anyone rebuilt a 2.8 from a 78?

[Hotrodlincoln]

Hi kim, yes the block and heads are A-OK for rebuilding, just needing to be cleaned up in the tank. Yes the motor has the thermostat on the bottom hose, strange place for it, however I am sure it is there for a reason.

cheers

Yeah, it's there to make it overheat in the middle of winter.

It's fine there for summer cruising. But when it's cold the flow of cold coolant out of the radiator makes the thermostat close and keep all the hot water in the engine. The result is, engine gets hotter, coolant in the radiator gets colder. Next thing you know you have a cracked block.
The common fix is to machine the intake manifold, or get a different water outlet that has a recess in it, to fit the thermostat up top.

 

[Angie]

Yeah, it's there to make it overheat in the middle of winter.

Now that is a stupid design.... what were the germans thinking when they did that??? I dug around a bit now that you mentioned this prob. I will be looking into changeing the flow to top loaded. even though this build up is a summer only crusin' car I don't want to be taking any chances of melting the block....

thanks!!!

 

[Hotrodlincoln]

I asked around about the thermostat on the bottom deal when I first bought my Subaru. It has the same thing, thermostat on the inlet side of the water pump. They don't have any problems with that setup. But Subaru uses a 170°F thermostat, where the Ranger calls for a 195°F thermostat. I have heard of people running colder thermostats in the 2.8 but not sure if they have it in the stock location or relocated to the upper hose.
I switched the one in my old Ranger to the upper water outlet and never had a problem with it after that.

 

[Angie]

hey hotrod, how did you switch yours to top? I have read about guys taking the intake in and getting them machined, is that wht you did? or did you find a top intake and who builds them?

thanks


on another note, here is a pic of the underhood for this pinto build. this pic is taken top looking down and I flipped it to look right. the sun was shining in through the door of the shop and it shows up very well the blues and purples. this is after about 24 hours work between angie and myself. top has 3 coats of clear over the art work. enjoy.

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n69/ru_ready_4_r_n_r/11finished3clear.jpg

 

[Hotrodlincoln]

I did it kind of a ghetto way. I bought a single piece wrap around rubber thermostat gasket (it has a grove in it so it fits around the outer edge of the thermostat and covers top and bottom) and spaced the outlet up with a washer on each bolt between the outlet and the manifold. Never has leaked. I don't remember the PN for the gasket I bought, just went to Autozone and matched it up. Didn't think far enough ahead to write it down.

Nice job on the painting! Can't wait to see it all put together.

 

[Angie]

Thanks hotrod, yes she will be an eye catcher at car shows. the artwork turned out great, still going to let it sit for the week then on weekend give it a good wet sanding, then finish it off with 3 more coats of clear to seal the paint and prohibit any underhood leechings from the running motor.

I also belong to a pinto forum, and I asked the question about bottom t-stats on the 2.8. here is an informative write-up someone gave about proper maintence for these motors. thought I would share this info with you guys for this makes good sence.

cheers guys!!!

I have three 2.8 pintos all running the stock location. The most important thing is you must get your cooling system flushed every two years to prevent sediment build up. This is true for any older cooling system but more so on the 2.8. They have thin water jackets get plugged easily.

This is a complex system that features a dual plane thermostat that opens based on coolant temp at the rear instead of the front. The thermostat gets the hot coolant via a bypass hose from the upper part of the engine which feeds it the hot coolant as opposed to the tepid coolant from the radiator outlet. This causes the thermostat to open and close like a standard thermostat. This means you need to run a 185 or 195 thermostat in the lower part of the engine which would normally sound counterintuiti ve since the lower part of the engine is running at about 150. The rear of the housing which has a three pronged base is what the hot coolant feeds into from the top of the engine. It is important that the housing NOT be over torqued since the thermostat housing, water pump and timing case all tie into the rear bypass cover. That is what the M6 bolts thread into. It is a 9 ft lbs or 12 ft lbs torque setting. Toss out those old steel bolts and replace them with 316L stainless steel bolts. Those have a VERY low ferrous content and will not rust. Add grease around them to prevent gauging but the risk is low since it is not a stainless to stainless interface. It is stainless to aluminum. With this system working correctly (this includes a clean radiator) the car will never overheat. These cars have issues when the system is not maintained or when some one installs a 155 or 165 thermostat in them. This will not work. It will open too soon and force the thermostat open at all times. Also, a fail safe or high flow unit wont work either since they are not designed for a system like the 2.8's (dual plane). A standard 185/195 works perfectly. I have never seen a 2.9 timing case with the upper thermostat on a 2.8 but it looks like a nice conversion. I have never tried it nor will I, the standard system works great, if a little complex.
http://www.fordpinto.com/index.php/topic,15515.0.html

 

[kimcrwbr1]

You can get a two piece t-stat housing that bolts onto the intake manifold and put the stat there where it belongs if you can find one out of a 85 ranger I will try and get you a pic of it then you just take the stat out of the bottom and plug the bypass hose on the manifold the housing has it`s own.

 

[kimcrwbr1]

we will see if this works http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/85_Ranger/Ranger water pump fun/Picture007.jpg?t=1274804662

 

[kimcrwbr1]

The t-stat is in the upper housing and the nipple not connected is the bypass it turns it into a 1" hose instead of a 3/4 to 1" on the rear lower housing just get a plug and pull the nipple off the Intake manifold or you can possibly get the manifold off a 85 that dont have the nipple on it. Those parts are hard to come by tho unless you get lucky I found mine looking for a egr spacer for my truck. It warms up quicker and holds a nice steady temp. I put the 195 stat back in and the guage never goes past half will find out this summer when it gets hot for sure.

 

[Angie]

Thanks kim, old rigs are hard to find in my area so i will have to keep my eyes open on them to see what is around. I will be reading more and more about the different set ups for the water/t-stats on these motors as I build this one up.

cheers

 

[Angie]

hey guys small update for ya, I have the block and heads from the shop !!!! all sitting on my bench and ready for the build. now just have to figure out the parts list.... here is a pic of what we did to the dash, and the primed section. just updating a bit, for the followers. used a dremel and time and went slow on this. the dash will be painted up tonight.

I have the headers from Aerostar, all painted up and ready... yeehaa...

cheers and laters guys.

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n69/ru_ready_4_r_n_r/finished.jpg

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n69/ru_ready_4_r_n_r/primed.jpg


and from the other thread about water T-stat... I will be going the top route. I will talk to 2.8great again and I know he has a spare water inlet. if you want to see the headers say so and I can post a pic. they are so small and cute.

 

[Hotrodlincoln]

I also belong to a pinto forum, and I asked the question about bottom t-stats on the 2.8. here is an informative write-up someone gave about proper maintence for these motors. thought I would share this info with you guys for this makes good sence.

Very interesting read. Thank you for posting it.

Presumably the system should work just fine the way it's designed on a rebuilt engine or one that has been well maintained. The thing is... these engines are 25+ years old now, the few that are still out there are probably NOT in great shape. Moving the thermostat is a simple and effective way of curing the problem of overheating without spending the time or money to tear down the engine to have it tanked, and is often the most economical route for a truck that will probably only be driveable another 5 or 6 years before the rust easts it away. Modern day flushes won't get rid of the type of scale that builds inside these engines. I flushed my 84 at least once every 3 months while I was driving it everyday, and never could get all of the rust out of it. Within two weeks the coolant was just as murky orange as it had been before the flush.
But like I said, it works perfectly fine in warm weather as long as the thermostat is operational.

I'd like to see a pic of the headers if you don't mind. I'd love to pick up a set somewhere, but from what I can find on various parts store websites, 86 was the ONLY year Aerostar to have the 2.8, so that may be a pipe dream.

 

[Angie]

hi hotrod, here is a link to the headers, this is after I cleaned them up and gave 3 coats of grey/silver HI temp header paint.

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n69/ru_ready_4_r_n_r/headers.jpg


Your points on the T-stat and motor are well taken. I can fully see the point of changing them to top load.

 

[r1hatman]

I stuck a 160 thermostat in mine and it's working great so far, I'm curious to see how it works in the winter.

 

[NMB2]

I didnt really read through much of the thread, but FWIW I have a 84/85 truck shortblock, with 78 heads/intake.