California to sell off making a lot of $$. This is a V8 engine running about 15hp at the site I went to (so say 35kw reserve power, yeah I know I'm mixing units, I don't know how many squirrel power that is...). If they used the reserve power to run a generator they would have to subtract that from what they would be generating with the burners... I'm not against it, I like being able to pay my bills, but things are getting silly...

I just don't understand the reasoning of a lot of things anymore, and I have this funny thing where I try to apply logic to most things in my life... nuclear power is evil (because of shortcuts made 40+ years ago in Russia mainly I'm pretty sure...), dams are evil because they hurt fish (I'm there on some level, but there has to be a compromise, gravity always works and water is an incompressible liquid so it is inherently efficient...), solar uses bad chemicals (for now at least) and wind turbines have a finite blade life with no means of disposal or recycling... Where is this magical 15% extra electricity going to come from? Sure it might not add up to much wattage in comparison to every day life but it is in addition to everything it can't keep up with now, not replacing anything...

 

[RonD]

I got a second phone charger for my office, screw the environmentalists

 

[bobbywalter]

There's one fact that I think everyone can agree on here, the bureaucratic BS that is being fed to everyone is dumb... At work we certify engines through EPA and sometimes CARB (when they aren't too dumb for their own good), the EPA knows engines and how they work, if you use engineering judgment they will likely listen. The CARB dummies don't know what an engine is, tried to make a universal document once and the person didn't know what a "boosted application" meant... heard about another with a CNG compressor v8 engine using half the engine to power it say that it wasn't an engine since nothing was attached to the back...

Then there's the reason I'm on the east coast right now... the dumbest thing I've ever heard of, I mean it's a cool setup but dumb that it's a thing... They have an engine with a vacuum pump putting a suction on a retired coal mine pulling the methane out of the mine instead of it naturally venting to atmosphere... that sentence has potential, but I haven't gotten to the dumb yet... They in turn pump the methane into a burner to be burned off as completely as possible, still not dumb yet... they do this to generate carbon credits for California to sell off making a lot of $$. This is a V8 engine running about 15hp at the site I went to (so say 35kw reserve power, yeah I know I'm mixing units, I don't know how many squirrel power that is...). If they used the reserve power to run a generator they would have to subtract that from what they would be generating with the burners... I'm not against it, I like being able to pay my bills, but things are getting silly...

I just don't understand the reasoning of a lot of things anymore, and I have this funny thing where I try to apply logic to most things in my life... nuclear power is evil (because of shortcuts made 40+ years ago in Russia mainly I'm pretty sure...), dams are evil because they hurt fish (I'm there on some level, but there has to be a compromise, gravity always works and water is an incompressible liquid so it is inherently efficient...), solar uses bad chemicals (for now at least) and wind turbines have a finite blade life with no means of disposal or recycling... Where is this magical 15% extra electricity going to come from? Sure it might not add up to much wattage in comparison to every day life but it is in addition to everything it can't keep up with now, not replacing anything...

Man.....I can have you rotflyao....


Especially with the teach to the test method....

 

[scotts90ranger]

I got a second phone charger for my office, screw the environmentalists

I'm charging mine off of a laptop right now...

 

[rusty ol ranger]

I don't know, won't be too long before we have Electric Hearses
Your kids may get you in one yet
You better put it in your will, NO EVs at my funeral!!


Horses were great but ICE was better

ICE is great but EVs are better


“Things change. They always do, its one of the things of nature.
Most people are afraid of change but if you look at it as something you can always count on, then it can be a comfort.”
— Robert James Waller

Better is subjective.

 

[stmitch]

Haven't we gone through this stuff like a thousand times already?
- EVs are more harmful to the environment to manufacture than similar ICEs, but quickly get cleaner than a comparable ICE, even if they get their power from coal. And coal is being phased out quickly. With electricity that's cleaner than coal, they make up the difference even faster.
- Not all EVs have to be expensive luxury vehicles (Kia/Hyundai, GM, VW and Ford offer EVs with at least 250 miles of range under the average new vehicle price). It's just that OEMs have figured out that they're more profitable that way. For what it's worth, the Lightning EV is actually cheaper than an ICE F150 with the same layout and options, and as battery cost/kwh continues to decline there will be more EV options at more prices.
- Over time, even these expensive EVs will depreciate and become available for less money on the used market. It's not much different than saying that poor people can't afford a new BMW. But go into a rough neighborhood and you're bound to see some baller on a budget driving a 15 year old 3 Series or X5. Used EVs could be a huge benefit to lower income people since they're cheaper to operate and require less maintenance.
- Charging at home is super fast and convenient. It's an obvious benefit for those that can do it, and cheaper than public charging. If you can't charge at home, then owning an EV is more hassle but that situation is improving all the time as infrastructure is built out.
- If society wide environmental improvements are the goal, then full EVs with 300+ miles of range probably aren't the best approach. We could get far more miles driven under EV power with the same amount of resources by splitting the batteries into smaller ones and installing them into PHEVs.
- EVs don't work for every single person or use. There are things that they struggle with. But they are a pretty good fit for more and more people all the time. If they don't work for you, or you don't want one then don't buy one. It's pretty simple.

 

[Eddo Rogue]

As a side note to the use more electricity because it’s more environmentally thing. They push for more electricity to be used and then (at least around here) send out informational mailings about how your electricity usage rates and gives you “bad boy” ratings for using more than others around you.

Pick one.

I see commercials on the TV to reduce usage after 9pm, its says to do laundry in the daytime. Then I read, hear, and notice, electricity is cheaper after 7pm, when all the 9 to 5 office buildings shut down for the night. Its very conflicting.