Had Rangers in the past. Thinking about getting a Bronco II. Got questions

[adsm08]

I am a big supporter of technology and not adding straight pipes or over sized exhaust diameter, I just never had any practical applications of my own to prove it. Only my own understanding of things I have learned.
My 87 2.3L Ranger had stock exhaust with a hollow cat, and a glasspack that was the same length and diameter of the OEM muffler. So I probably could have gotten better MPG out of that truck then?

The 2.3 Lima, even the TBI version in 87, was old enough a hollow cat may not have hurt it. My experience with the 2.9 is that it loses between 1 and 2 MPG when the cat is hollowed.

To date, the best recorded mileage that I personally have achieved with the 2.9 is 21.2 MPG. I had a new K&N air and oil filters, fresh oil with Lucas, All new Motorcraft ignition parts, Bosch O2 sensor, intact converter, no spare tire, and driving like my trans was made of glass.

I have never been able to reproduce that mileage, although I have regularly gotten that same truck to come in between 19.5 and 20.5 when I was driving 60 miles a day for work, all highway, with a soft cover on the bed. That was with the new cat after the old hollow one exploded.

 

[4x4junkie]

My 2.9L BII usually gets around 22 MPG (never less than 20), and that's with big tires and a lift. My 4.0L Ranger with a fairly similar profile gets around 21 MPG, yet it's acceleration is far more effortless than my BII (you have to wind the 2.9L out pretty good to get any good power from it, and they do suck bad with an automatic too, both gas and in performance).

Though I don't plan to swap out my 2.9L at least until it's worn itself out, it's very unlikely another 2.9L will take it's place once it is done.

Before the lift & tires I got around 25-26 MPG from my BII. I seem to recall about 24 from my Ranger stock, though that was some 17 years ago.

(FWIW, the above MPG figures were all calculated between 55-60 MPH)




To try to answer a few of the other many Qs in your opening post...

'89-'90 IMO are the best-built BII years. The last half of the 1990 models came with a far better 4WD front axle (Dana35), and a better transfer case as well (I can't say for sure, but I think the switch from MAP to a MAF sensor might've occurred at that time as well). I've seen a couple people who like the older-gen look swap the older front clips onto the 2nd-gens though (it's doesn't seem like it would be that hard to do). The 4.0L is basically a plug-&-play swap into these years.

I would not tow more than about 2000lbs with a BII unless you also use a weight-distribution hitch w/sway control. The short-wheelbase BII is fairly light and it doesn't take much for a larg trailer to yank you into the ditch.
Having said hitch, I would say up to about 3500lbs is the limit for the 2.9L (maybe a little more if it's a low-profile load. 2.9s and large frontal areas on the trailer don't mix well). You'll also need brakes on your trailer.
With the swap to a 4.0L, you should be able to tow around 5000lbs.

I would think seats from an Explorer Sport or Supercab Ranger should swap in a BII (they have the same dual-stage sliding tracks on them anyway). I won't swear to it though as I have not actually done it.


As for the A/C, you should be fine w/ your dogs, mine blasts out of the vents at a nice chilly 38° on full-blast (it'll get down to 35° on the lower speeds). Don't expect the A/C to work well on a 21+ year old truck without some freshening though.
I converted mine over to use R-134a freon a few years back, and seems performance couldn't be much better (I documented my conversion over here in this thread).

Serpentine belts were never used on BIIs.

Hope that helps

 

[Anthony]

The 2.3 Lima, even the TBI version in 87, was old enough a hollow cat may not have hurt it. My experience with the 2.9 is that it loses between 1 and 2 MPG when the cat is hollowed.

To date, the best recorded mileage that I personally have achieved with the 2.9 is 21.2 MPG. I had a new K&N air and oil filters, fresh oil with Lucas, All new Motorcraft ignition parts, Bosch O2 sensor, intact converter, no spare tire, and driving like my trans was made of glass.

I have never been able to reproduce that mileage, although I have regularly gotten that same truck to come in between 19.5 and 20.5 when I was driving 60 miles a day for work, all highway, with a soft cover on the bed. That was with the new cat after the old hollow one exploded.

My 87 2.3 had 4 injectors. It looked like my friends 91 4 banger Mustang. The intake just looked a little bit different.

My 2.9L BII usually gets around 22 MPG (never less than 20), and that's with big tires and a lift. My 4.0L Ranger with a fairly similar profile gets around 21 MPG, yet it's acceleration is far more effortless than my BII (you have to wind the 2.9L out pretty good to get any good power from it, and they do suck bad with an automatic too, both gas and in performance).

Though I don't plan to swap out my 2.9L at least until it's worn itself out, it's very unlikely another 2.9L will take it's place once it is done.

Before the lift & tires I got around 25-26 MPG from my BII. I seem to recall about 24 from my Ranger stock, though that was some 17 years ago.

(FWIW, the above MPG figures were all calculated between 55-60 MPH)




To try to answer a few of the other many Qs in your opening post...

'89-'90 IMO are the best-built BII years. The last half of the 1990 models came with a far better 4WD front axle (Dana35), and a better transfer case as well (I can't say for sure, but I think the switch from MAP to a MAF sensor might've occurred at that time as well). I've seen a couple people who like the older-gen look swap the older front clips onto the 2nd-gens though (it's doesn't seem like it would be that hard to do). The 4.0L is basically a plug-&-play swap into these years.

I would not tow more than about 2000lbs with a BII unless you also use a weight-distribution hitch w/sway control. The short-wheelbase BII is fairly light and it doesn't take much for a larg trailer to yank you into the ditch.
Having said hitch, I would say up to about 3500lbs is the limit for the 2.9L (maybe a little more if it's a low-profile load. 2.9s and large frontal areas on the trailer don't mix well). You'll also need brakes on your trailer.
With the swap to a 4.0L, you should be able to tow around 5000lbs.

I would think seats from an Explorer Sport or Supercab Ranger should swap in a BII (they have the same dual-stage sliding tracks on them anyway). I won't swear to it though as I have not actually done it.


As for the A/C, you should be fine w/ your dogs, mine blasts out of the vents at a nice chilly 38° on full-blast (it'll get down to 35° on the lower speeds). Don't expect the A/C to work well on a 21+ year old truck without some freshening though.
I converted mine over to use R-134a freon a few years back, and seems performance couldn't be much better (I documented my conversion over here in this thread).

Serpentine belts were never used on BIIs.

Hope that helps

So the front fenders, grill, and hood all bolt up and match the body lines?

As far as the engine being plug and play, like I said I will probably never do this conversion, but does this mean they are the same block, and have the same sensors and stuff? My dad has a 91 Exploder that he rolled with a 4.0 in it, but it's been sitting for about 11years.

My serious wheeling days are over and I never broke an axle, so I don't really care what axle is in the front as long as it works. I kind of like the light duty axles for the lighter parts and cheaper brakes.
I just CAN'T not go to work because it's snowing, and I want the ability to ride through the woods occasionally mostly on designated trails and occasionally through some big patches of sugar sand that I know for a fact are impossible in 2wheel, but even the crappiest 4x4's with bald street tires can get through easily as long as their 4 wheel drive works.

I understand about the short wheel base towing. I had a 4 banger Jeep TJ rated at 1000lbs towing which was pretty scary unless you were pulling that little aero dynamic plastic turtle looking thing from U-Haul.
My Element is also short wheel base, but is heavier and lower to the ground, and is rated at 1500lbs towing.

As far as the AC I have converted the AC in my 88 F-350 to 134a and it did not blow out as cold. I later found out from some guys in Las Vegas about something I think they called "freeze 12"? they said it was closer to R12, and was colder than 134a.
This part i might be remembering wrong, but I thought they said it was compatable with both refrigerants?
Ever hear of this stuff?

I also have a friend who had a late 90's E-250 work van, and he was an HVAC tech, and as an experiment he converted his 134a system to R22 and he said that was super cold, but he doesn't know if it would ruin the system in the long run.

 

[4x4junkie]

The 2.9L and 4.0L are in the same "family" of engines (Cologne), so the block/bellhousing bolt pattern is the same, as are the motor mounts.
You need to swap the engine PCM in with the 4.0L, along with it's wiring harness.
If the 4.0L was from a '90-'92 Ranger, I hear it's plug-&-play. With one from an Explorer, I understand you'll need to swap a few pins in the wiring connectors here & there, but it's still an easy swap if you have diagrams for both trucks.

I would try for the later front axle just because parts will likely be available for it longer, even if you don't need the better strength (brakes are the same size on both).


As for the R-134a, I've heard that same thing, but it failed to materialize on mine... (at least if mine was any colder, I think I'd start having issues with the evaporator icing up, so I wouldn't think it was that much colder on the old R-12).
One thing I do know though, R-134a does run at a higher pressure on the high side, so maybe if there was a marginal component on that side of the system somewhere (too-small of a condenser, etc.), I could see it not cooling as well. Maybe in stop & go traffic some differences could be observable (I try to avoid peak hours as much as I can lol).
One thing I did do on mine was plug around the gap between the condenser and the radiator with some foam rubber, so all the air the fan sucks through is also forced to go through the condenser (maybe the factory already had something there like they do on later trucks, though my BII didn't have anything between there when I got it). A "Heavy-Duty" fan clutch can help as well.


I think I recall "Freeze-12" being some kind of propane-based refrigerant, though I could be wrong. Regardless, I just don't see anything like that working as good as R-12 would myself (or even as good as R-134a for that matter).

 

[Anthony]

A "Heavy-Duty" fan clutch can help as well.

How is the B2 cooling system?
on my 87 2.3L it was not equipped with AC so it had the dinky shroud that said "Not for Air Conditioning" on the top.
I swapped it out for a shroud from the junkyard from 2.3L AC equipped truck which made a complete circle around the fan where my original one did not.

I don't know how good the factory fan clutches were, but I kept getting them from the junkyard and I kept having over heating problems, but I also lived in Las Vegas at the time and it is 115 durring the day in summer.
The factory fan was 14" and plastic, but the hole in the shroud was much bigger, so I measured the hole, and did some math, and measured the lenth of the clutch.
I got a 16" flex fan and a 2.5" spacer and some long Stainless botls from the hardware store, and no more over heating problems.
I hear you get better mpg with a clutch fan though.
The bigger fan was about 1/4' from the hole in the shroud. I could not understand why they didn't use the larger diameter fan right from the factory, just in a plastic clutch fan form like the OEM one.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

With stock sized tires, stock engine and a little common sense you shouldn't have much problem with a D28 aside from a freak failure that could happen even if you have a D60. I have had mine 11 years with a 2.8 and aside from brakes never had an issue with it. I have a complete spare axle that I got back in '02 that I have never touched. Same goes for the 7.5 rear. Set of shoes, drums and a brake line is it, gotta spare one of them to trip over too. The D28 hasn't seen much of the 302's fury but they have met, the 7.5 is holding like a champ. Yards around here are full of first and second gens for parts if needed, but of course that varies by location and whether or not you need them.

Swapping is so stupid easy that I wouldn't trouble myself by shopping for a vehicle out of the last half of a years production. Run it until you have a problem, if you can't find parts stick a D35 in it and go. Personally I would shop for the superior 95-97 Ranger D35 with bolt on calipers (ideally what I want to get for mine)

If the cooling system isn't up to par for you, 91-94 Explorer radiators are esentially the same radiator but twice as thick and mount in the same location. I am using one to cool the 5.0 that currently resides in my truck.

Personally I am a big fan of the 1st generation interior/exterior over the 2nd gens too.

We use freeze 12 all the time at work for tightwad farmers that don't want to update the AC systems in their tractors and combines. Works good.

 

[Anthony]

With stock sized tires, stock engine and a little common sense you shouldn't have much problem with a D28 aside from a freak failure that could happen even if you have a D60. I have had mine 11 years with a 2.8 and aside from brakes never had an issue with it. I have a complete spare axle that I got back in '02 that I have never touched. Same goes for the 7.5 rear. Set of shoes, drums and a brake line is it, gotta spare one of them to trip over too. The D28 hasn't seen much of the 302's fury but they have met, the 7.5 is holding like a champ. Yards around here are full of first and second gens for parts if needed, but of course that varies by location and whether or not you need them.

Swapping is so stupid easy that I wouldn't trouble myself by shopping for a vehicle out of the last half of a years production. Run it until you have a problem, if you can't find parts stick a D35 in it and go. Personally I would shop for the superior 95-97 Ranger D35 with bolt on calipers (ideally what I want to get for mine)

If the cooling system isn't up to par for you, 91-94 Explorer radiators are esentially the same radiator but twice as thick and mount in the same location. I am using one to cool the 5.0 that currently resides in my truck.

Personally I am a big fan of the 1st generation interior/exterior over the 2nd gens too.

We use freeze 12 all the time at work for tightwad farmers that don't want to update the AC systems in their tractors and combines. Works good.

I agree. "When you break something it's time to upgrade" Per Tank.
The only things on older vehicles I have found to not be up to par is the cooling system on some vehicles, and I am sure it was fine new, and after 20-30 years neglect it's not. And that is not even every old vehicle. I don't like upgrading things just to add strength and weight or reduce efficientcy or mpg untill I see a reason to do so.
I have never had a problem with any part of any truck's drive train. I thought the C-6 in my 88 F-350 was junk, but it didn't blow up and it was working as designed, it just didn't work the way I wanted it to. I have had problems with steering systems, particularly the inner tierods on rack and pinion steering and struts wearing out too easily, but that's why I want something with oldschool steering, and regular shocks.

I know so many people that wasted so much time and effort beefing up things on trucks like transmissions, and steering boxes, and making braces and reinforcements for componants that they probably would otherwise never had problems with... except for their modifications was half assed, and then they have the logic like, wow, what a piece of crap, imagine if I didn't reinforce that...
And they lift their truck with the longest cheapest shackles and blocks they can get from pepboys and don't change their gear ratios when they put on 34's and they don't mind the fact they can't use 5th gear anymore, and need a new clutch every few months and junk the truck or sell it for $500 6 months later, and some douchey kid buys it with wet dreams about because it is lifted and has big mud tires.

I prefer bolt on calipers myself, but I never had any problems with the brakes with pins on my Mustang IIs, an Aerostar or any of my old Rangers either. But I do replace the pins everytime I put new brakes on.

 

[azbronco2]

I agree with disiplerocks go with a 89-90 with the updated motor I also think the frontend looks better but thats my twocents

 

[rusty70f100]

I'll admit to having just skim read the thread thus far, so sorry if anything is repeated.

My vehicle is an '87 Bronco 2, 2.9L, 2wd, M5OD manual transmission (swapped in), 3.45 gears, and 235/75R15 tires.

I fixed the EGR system on my '87 and the MPG went up quite substantially. It ran noticeably smoother too. I now get about 22mpg in town, and anywhere from 24-26mpg on the highway, depending on conditions. I don't know how this compares to the later non-EGR motors. Do know, however, that last fall when I needed a new EGR tube, there were like 2 in existence. I had to order mine from Texas. You may have trouble finding one if yours rusts out.

The Ford air conditioning systems of the era typically take an R134a conversion very well, providing you do it right. Doing it right means replacing any leaking lines or components (duh), flushing / cleaning out the rest of the system, replacing the receiver / drier / accumulator unit, replacing the expansion tube to one more appropriate for R134a, using ester oil, setting the pressures / charge amount accurately, and setting the low pressure cutoff switch to where it needs to be. In my experience, if you do it right you won't notice the difference between that and R12. As a side note, GM systems, particularly the compressors, can be a PITA though.

Cruising speed with my Bronco 2 can be a problem if there are hills or a headwind. 55 to 60mph usually works well in most instances. 70mph on the freeway works ok if you have hillls -or- a headwind. If you have both, you need to shift back down to 4th gear to maintain speed. In addition, freeway speeds really lower the fuel economy in my truck. It might only get 22mpg at 70 mph, where at 55-60mph it would get 25mpg.

The power steering is only noisy if you let the fluid get low, or crank it clear over to one side or the other and hold it there. Avoid both of those conditions, and it's as quiet as a mouse.

Back in high school I had a B2 that had the opening glass on the rear gate. That was a 1986. I don't know if it would swap to an '89 or newer B2 though.

It's not difficult to convert to manual locking hubs.

Hope I could provide some help.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

I prefer bolt on calipers myself, but I never had any problems with the brakes with pins on my Mustang IIs, an Aerostar or any of my old Rangers either. But I do replace the pins everytime I put new brakes on.

Growing up we had a '94 Explorer, it loves to eat pads. Eat as in rip the pad material off of the metal plate in chunks. Couldn't figure out what was doing it, dealer had never heard of it. Expensive/cheap pads, new caliper, slide pins, brake line... whatever, it kept doing it. It wasn't until a user on here (AllenD) pointed out that on the slide pin set up the caliper wears into the spindle and can allow the pad to cock in there and jam things up that it clicked.

Something to think about, because these things are not getting any younger.

 

[Anthony]

Growing up we had a '94 Explorer, it loves to eat pads. Eat as in rip the pad material off of the metal plate in chunks. Couldn't figure out what was doing it, dealer had never heard of it. Expensive/cheap pads, new caliper, slide pins, brake line... whatever, it kept doing it. It wasn't until a user on here (AllenD) pointed out that on the slide pin set up the caliper wears into the spindle and can allow the pad to cock in there and jam things up that it clicked.

Something to think about, because these things are not getting any younger.

Good Point!
I ran into a simaler problem with a 96 Jeep Cherokee. Replaced both spindles and everything was fine... But the Cherokee has bolt on calipers. The pads themselves wore notches where they sat and as they wore they would jam, and sometimes the brakes would work good, other times they would not and you had to press and release a few times before you got a pedal that felt right.

 

[4x4junkie]

How is the B2 cooling system?
on my 87 2.3L it was not equipped with AC so it had the dinky shroud that said "Not for Air Conditioning" on the top.
I swapped it out for a shroud from the junkyard from 2.3L AC equipped truck which made a complete circle around the fan where my original one did not.

I don't know how good the factory fan clutches were, but I kept getting them from the junkyard and I kept having over heating problems, but I also lived in Las Vegas at the time and it is 115 durring the day in summer.
The factory fan was 14" and plastic, but the hole in the shroud was much bigger, so I measured the hole, and did some math, and measured the lenth of the clutch.
I got a 16" flex fan and a 2.5" spacer and some long Stainless botls from the hardware store, and no more over heating problems.
I hear you get better mpg with a clutch fan though.
The bigger fan was about 1/4' from the hole in the shroud. I could not understand why they didn't use the larger diameter fan right from the factory, just in a plastic clutch fan form like the OEM one.

Go ahead and swap in the Explorer two-core radiator ('91-'94 Explorer w/auto trans & A/C radiator), it would be good to have if your summers are hot.

As for the fan setup itself, stock seems pretty decent (full shroud with (just guessing) about a 16" dia plastic blade fan). Having the heavy-duty clutch will spin the fan a bit faster when temps are higher though, which is better for running the A/C, especially if you get caught in traffic. If you really want to move some air through there, you could always go electric, though I've had no need to myself (even 4x4ing in low range barely moving at high altitude I've never had an issue). I'm running the two-core Ex radiator with a Hayden heavy-duty fan clutch & (I assume) the stock plastic fan (was in it when I bought it).

What was said about the calipers is true, though if you keep the slides greased, you can minimize a lot of the wear there (also if the pads are missing their anti-rattle clips, you can get a lot more wear inside the caliper like what you mentioned on the Jeep).

 

[Anthony]

If you really want to move some air through there, you could always go electric, though I've had no need to myself (even 4x4ing in low range barely moving at high altitude I've never had an issue)

I thought about getting the electric when I had my 87 Ranger, but I did not, because I looked at the specs and it moved less CFM's and in my mind means it doesn't cool as well. The flex fan moved the most CFM's that's why I went with it.
I live in South Jersey now, so our summers are not as hot out here.