School me on shocks and valving!

[Rowdy Fitzgerald]

I’ll start off by saying I’ve never messed with quality shocks. I’m not totally ignorant, just mostly... I’m nearing the stage of my build where I’m researching shocks and valving. I’m leaning towards either 2” or 2.5” bilstein 7100’s with reservoirs.

My plans are to install extended radius arms (15” longer), it has a 4” lift on it and to install jeep coils. I’m not sure of the amount of travel yet so the length is TBD.

But what I don’t know is, is there a common valving for a mild built prerunner ranger with a 4.0 ohv?

Is there a certain amount of rebound or compression I should be shooting for? Or do I just buy shims and start playing with the valving until I find what the truck likes?

 

[4x4junkie]

I'm not as familiar with Bilstein's valving number structure as Fox, but indeed there are times you may need to play around with the valve stack some to find what works.

Typically you'll want somewhat less compression damping than rebound, as this allows the suspension to soak up bumps easier without being overly harsh, while still providing enough damping that the suspension doesn't bounce you back up into the air after coming down on it.

What I did was contact Fox directly and gave them my vehicle info (total weight, weight distribution, spring rate, travel amount, suspension type, etc. and intended use) and they actually got me pretty darn close to the ballpark (30/90 front & 30/80 rear is what they recommended). I failed to mention to them I haul a lot of camping gear in the back of my BII, so the rear shocks wound up being a hair softer than I would've liked, but not so much to make me want to tear them down to revalve them (I figure I'll revalve them next time I rebuild them, which after 10 years, they're probably getting about due I s'pose).

 

[Rowdy Fitzgerald]

I plan to be hauling about 350lbs of hounds, another 75lbs for a dog box. Around another 300lbs of gear and 100lbs of food and fuel. So call it an even 1,000lbs over stock weight. Is that close to what you’re at, 4x4Junkie?

 

[4x4junkie]

You didn't mention what your vehicle is other than it's a Ranger... (Supercab? Reg Cab? Long or short bed?) This can make a big difference in weight (more than the engine does).

My BII is probably around 4300lbs with 400lbs of gear in the back (also winch & dual batteries), with very close to 50/50% weight distribution.

 

[RonD]

Your SPRINGS matter the most, IMO

If you are over sprung good shocks won't help, vehicle doesn't have enough weight to push the springs down, nothing the shock can help with there
With no shocks installed you should be able to bounce all the corners easily, if its stiff then that will be your ride
Shocks are there to slow the bounce a bit as they are compressed more, and to slow the rebound

 

[Rowdy Fitzgerald]

4x4Junkie: I’m sorry, it’s a an 89 extra cab, short bed, with a 4.0, D35 and 8.8 swap. I’m not sure what the GVW is. I’ll have to go weigh it.

 

[Rowdy Fitzgerald]

RonD- Yes sir, I agree.

 

[4x4junkie]

4x4Junkie: I’m sorry, it’s a an 89 extra cab, short bed, with a 4.0, D35 and 8.8 swap. I’m not sure what the GVW is. I’ll have to go weigh it.

That's enough info.
Stock (speaking of before a lift, tires, winch, bumpers, toolboxes, etc.) that truck should be somewhere in the neighborhood of 3800lbs, with about a 60/40% front-biased WD.

I'd get on the horn with Fox or Bilstein and see what they suggest. Figure an added 60-90lbs up front if you're adding a winch, another 50-100 for the bumper, things like sliders add maybe 35-50lbs each... Finally your dogs and whatever else you'll have in the back. Like Ron mentions, the shocks do have to be tuned more for your vehicle's weight than the springs. You'll need shocks significantly firmer than what I put on mine to control that amount of weight well.



Edit:
You mentioned Jeep coil springs... Cherokee XJ springs (what has been popular here in the past) will for sure be too soft (under-sprung) for the amount of weight you got going here. Are you perhaps thinking of Gladiator pickup springs?

 

[JOLENE_THE_RANGER]

eesh. so

no there is no common valving for any vehicle. not many prerunners running that setup youre describing...if any honestly. so itll be especially hard to answer your question.
valving will rely mostly on driving style, shock motion ratios, and un-sprung weight. on the contrary to whats been said, vehicle weight does not play a part in the compression shim stack...thats where the springs come in. your shims are not holding the vehicle up. they are slowing the force given by the wheel.

Personally i would suggest purchasing a used set of fox or king coilovers if a prerunner is what youre after. much easier to work on and more tuning options. also, thats what the majority of us run so getting valving notes will be way easier to get.
in a shock theres many parts of the valving not just compression and rebound. you need to take free bleed holes into consideration as well as shaft speeds. for the big hits (high shaft speeds) youll want much stiffer compression shims than you would in the small low speed shaft movement that way you keep a nice ride on the road. the bigger shims are for the slower shaft movement. the smaller ones are for the faster shaft movement.
rebound is fairly simple. you want it to be as fast as possible to keep the wheels falling into the holes and not packing up, but at the same time you dont want it too fast where it gives you that bouncy springy ride like oem replacement stuff. jussstttt right in the middle haha.

tuning is an on going battle. dont get discouraged and have fun with it

 

[Rowdy Fitzgerald]

Thanks for the info everyone!
Jolene: I’m building it like a prerunner because I drive a ton of desert roads. I figured since prerunners are built to go fast through this kinda terrain, it would improve the quality of my ride. I’m building it to improve comfort basically. No jumping or actual prerunner, go fast, cool stuff. I basically wanna be able to go 20-30 mph on rocky desert roads and not have a sore back when I get out.

 

[JOLENE_THE_RANGER]

Thanks for the info everyone!
Jolene: I’m building it like a prerunner because I drive a ton of desert roads. I figured since prerunners are built to go fast through this kinda terrain, it would improve the quality of my ride. I’m building it to improve comfort basically. No jumping or actual prerunner, go fast, cool stuff. I basically wanna be able to go 20-30 mph on rocky desert roads and not have a sore back when I get out.

everything i said still applies. haha
but if youre just after mild stuff, those shocks in stock form will get you there. just mount them as far out on the beam as you can.

 

[Rowdy Fitzgerald]

Thank you!

 

[gaz]

Rowdy,

As long as your springs run well with that load, I'll raise the dual James Duff 70/30's all around flag ..)

 

[Rowdy Fitzgerald]

Gaz- Right now, I’ve got a ranger main leaf with the rest being from an explorer pack. The front is a tuff country 4” lift coil.
It’s rough and jerky just running on a paved road. I’ll get the numbers off the jeep coils and figure out what the specs are for those.

 

[4x4junkie]

Thanks for the info everyone!
Jolene: I’m building it like a prerunner because I drive a ton of desert roads. I figured since prerunners are built to go fast through this kinda terrain, it would improve the quality of my ride. I’m building it to improve comfort basically. No jumping or actual prerunner, go fast, cool stuff. I basically wanna be able to go 20-30 mph on rocky desert roads and not have a sore back when I get out.

There's some good info appearing here...
That driving style was basically what I had gathered also (and is what I based my answers on), as indeed it is pretty hard to do actual "prerunner" style driving while carrying around all that weight (not to mention is hard on equipment (and dogs) too). Like an "overland" style rig.

Right now your problem is Tuff Country (I'd suggest they call themselves Rough Country, but that name is already taken lol). Their springs are among the stiffest, and also the crappy twin-tube shocks. So almost anything short of a bottom-of-the-barrel Monroe would be an improvement.
With my current setup (2.0 resi all around), it's rare that I have to go slower than about 30 MPH on most desert roads (usually only when large dips or whoop-de-doos are present). I know actual prerunners can go far faster, but I also don't claim mine to be in the same league as them... Like you, I wanted the more comfort and suspension durability than what you'd have with an out-of-the-box bolt-on lift kit.
Airing down your tires significantly improves ride comfort too, though at some expense of handling.

As for springs, I think you got enough weight going there you could probably run the regular Skyjacker RBV springs (6" pt# 136, which would set you up right about 4" lift). SJ rates them 450PPI, but my own measurements seem to put them closer to 415PPI (Tuff's seem to be over 500). Whatever the case, you probably don't want to go lower than 325PPI unless you go to coilovers, otherwise the spring will just collapse down onto itself.