2.3L ('83-'97) 83 2.3 L in a 76 Pinto

[bdog0924]

Hello, I'm new here. I bought a shell of a 76 Pinto with an engine that was not in it. Turns out the engine block had the casting number out of an 83 something or other. Bottom end was fine but the head was seized up. I had the head rebuild, got the car together and fired up. Then something happened and I lost compression in all four cylinders (not timing belt or anything along those lines) all at the same time. I took it to a real mechanic and he said it was a head issue.
I took the head back off and took it to my head guy and he went back through it and changed the valve springs out for dual springs because between him and my mechanic, they thought the lifters were not compressing enough. I put the car back together and it ran great. I even was able to drive it around the block. A couple days later I went to go play with it and the same thing happened. I lost all compression in all cylinders at the same time after it started up and only ran for maybe 2 seconds.
Does anyone here have any ideas? We are all stumped on this one.

 

[alwaysFlOoReD]

So you did a compression test and all cylinders came back at zero?
Have you tried a leak down test?
I can't think of what would cause this... But I've never looked at a 2.3.
Something keeping valves open?
PS: I have a 77 Pinto, currently not running. 2.8l auto.

 

[bdog0924]

I (and my mechanic and head guy) believe so. I have not seen anything on the interwebs about this problem with anything. As long as the car doesn't start, compression is great. It's once it starts, i lose compression in all cylinders. No compression test after I lose compression.

 

[alwaysFlOoReD]

Is it lifter pump up? Are the lifters correctly adjusted? Meaning the rockers are adjusted to the middle of the stroke for the lifters. Sorry the terminology may be off....

 

[bdog0924]

Oh and I didn't realize that the engine wasn't the original until putting it together the second time.

 

[bdog0924]

Hydraulic lifters. They are pumping up.

 

[scotts90ranger]

About the only thing I can think of is if the lash adjusters (correct term, whatevers ) are getting stuck up which would be weird...

 

[bdog0924]

I believe the head guy replaced the lash adjusters. My real mechanic liked him and said the head guy knew what he was doing. I don't know. I'm trying to figure out what I can do before putting more money into the Pinto. I already have twice than budgeted into it.

 

[Brain75]

I like to take a very systematic approach to issues since that prevents the parts cannon and empty wallet...
So the basics, what seals up an engine... rings, valves, head gasket, and a bunch of solid metal.

Rings seal better when they got hotter (metal expansion), but diagnostically we got to ask the question - lots of blowby?, uses a ton of oil?, any reason at all to think there are issues with the rings?

skip valves for a second...

you had the head off, how did the gasket look?, did you replace the gasket?, an signs of compression gasses leaking past the gasket?

solid metal... well you had the heads off so I assume you didn't see any pinholes in the tops of the pistons, etc.. if you didn't really look at em, learn from my experience and always look everything over before reassembly.


now valves, the most likely culprit... any reason to believe the valves aren't opening/closing? cam broken, cam gear key sheared in 2..
any reason to believe the valves are moving but not seating well... seats pounded down (recessed).. cracked seats, etc

I gather that it has like 2 miles on it kinda deal, you never got it running well enough to give a history right? if it has ran for any duration give us some history..
Since I gather that it is freshly assembled, then an assembly oops is the most likely.
missed a key, got the timing marks aligned wrong

I assume a competent mechanic would have looked up the timing mark diagram but possible he just glanced at at the marks and said looks right... here's a timing picture (note, the keyways are wrong read all 4 comments for clarification)

2.3 liter timing marks diagram - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource

SOHC - 2.3L & 2.5L Lima Engines - 2.3 liter timing marks diagram - I haven't posted on here before now, but I thought I'd share this diagram I put together for anyone doing a rebuild on a 2.3 liter engine that might be a little confused (as I was) on where all the timing marks are, and how to...

www.ranger-forums.com

My first step if is apart differ from together, and I assume it is assembled right now... I'd pop the valve covers off and hand crank the crankshaft while watching valve events to make sure all cylinders are opening closing.

fwiw, there is a write up here in the library on how to set the timing, but the first couple steps show very clearly a quick check you can do without pulling "everything" apart using inspection "peep" holes...

Timing Belt Replacement - 1983-2000 Ranger 4-Cylinder - The Ranger Station

Written By: Desert Rat 23 Disclaimer: Activities and vehicle modifications appearing or described at The Ranger Station and it’s pages may be potentially dangerous. We do not endorse any such activity for others or recommend it to any particular person … Continued

www.therangerstation.com

my first guess based on worked then suddenly quit, and what is the weakest link.. I would think you stripped some teeth off the timing belt, but you said no issue in the timing in your first post... what lead you to the conclusion that the timing was all fine - you take off the cover and inspect the whole belt? also how old is the belt , brand new as part of a "replace all while it is apart" or "unknown could be 41 years"..I wouldn't think that the belt would grab enough to start up ever again with a bunch of missing teeth, but if it was cold enough it might have just grabbed once more - kind of a long shot.

 

[bdog0924]

Rings are good, cylinders are smooth, bottom end is fine. Replaced the head gasket and milled the head for a smooth clean surface. The entire head was rebuild, then rebuild again. The timing is correct with new belt and tensioner. I have not stripped any teeth. I never put the timing cover on, I was waiting till everything works correctly. I have removed the valve cover and everything seems to be working in there.

 

[Brain75]

well hmmmm... when a test just doesn't make any sense, and the test can be repeated and doesn't make sense I have to turn my eye towards the equipment or tester... I assume your mechanic did a 2nd compression test not just take your statement "lost all compression" at your word - so you have 2 different compression gauges at least right (yours and his)?

 

[bdog0924]

Yes

 

[Brain75]

next thing I would do would be to setup for leakdown and hunt for where the air is going - whistling out the intake or exhaust ... or "somewhere else".... you can't have a hole without air escaping... if it wasn't 600# and made of iron dunk it in a trough and look for airbubbles...

 

[Brain75]

(don't dunk it in a trough - that was IF IT WASN'T kind of statement)

 

[Brain75]

In the interest of solving a bloody brain twister, I would "leakdown" every cylinder (even though they all leak so you aren't actually gonna get a leakdown done) just to see if they are all consistent or what the heck is going on.