View Full Version : Gear change Worthiness
mr_speed77
11-12-2007, 03:45 PM
How much time would it take to do a 8.8 and dana 35 gear change on a 4.0 4x4 ranger? What is an area that parts will cost? I want bigger tires but don't wanna break the bank doing it.
4x4junkie
11-12-2007, 09:01 PM
Typically its around (per axle):
$200-250 for good quality gears
$80-100 for a master install kit ($50 or so for a mini-kit)
$200-300 shop labor (guessing it's typically around a 3-hour job for a skilled person).
You may be able to save a bit by taking the axles in disassembled (especially on the front).
metalmacguyver
11-13-2007, 04:53 PM
how much bigger tires do you want? if you have 4.10s then you could get away with 33s and not absolutely require a gear change. if you want 35s or bigger though you definately need to regear.
you can find cheaper lower quality gears starting at $120
setting up gears takes several specialized tools and is best done by a professional so it is hard to save any money on labor except as junkie said for bringing the axles separate from the truck.
It's not that the tools you need are all that expensive -- they aren't. You need a dial indicator, 0-1" micrometer, some leverage to get the pinion nut down, an inch-lb torque wrench, and some gear marking compound. Some kind of jig for pinion depth measurement is nice, but the trial and error method does work, at the expense of quite a lot of trials.
The reason a pro should do this is because if you miss a detail, your new gears won't last 10 miles. It CAN be done as a DIY if you can get really, really anal about getting EVERYTHING just right.
4x4junkie
11-13-2007, 10:29 PM
It's not that the tools you need are all that expensive -- they aren't. You need a dial indicator, 0-1" micrometer, some leverage to get the pinion nut down, an inch-lb torque wrench, and some gear marking compound. Some kind of jig for pinion depth measurement is nice, but the trial and error method does work, at the expense of quite a lot of trials.
The reason a pro should do this is because if you miss a detail, your new gears won't last 10 miles. It CAN be done as a DIY if you can get really, really anal about getting EVERYTHING just right.
Don't forget the shop press, bearing splitter-aka-separator, and a case spreader (it DOES get expensive when you add those in)
mr_speed77
11-19-2007, 02:50 PM
Is the install easier if the gears are already used and have good bearings on them still?
Not much. Both pinion bearings will have to come off to set the depth.
FYI, the press is nice, but really not essential. I prefer using it over the BFH method as it is much easier to control. But another substitute for installation is the kitchen oven.
Bearing splitters can be used with a two-jaw puller, and can be bought from Harbor Freight for $15 or so. A case spreader should not be necessary. Pullers should NOT be bought from Harbor Freight as they WILL break. The splitter will be needed to remove pinion bearings between depth trials.
Not much. Both pinion bearings will have to come off to set the depth.
FYI, the press is nice, but really not essential. I prefer using it over the BFH method as it is much easier to control. But another substitute for installation is the kitchen oven.
Bearing splitters can be used with a two-jaw puller, and can be bought from Harbor Freight for $15 or so. A case spreader should not be necessary. Pullers should NOT be bought from Harbor Freight as they WILL break. The splitter will be needed to remove pinion bearings between depth trials.
+1
A case spreader is not necessary. The kitchen oven and freezer are your friend when working on many diff components.
4x4junkie
11-21-2007, 09:03 PM
There's far less chance you'll damage the carrier shims during reinstallation if you use a spreader though.
I probably should also mention it's easy to damage the case by spreading it too far. Spread the case ONLY far enough you can just wiggle the carrier out by hand, no further.
BTW, every carrier & housing is ever so slightly different. Pulling gears out of one axle and putting them in another won't guarantee they'll be meshed properly (or have the correct bearing preloads).
ashleyroachclip
11-23-2007, 11:12 PM
If you re use the shims on yjr pinion , and the carrier , I don't see any reason you would need any special tools , except bearing splitters .
I can't tell haw many 8.8's I have changed gears in , and not had to reset depth .
I think the D35 would be the same .
The gears are set to the case , or housing , not the carrier .
Woods-Rider
11-27-2007, 11:29 AM
I just scheduled to get some 4.88's in mine with youkon gears and master install kits and i was quoted $1300 for everything. it was a little more than what i wanted to spend, but i have been driving around for close to a year with 35's and 4.10's and its just not worth it. i also asked roughly how much bringing in just the housings would save me and he said about $100. i figured on a $1300 job that saving $100 wasn't that big of a deal.
metalmacguyver
11-27-2007, 12:29 PM
$100 dollars would be worth it to me. wish i had that kind of money to throw around.
If you re use the shims on yjr pinion , and the carrier , I don't see any reason you would need any special tools , except bearing splitters .
I can't tell haw many 8.8's I have changed gears in , and not had to reset depth .
I think the D35 would be the same .
The gears are set to the case , or housing , not the carrier .
4x4junkie has a good point.
Properly sized shims will preload the carrier bearings. They have to be tapped in and pried out. And I have indeed broken one tapping it in.... Ford says you are supposed to use a special shim driver, which of course I don't have.
It's very risky not to check the pinion depth on a setup. I hope you don't do that for customers. If you do, you're leaving a few of them screwed, perhaps without any feedback coming to you (yet, until you get served with a subpoena). It's true that most of the variance is from the case, but it's not guaranteed. There is also some variance in the pinion gear itself.
Natedog
11-27-2007, 04:20 PM
If you re use the shims on yjr pinion , and the carrier , I don't see any reason you would need any special tools , except bearing splitters .
I can't tell haw many 8.8's I have changed gears in , and not had to reset depth .
I think the D35 would be the same .
The gears are set to the case , or housing , not the carrier .
That's why you don't setup my gears. This usually gets you close...but not nearly close enough for a long lasting quiet running diff.
That's why you don't setup my gears. This usually gets you close...but not nearly close enough for a long lasting quiet running diff.
True 'nuff, but it's enough for me to exclude him that he seems proud to associate himself with "roach clips." Honestly, weed and precision setups do not mix well.
Natedog
11-27-2007, 05:54 PM
Yeah caught that too.:icon_thumby:
I once setup two Toyota diffs ( Like a Ford 8" or 9" ) with an experienced friend's help (I'm anal about doing things correctly) and don't ever do it again. It took all weekend and was a big pita. Press it on, assemble, check backlash, take pattern, dissassemble, press it off, switch shims, press it on......gahh! Repeat many times trying to get the perfect pattern and backlash.
rickcdewitt
11-27-2007, 06:15 PM
Yeah caught that too.:icon_thumby:
I once setup two Toyota diffs ( Like a Ford 8" or 9" ) with an experienced friend's help (I'm anal about doing things correctly) and don't ever do it again. It took all weekend and was a big pita. Press it on, assemble, check backlash, take pattern, dissassemble, press it off, switch shims, press it on......gahh! Repeat many times trying to get the perfect pattern and backlash.i did my 8.8 like 6-7 times before she was happy.
rickcdewitt
11-27-2007, 06:17 PM
:icon_rofl::icon_rofl:True 'nuff, but it's enough for me to exclude him that he seems proud to associate himself with "roach clips." Honestly, weed and precision setups do not mix well.:icon_rofl::icon_rofl:
mr_speed77
12-04-2007, 08:28 AM
My friend is a experienced mechanic and he would be doing most of the install. But I am not sure its worth it. I want a 4" lift w/ 33's but i might be going with a 2" coils in front and 31's. Im just kind weary about the gears but i want bigger tires and low gearing. My trucks also got 150k miles but its also just my second/snow/mud vehicle. IDK!!!:shout:
northerncountry
12-11-2007, 09:16 AM
about 2 yrs ago my dad grenaded my 8.8 we went to the junk yard got a whole diff chopped off at the housing inputted the used everything ring pinion spiders carrier the whole nine yards. That was my first axle experiance and it is still working good. we didn't have to add any extra shims it all seemd to fit just fine
metalmacguyver
12-11-2007, 11:56 AM
about 2 yrs ago my dad grenaded my 8.8 we went to the junk yard got a whole diff chopped off at the housing inputted the used everything ring pinion spiders carrier the whole nine yards. That was my first axle experiance and it is still working good. we didn't have to add any extra shims it all seemd to fit just fine
you got lucky.
i dont suppose you have pulled the diff cover and looked at the gears recently?
northerncountry
12-11-2007, 12:20 PM
nope i haven't like the old saying goes if it aint broke don't fix it. LOL. No slipage no funny sounds all is well. so far that was 13,000 miles ago.
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