Unions....good or bad?

[Evan]

If it wasnt for the unions every one of you people would be working 70 hrs a week and only getting paid for 40.

No, the government has a minumum wage law, so nobody would be making .40/hour.

And I have no software developer's union to represent my line of work. We make $60,000 starting salary for a 40 hour work week, not .40/hour. That's MARKET price, the $60,000 salary has NOTHING to do with any union.

You're dead wrong with that statement.

America was built on the back of union workers so yeah your welcome.

No, it was built on the opposite. Free-markets, reward for hard work and innovation, etc.

 

[lilwhitelighting]

yeah blood,courage and innovation of union workers.

 

[v-8power]

No, the government has a minumum wage law, so nobody would be making .40/hour.

And I have no software developer's union to represent my line of work. We make $60,000 starting salary for a 40 hour work week, not .40/hour. That's MARKET price, the $60,000 salary has NOTHING to do with any union.

You're dead wrong with that statement.




No, it was built on the opposite. Free-markets, reward for hard work and innovation, etc.

I think you misread what was posted. He meant you would work 70hrs. for 40hrs. pay.

But they have wage laws because of unions lobying for them.

 

[lilwhitelighting]

i know for a fact a non union company in ohio out bid union because they were working there men 70 hrs a week and only paying them for for forty.so our union and the state of ohio sue them and they had to retro pay every one of there guys.union lost the bid do to labor cost but in the end it cost them more if they just would of hired us

 

[Evan]

I think you misread what was posted. He meant you would work 70hrs. for 40hrs. pay.

Opps. I think you're right.

Either statement is still totally wrong however.

 

[bseamop]

I have been a laborer in Ohio for 17 years ,5 of these were in the local union hall(894 Akron Oh),I have seen literally dozens of companies get run into the ground by over paid and lazy union workers,in what other situation could you ever have myself with 15 yrs experience pouring concrete and some chump who just bought his first pair of workboots making the same wage?,what a joke.It will cost you in excess of 4-500 dollars and 4 years of working at 2/3s or less of the union scale to get that "free training" from the carpenters or steelworkers that we hear about.The unions were a necessity in 1898 but right now they are milking our economy dry,opening a history book will not put any food in your kids mouths (or 33s on my truck lol).While I was in the Akron hall we had a little over 1300 members and we never had less than 600 on our non working list,since I left the union I have had the best working years of my concrete career,people here get paid what they are worth and if they prove unworthy they are gone.If you think the process is that fair and straight forward in a union environment you are mistaken.It is my firm belief that companies are leaving the US because they refuse to be told who they can hire and how much they will pay them.My favorite example of the farce that is the union construction industry is the new Cleveland Browns Stadium,Cleveland is a strong union town and would not allow anything other than union contractors to bid work at the stadium.The job came in a full year behind schedule and cost double the planned budget!!

 

[Ozwynn]

I don't recall union workers as part of the revolution. I don't recall unions inventing any new technologies, I don't seem to recall any union scientists or engineers. If Union workers were so courageous then why do the need unions? Where were the Unions to negotiate with the Indians when the great westward movement happened. I don't seem to recall any unions when the fir trade on gold trade started. Cattle unions seem to be missing from the south west. I don't recall Wyatt Earp belonginh to any Law Enforcement unions. I don't seem to be able to find the Unions that the founding fathers belonged to. What union was Ben Franklin (inventor of the pot belly stove, bifocal, discoverer of electricity) belonged to, please name the union that Thomas Eddison belonged to. What about Henry Ford, I don't see any mention of the UAW in innovating the assembally line. Please tell me what labor union freed the slaves. Did I leave anybody out? we now have federal laws in place to replace every labor union out there.


also I cannot recall anything the union invented or innovated.

 

[Evan]

i know for a fact a non union company in ohio out bid union because they were working there men 70 hrs a week and only paying them for for forty.so our union and the state of ohio sue them and they had to retro pay every one of there guys.union lost the bid do to labor cost but in the end it cost them more if they just would of hired us

That's not legal to have someone work overtime without pay, unless they were salaried which I doubt they were.

But you don't need a union to fix that problem...just throw the book at that company.

 

[goodrich63]

That is ILLEGAL. All employers are required to carry WC. Unless horseplay was involved, that should not have happened to you. It would not happen at my non-union company. Your story has nothing to do with the union/non-union debate.



I have CAREFULLY studied both the interim cash flow statements and balance sheets of GM. Those two filings are much more accurate than any corporate website. They are in SERIOUS trouble. Their assets are rediculously leveraged. Many business analysts predict GM can't make it to the end of this year without an infusion of bailout money.

7 count them 7 corperate jets. that one of them the ceo of gm uses to run back and forth to work in at 20 grand a round trip flight a day. i think he needs the cash infusion that we the tax payers are gonna pay for is for his daily commute...

As for my back injury you are right it was illegal i had to sue to get my bills paid. and i won. the juge asked me if i wanted my job back and i declined.
and it has everything to do with union represntion, if there was a union in place it would have never happened there was no horseplay or neglegence involved they just didnt want to pay. and im not the only one that has happened to at that place. companies can do what ever the hell they want union or not, and if you dont believe that your pretty naieve.

 

[Ozwynn]

7 count them 7 corperate jets. that one of them the ceo of gm uses to run back and forth to work in at 20 grand a round trip flight a day. i think he needs the cash infusion that we the tax payers are gonna pay for is for his daily commute...

As for my back injury you are right it was illegal i had to sue to get my bills paid. and i won. the juge asked me if i wanted my job back and i declined.
and it has everything to do with union represntion, if there was a union in place it would have never happened there was no horseplay or neglegence involved they just didnt want to pay. and im not the only one that has happened to at that place. companies can do what ever the hell they want union or not, and if you dont believe that your pretty naieve.

you worked for a bad company. there are federal and state laws to prevent that. the company you worked for deserves to go under.

If that damn Teamsters rep starts sniffing around my company I will bury him under the concrete floor in my shop.

 

[Evan]

companies can do what ever the hell they want

So you're telling me GM could lower workers' wages if they wanted? Cut pension payouts to reduce operating costs? No, they couldn't. A non-union company could. The non-union company would still be in business, and GM will go bankrupt. Those jobs will all go overseas, or if we're lucky, down south where there isn't a union, entitlement mentality.

I think GM is down from 7 to 3-5 jets now....just barely scrapping by, lol. Even 7 jets is pocket change compared to GMs troubles through.

 

[Mark_88]

In the USWA I was not paid the same as experienced workers, so they can instill a graduated pay rate based on experience. It takes upwards of a year to fully train for the job I was doing and I don't remember exactly, but I wasn't getting full wages for the first year...but once you reach your probation period and can do the work you're supposed to do when fully trained then you are entitled to the full rate.

But, having said that, there's not usually an option for an employer to cut back unless it is negotiated through the proper process...and whether that actually happens, along with corporate perk cutbacks is yet to be seen...

 

[goodrich63]

GM could and should negotiate with the union and its CEOs for lower wages, they should renegotiate paying their executives full benefits and pensions, Maybe they should reconsider Wagoner who even back in 2004 when GM was loosing money reinstated CEO multi million dollar bonuses.

Do you see the irony? It took years of the Big 3 spending hundreds of millions of dollars fighting the governments efforts that started back in the 70's to mandate more fuel efficient cars, before they would accept a "loan" agreement from the government for $25 billion dollars to help the Big 3 produce more fuel efficent cars back months ago. So the 25 billion is sitting there approved going through the beaurocratic channels and low and behold the Big 3 fly on their private jets to meet with Congress to ask for that same amount of money because they are broke but yet they won't show Congress their full hand of cards? This isn't a poker game!

Do you think the Big 3 are loosing customers because according to CAFE foreign made cars get better gas milage by almost 12%? Whos fault is that?

One more thing, if we ever needed public assistance, there is no way I would show up to the public aid office in my new Lambo and any other assets, wouldn't I sell those first and try to get myself out of the hole I am in before asking for help that is offered or would I just take the help that is offered only change the terms of the help to benefit me?

 

[chittybangbang]

.My favorite example of the farce that is the union construction industry is the new Cleveland Browns Stadium,Cleveland is a strong union town and would not allow anything other than union contractors to bid work at the stadium.The job came in a full year behind schedule and cost double the planned budget!!

That entire project was fast tracked.Keep building and worry about the details later.I doubt it had anything to do with the unions.Also projects like that are pretty much union only gigs.Just the way it is.

 

[Carlos Murphy]

Unions...

Like someone here said, unions are good AND bad, look at the "big 3" car makers.
I worked for a car dealership in Calif. that was union for 25 years, I retired in 03 and my pension along with S.S makes me quite comfortable but I can tell you, I EARNED my pension with all the bull shit (from both sides) I had to put up with for those years.