Roller Rocker install, excessive noise?

[fordtech1229]

i just installed a set of proform roller rockers on my 3.0 yesterday and it has excessive valvetrain noise, has anyone else experienced that or is it normal? i used the 1.7 full rollers and torqued them just like the wsm says.runs fine but very noisy.

 

[swynx]

Id go ask te guys at napa. the people at my napa store are certified and can ussualey diagnoze what i cant. The best part is there free

 

[cammeddrz]

roller rocker arms are much noiser,

in fact the LT corvette engines that had roller rockers from the factory needed a special "knock module" to stop the pcm from thinking the engine was knocking.

the LT camaro/trans am cars (that had the same engine, but didn't have roller rockers did not need this

 

[fordtech1229]

well the guys at napa wont know more than me, im about 6 months away from being 100 percent ford certified. in think i need to get a set of lash caps for it, im gonna pull a valve cover and take a peek at the lash

 

[agrich2]

Noisy rockers

I have done the same. Installed a set of Proform Rockers (1.6) ratio and they are NOISY. My truck sounds like a diesel. I'm about to pull my covers to just to see if I have an engine left. Just got done doing a total rebuild (new short block) and it sounds bad-like something is almost wrong. When it revs up, it doesn't sound too bad at all. I had a heck of a time getting the valve lash set and had to use shims to get it since the heads where remans and most likely shaved a bit.

What did you rockers and valve tips look like after you pulled the covers??

Thanks,
Aden

 

[stmitch]

What engine were the rockers designed for, and what if any mods did you do to make them work on the 3.0?

 

[Beef52751]

There shouldnt be any lash with the roller rockers. Your 3.0 has a hydraulic cam. You shouldve been compressing the lifter some as you installed them.

 

[agrich2]

Well since this was a new engine, there was no oil in the lifters. So I followed the recommended procedure in the manual. I changed the bolts that lock down the pedastal. They are 8.0mmx 45mm long. The rockers are 5/16 ford 302/351 pedastal mount rockers.
New pushrods and a shim kit to set the proper tip clearances per manual. Rollers did not center on the valve stem tip like all the builders say but neither do the factory ones as my old engine had 210k and the intake side of the tips were worn more than the center.

 

[JP02XLT]

First setting the tip clearance has nothing to do with the correct tip to roller geometry, 302 pedestals are too long tip to fulcrum for a 3.0 without proper shimming and changing the length of the pushrod accordingly. Second, I hope your running some kind of pushrod guide as was noted earlier these rockers are not self centering, the originals while not truly self-centering are trapped by the fulcrum bearing and limit the side to side walk of the rocker.

If you want to do it right, your going to need an adjustable length pushrod and shim / adjust to get the rocker tip into the center of the valve, and for the travel of the tip to be centered on the valve throughout the movement of the rocker, otherwise it slides instead of traveling up an down as it should.

While setting up a valve train is not black magic, there is an art to doing it correctly and anytime you change a ratio on a rocker or other valve train component its definitely not a bolt on and go item, otherwise you will see guides & valve stems trashed in a very short time.

I wasted a ported set of heads and lightened 5 angle ground valves in about 5-6K miles on a 3.0 trusting a set of pedestal mount rockers that were highly advertised here and another Ranger forum as true bolt-ons. When I brought up the issues to the seller, the kits immediately disappeared and were no longer for sale. I knew better than to believe the hype, but did not do the geometry checks as I should have.

So I developed my own Roller rocker kit, they are not noisy, the motor revs so fast its hard to believe its the same motor. I run 1.75 ratio, guides, hardened pushrods, beehive springs that are almost a 55% increase in tension over stock springs, and comp cams anti-pump lifters for a 302. This setup has been on this motor for almost 25K miles, there is no wear at all on either roller or valve tip. All this was done after adding the Whipple and blowing the valves off the seats at anything over 14 psi.

Not trying to be a know it all, but I have been in your situation, and had to fix someone else's mistakes that cost me $$$. Your heading down the same road, just a word caution to consider

JP02XLT

 

[agrich2]

I am believer now after hearing my noise. It sounds like the rockers are just rattling around in there. I am going to pull the intake back off and pull the covers and probably install original rockers back on. I don't have the time to find all of these parts. After doing a lot more research, I hear Pro-forms are not all that great of a rocker anyways.
Just out of curiosity, where did you get these pushrods/shims and guides at?

Thanks,
Aden

 

[agrich2]

Also, can you even get guides for a pedestal mount rocker arm??

Thanks,'
Aden

 

[JP02XLT]

Custom length pushrods came from Smith Brothers, Great people to deal with, the guides are for a 302 stud mount, You may be correct about not having them for pedestal mount, in which case the rollers have to be self-aligning. The shims are just standard shims for pedestal type rockers.

While Proform may not be ultra high dollar setup, when installed correctly they will give you good results, I have used them on several budget motors for friends with no issues.

JP02XLT

 

[agrich2]

Roller rockers

Thanks for the replies. Your information has really helped me out. I just ordered a new set of standard rockers and fulcrums. Since this is my daily driver, I need it to run and be dependable. Once I get another commuter car, I will try and tackle the job. I just need my truck back, going down the road. Since I polished all the intake manifold/throttle body and MAF sensor, I think it will have a little more power. The engine is also from a 2007 ranger with the newer style pistons which will up the compression a little as well. All together, it should put out another 10-15 hp. This should help me out with MPG and being able to use 5 gear (I have a 3.73 rear end)

Thanks again,
Aden

 

[agrich2]

Valve lash

Just out of curiosity, how do you set the lash on the valves now that the lifters are filled with oil

 

[JP02XLT]

Well with the stud mount types, I run the nut down to zero lash, no loose up and down motion on the rocker, and your still able to spin the pushrod with your fingers, then turn the nut down another 1/2 to 3/4 turn, this works out with most lifters to be in the .060 -.080 of pre-load as recommended, again this can depend on the thread pitch of the stud, again that is why the 1/2 to 3/4 turn is a general account, On a performance build of any kind I measure the pre-load with a dial indicator on some part of the valve / rocker tip or lifter, what ever is most accesible. By the way, if you do the push rod length check you dont want to use a hyd lifter, you need something solid, then figure the difference in the lifter verses the solid checking lifter to find your correct pre-load distance.

You can feel when you press the oil out of them and are down onto the internal spring in the lifter. Its not an easy thing to recognize the first time. Any time you have the lifters out you should soak them in a pan of oil to refill the cavity before the install. Some guys pump oil into the hole on them with an oil can, either way works.

As for pedestal mount rockers, add shims needed to get center travel pattern correct, then you have to adjust just a bit to get your pre-load and not loose the travel pattern for the tip.

JP02XLT