2.3L ('83-'97) 1990 2.3 Odd Misfire Issues - New Engine

[scotts90ranger]

Just trying to verify the plug wires are in the right place, each coil pack has two outputs, left and right of the connector, I don't remember which side is what (original coils are labeled, aftermarket aren't) but the cylinders should be paired 1 with 4 and 2 with 3, honestly you shouldn't notice a big difference with the coils unplugged one at a time, my '90 turbo ranger is just running one of the coil packs...

 

[RobbieD]

My head hurts and I'm done for the night. Any more thoughts?

You deserve a beer.

 

[Mr4btTahoe]

Just trying to verify the plug wires are in the right place, each coil pack has two outputs, left and right of the connector, I don't remember which side is what (original coils are labeled, aftermarket aren't) but the cylinders should be paired 1 with 4 and 2 with 3, honestly you shouldn't notice a big difference with the coils unplugged one at a time, my '90 turbo ranger is just running one of the coil packs...

It's not a huge difference when the coil packs get unplugged... but its noticeable. RPM changes a little (same for either coil pack). Plug wire routing has been triple checked at this point and I'd say it wouldn't run good at all if it were wrong. Not only did I verify with pictures, but I checked my manual as well... all is correct there.

 

[Mr4btTahoe]

Update...

So I'd ordered a set of injectors for it to rule that out... no change. Sent them back.

Replaced the coolant temp sensor tonight because it made zero running difference plugged in vs unplugged... and again.. no change.

I'm starting to wonder if its an issue with the crank position sensor. I installed a new one on the engine prior to putting it in the truck. Everything went together fine... but I'm wondering if the sensor itself is just bad... has an issue that goes away when it warms up?

I'm really out of ideas.

 

[Mr4btTahoe]

I'm really starting to wonder if its got a valve issue. I pulled the exhaust at the manifold... when it starts misfiring, it has a tapping sound that comes from the exhaust with every misfire... then it goes away as soon as the misfire stops.

Is it possible that it's got a valve issue? Maybe recessed valves? I know thats a common issue on the 2.3...

Any way to verify without pulling the head?

 

[Shran]

Mine has done this same thing for 8 years now. I've replaced or swapped with known good parts and it never gets better.

Supposedly this can be caused by valve seats being recessed too far into the heads, word is it's not a problem on other engines so rebuilders just grind them down without knowing it causes issues.

Also heard that heads cracked between the valves can go this, it leaks into other cylinders. Crack can sort of seal up as it gets hot. Don't know how much truth there is to that

 

[Mr4btTahoe]

Mine has done this same thing for 8 years now. I've replaced or swapped with known good parts and it never gets better.

Supposedly this can be caused by valve seats being recessed too far into the heads, word is it's not a problem on other engines so rebuilders just grind them down without knowing it causes issues.

Also heard that heads cracked between the valves can go this, it leaks into other cylinders. Crack can sort of seal up as it gets hot. Don't know how much truth there is to that

I'm really leaning towards a cylinder head issue at this point. The old engine had a cracked head and still ran good... and literally everything is the same... I'm calling the parts house in the morning.

 

[Mr4btTahoe]

I think I've nailed it down finally.

It's a cylinder head / lifter issue. I've now found 2 more people having the exact same issue with reman engines. A mix of bad valve height and lifters pumping up too far holding the valves open when oil is cold (and at high rpm when the oil is warm). I think I can take care of it with a better set of lifters or some anti-pump up lifters. One person pulled the lifters and opened up an oil relief in them and it fixed the issue... another went with aftermarket anti-pump up lifters.

I'll call the parts house and see what they are willing to pay for... including all the labor I've got tied up in it now. We'll see what happens.

 

[Shran]

Well, in any case, please do us all a huge favor and keep us updated on what you find!

I always assumed that it was something electrical/ignition/timing related on mine because it's very predictable, when leaving the house in the morning I can guess a specific spot on the highway to work where the problem goes away. I also cannot pull any codes from my truck, I haven't really put much effort into finding out why but my scanner doesn't recognize anything and the test light method just gave me nonsense blinks.

Your lifter theory makes sense. Curious if you have an aftermarket oil pressure gauge installed? I do and have always seen some ridiculous numbers, it's not uncommon for it to hold 90+psi under load when the engine is cold. At operating temp it's more normal at 20-50psi, depending on RPM. I always wondered if that high oil pressure was indicative of something but it's a cheap gauge and who knows how accurate it is.

 

[Mr4btTahoe]

Well, in any case, please do us all a huge favor and keep us updated on what you find!

I always assumed that it was something electrical/ignition/timing related on mine because it's very predictable, when leaving the house in the morning I can guess a specific spot on the highway to work where the problem goes away. I also cannot pull any codes from my truck, I haven't really put much effort into finding out why but my scanner doesn't recognize anything and the test light method just gave me nonsense blinks.

Your lifter theory makes sense. Curious if you have an aftermarket oil pressure gauge installed? I do and have always seen some ridiculous numbers, it's not uncommon for it to hold 90+psi under load when the engine is cold. At operating temp it's more normal at 20-50psi, depending on RPM. I always wondered if that high oil pressure was indicative of something but it's a cheap gauge and who knows how accurate it is.

I put my OTC gauge set on it while the engine was out of the truck... made 75psi on the drill priming the pump (low speed 1/2" drill at that). Apparently, lifter pump up is a common issue on these engines too. I've talked to the outfit I got the engine from... I'm going to dump the oil tonight and fill it with 5w20 and see if the thinner oil will get oil pressure more reasonable. I'm sure when the oil is cold that it's running nearly 100psi but I don't have a mechanical gauge in the truck. I'll keep this post updated. If the thinner oil doesn't help or solve the problem, they are either going to warranty out the cylinder head or the whole long block (labor included).

They are also going to give me something for the trouble and hours I've got wrapped up in diagnosing it so far. We'll see what happens come tomorrow.

How many miles are on yours and what weight oil are you running?

This one currently runs great cold at idle... but any rpm off idle and it starts misfiring... sometimes so bad that it stalls. When that happens, it sounds off while cranking which makes sense now because it doesn't have compression as the valves are sticking open. After 10 seconds or so and the lifters have bled back down, it'll fire back up and run okay. When at operating temp, it runs great assuming rpm is kept under 3500-4k. Go over that and the misfire shows up but quickly goes away.

 

[Shran]

I have about 50k miles on it right now. I usually run 10w-30 conventional oil. In the summer I will run 4 quarts of that and 1 quart of 10w-40 or 15w-40. I had a really obnoxious clatter/rattle on cold startup for a while, more often in warm weather. The heavier weight oil seemed to help a lot and I very rarely hear any noise but maybe that's a coincidence now that I've been running it for a few years. I should run some thinner oil in it just to see what happens.

I'm not sure what the machine shop used for parts in mine. Wonder if high volume oil pumps would cause issues. I don't know if they put one in mine... I am sure they just put whatever was cheap in it.

This one currently runs great cold at idle... but any rpm off idle and it starts misfiring... sometimes so bad that it stalls. When that happens, it sounds off while cranking which makes sense now because it doesn't have compression as the valves are sticking open. After 10 seconds or so and the lifters have bled back down, it'll fire back up and run okay. When at operating temp, it runs great assuming rpm is kept under 3500-4k. Go over that and the misfire shows up but quickly goes away.

This is pretty similar to mine. Cold start, perfect idle unless you rev it up and then it'll miss really bad. If I keep a really light foot on the gas while driving, I can keep it running pretty smooth until it hits that "spot" where it runs perfect. I did find that when the engine is at operating temp I can rev it up with no load (stopped) and it'll either misfire really bad or stall. If it stalls it is really hard to restart and sounds weird just like yours does - it's the "broken timing belt" crank noise, faster than normal and you can tell it's not building any compression.

I thought it was fuel related, either flooded or lack of because I was chasing fuel pressure issues for a while but nothing changed after I fixed those so your theory sounds more likely at this point.

I'd be tempted to try a different set of lifters in mine if that is what fixes yours. I've been living with it for almost 9 years now so a fix would be nice, although the truck is such a rust bucket now that it's almost not worth fixing. I guess I could use the engine in something else someday.

 

[Mr4btTahoe]

I have about 50k miles on it right now. I usually run 10w-30 conventional oil. In the summer I will run 4 quarts of that and 1 quart of 10w-40 or 15w-40. I had a really obnoxious clatter/rattle on cold startup for a while, more often in warm weather. The heavier weight oil seemed to help a lot and I very rarely hear any noise but maybe that's a coincidence now that I've been running it for a few years. I should run some thinner oil in it just to see what happens.

I'm not sure what the machine shop used for parts in mine. Wonder if high volume oil pumps would cause issues. I don't know if they put one in mine... I am sure they just put whatever was cheap in it.



This is pretty similar to mine. Cold start, perfect idle unless you rev it up and then it'll miss really bad. If I keep a really light foot on the gas while driving, I can keep it running pretty smooth until it hits that "spot" where it runs perfect. I did find that when the engine is at operating temp I can rev it up with no load (stopped) and it'll either misfire really bad or stall. If it stalls it is really hard to restart and sounds weird just like yours does - it's the "broken timing belt" crank noise, faster than normal and you can tell it's not building any compression.

I thought it was fuel related, either flooded or lack of because I was chasing fuel pressure issues for a while but nothing changed after I fixed those so your theory sounds more likely at this point.

I'd be tempted to try a different set of lifters in mine if that is what fixes yours. I've been living with it for almost 9 years now so a fix would be nice, although the truck is such a rust bucket now that it's almost not worth fixing. I guess I could use the engine in something else someday.

This is literally the exact same issue this truck is having. I've narrowed it down to lifters or poor machine work (valve height set too low)... could also be weak valve springs. Apparently it's rather common on reman heads as they just cut the valve seats like any other engine but you can't do that as the seat depth will be off making this issue more common.

Apparently ford put out a TSB in 2002 that included the 2.3 rangers back to the early 90s that they could use 5w20. I'm curious if rebuilders are now building them with tighter tolerances with that in mind. I should know more tonight and will report back.

https://www.ford-cruising.hu/miscimages/0219.pdf

Another interesting note... the Melling M127 is supposed to have a 60psi relief spring (this is the pump that came with my reman)... yet mine clearly makes more than 60psi... so that's odd.

 

[franklin2]

Would something like this work?

Speedway 2.3 Ford Adjustable Lifter Kit

www.speedwaymotors.com

 

[Shran]

Or these:

High Performance 2.3 Ford Hydraulic Lifters

Get the most power from your 2.3 Ford with these anti-pump up hydraulic lifters.

www.speedwaymotors.com

 

[Mr4btTahoe]

Or these:

High Performance 2.3 Ford Hydraulic Lifters

Get the most power from your 2.3 Ford with these anti-pump up hydraulic lifters.

www.speedwaymotors.com

I'm assuming these would fix the issue. You'd have to machine the head for the solid adjustable units. I'll see if thinner oil helps here soon. I get off work in a few hours. The anti pump up hydraulic units are my next plan if the warranty will pay for them. I'd rather do that than pull the head or pull the engine again.