project family wheeler. chop top 1 ton explorer.

[--weezl--]

the other thing to realize is that with the shackles on the rear, as you hit an obstacle, the tires will move rearward and away from the obstacle, which causes you to bounce on the rock or such, with the shackle on the front, when you hit the obstacle, your tires move forward slightly, and work as if you had bumped it harder, and will resist the truck bouncing as you climb the obstacle more...

though as others said, the clearance is the biggest thing, the geometric thing above should be second to that...

 

[NMB2]

With the shackle in the front, as the axle droops, it will push the axle back - resulting is less slip in the driveshaft.

Rear shackle is the way to go though, for clearance reasons like slo-vo said. As long as your driveshaft has enough slip to work over the full range of motion of your axle, you're good to go.

Lookin good mang. Good progress today.

the other thing to realize is that with the shackles on the rear, as you hit an obstacle, the tires will move rearward and away from the obstacle, which causes you to bounce on the rock or such, with the shackle on the front, when you hit the obstacle, your tires move forward slightly, and work as if you had bumped it harder, and will resist the truck bouncing as you climb the obstacle more...

though as others said, the clearance is the biggest thing, the geometric thing above should be second to that...

you both missed it. (not saying what you said wasn't true)

Shackle in front sucks because they will invert, and can break your leaf spring. If you build a stopper, to try and prevent the shackle from inverting... it will break your leaf spring.

 

[86 slo-vo]

you both missed it. (not saying what you said wasn't true)

Shackle in front sucks because they will invert, and can break your leaf spring. If you build a stopper, to try and prevent the shackle from inverting... it will break your leaf spring.

yea thats what i was most worried about, i dont wan to be trying to change a spring on the trail

 

[Robert_1967]

Maybe someone might want to tell that guy on Extreme that....




Robert

 

[NMB2]

Maybe someone might want to tell that guy on Extreme that....




Robert

Who? Ian? I've met that dude, and I'm positive he knows this.

 

[det107]

Shackle in front sucks because they will invert, and can break your leaf spring.

Is it safe to say that it's FRONT axle wrap ?

 

[NMB2]

Is it safe to say that it's FRONT axle wrap ?

yep. Happens mostly when climbing stuff, which is the worst time. Axle rotates forward, shackle unloads and pops back.

 

[Robert_1967]

Who? Ian? I've met that dude, and I'm positive he knows this.

yep, him, he is always saying to put the shackles in the front, so when your up against a wall/cliff or what ever, it will push the axle back, and then when it comes up, and over the axle will pop forward and help it get over the edge.


I really have no idea, since I have never gone rock climbing,, or any other 4x4ing, only thing I have done it hit the lake bottom a few times and spin mud and slide sideways....Also my 89 BII is my first 4x4, unless you count the Big trucks I use to drive with the tandem axles.



Robert

 

[NMB2]

yep, him, he is always saying to put the shackles in the front, so when your up against a wall/cliff or what ever, it will push the axle back, and then when it comes up, and over the axle will pop forward and help it get over the edge.


Robert

That is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard, your axle doesn't move nearly as much as that would imply. Interesting though how they would be pedaling that nonsense.

Trust me... if you are starting with no front axle, and deciding to put the shackle in front or rear.... you put it in the rear. Front shackles were used on some vehicles because they are smoother on the road generally, that's pretty much it.

Read this

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=845026&highlight=shackle

 

[--weezl--]

yep, him, he is always saying to put the shackles in the front, so when your up against a wall/cliff or what ever, it will push the axle back, and then when it comes up, and over the axle will pop forward and help it get over the edge.


I really have no idea, since I have never gone rock climbing,, or any other 4x4ing, only thing I have done it hit the lake bottom a few times and spin mud and slide sideways....Also my 89 BII is my first 4x4, unless you count the Big trucks I use to drive with the tandem axles.



Robert

it does actually work like that, but as i said, as long as the clearance issues don't get in the way... if you've got your shackles set up properly, and never have them hitting things, you won't have the issue of broken springs...

 

[NMB2]

it does actually work like that, but as i said, as long as the clearance issues don't get in the way... if you've got your shackles set up properly, and never have them hitting things, you won't have the issue of broken springs...

Just out of curiosity, how many times have you rock crawled with a front shackled setup?

Countless times for me, and I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that that reasoning holds no water in real life. You would never notice the difference between rear shackle or front shackle "bumping you over an obstacle". Front shackle is just a bit smoother when you are hammering your tires into things. You will however run into spring breakage much more often, even with a "properly setup front shackle". It is the nature of the beast.

Read the PBB link I posted to learn more.

 

[NMB2]

got to thinking about it, and I even have some pics.

Just on that obstacle alone he inverted his shackles probably 6 times. He carries a big pry bar in his jeep so someone can pop them back over every time it happens.

I even remember him making a funny face because both of them ended up inverting over (that was fun to fix up on Blacksheep)

 

[NMB2]

crap I forgot about this guy too. Front shackles.

Hard to see in this pic, but you can't even see a glimmer of the leaf bolt on the pass side, and the shackle is clearly not in the position it should be. Leaf completely bent into a 90* and then actually broke IIRC.

and yes I understand that is a straight vertical 40"+ rock and a lot of load on a leaf spring, but it would not affect a rear shackled setup.

Same obstacle.

 

[Robert_1967]

as I typed, I don't know , I just know Ian (or how ever his name is spelled) says that the front shackle is the better setup, SO I guess someone needs to let him know about the pit falls of the front shackle.

I really don't care, I don't have either, and won't be doing one, unless I can find a old 30 to 50 model front axle out of a 2wd Ford truck for my 2wd ranger



Robert

 

[NMB2]

Oh I understand it doesn't pertain to you and you didn't know for sure, just trying to get the info out there so people can understand that not everything you watch on Extreme4x4 is true. I'm very surprised they are saying that on there, as Ian is a very cool guy and knowledgeable. This topic has been beat to death over on PBB and it is pretty wide known comparison.

The main reason that a lot of people would run front shackles (like the teal XJ) is that rear shackles points your diff into the dirt and is sometimes very hard to correct. I had to build 7* steel shims and weld them into my axle perches to correct my castor.