Excluder seals going out AGAIN

[stinkijeans]

I posted this question on the RPS forums, so I thought I'd post it here as well:

.

This is the THIRD time the excluder seals have went bad in my Ranger. The last time Ford fixed them, they were suppose to be an 'upgraded' version of seals.

I don't know what the warranty is on these upgraded parts, but the last time they were replaced was a little over a year ago.
My truck is out of the regular warranty, but any part they replace comes with its own if I'm not mistaken. Maybe 1 year?

Even if it's out of the 'part' warranty... this is the THIRD friggin' time the SAME part has failed!

What can I do if Ford won't fix them? What's the next step?
This is a real common failure from what I've read. Is there a class-action going on anywhere?

And lastly,

Does anyone know which 'special' tools I'll need if I have to do this myself?
It looks like a fairly intense job.

Does anyone know if there are after market seals available? Ford's failed 3 times, so I'm ready to try something different.
If you try and search for 'excluder seals', you don't get any results. I've tried 'dust' seals, etc... and no luck. I've tried Napa, Autozone and Parts America.
These seals sit on the CV shaft, so you would think they would be easy to track down, but they aren't. Maybe they have a different name?

I got this number off the receipt form Ford when they replaced them the last time:

YL2Z3K070AA - Excluder (dust) seals Qty. 2

The manual also says NOT to re-use the spindle nuts as they are a one-time shot I guess. Anyone have the part number to the spindle nut?



Thanks,

H.

 

[4x4RangerGuy]

Where exactly are these seals located? I'm unfamiliar with the terminology. Are you referring to the axle seals on the knuckle?

 

[stinkijeans]

They are located on the halfshaft (CV Joint).
I haven't personally seen one apart (yet)... I'm going by what the manual says.

I've also seen it called "Front Halfshaft Excluder Seal"

It presses onto the outer race of the outboard CV joint.

H.

 

[Bent Bolt]

As you said, they are a dust seal. What is the nature of the failure ?? If they are noisy , a bit of die-electric grease goes along way to shutting them up.

 

[stinkijeans]

True.. grease will make the noise stop, but it's only temporary. I'm not even sure you can get to the seal without tearing the CV joint out. And if you're in that far, you might as well replace it.
This is the third failure. Obviously another Ford part blunder. Why does it fail? You tell me. I don't know.

Quite a few people are having this issue it seems.

Ford needs to fix their defective part(s). I can't wait until the dealer calls me back and say they won't cover it.


Here's the TBS on it:


Front Axle - Squealing/Whistling Noise
Article No.
01-11-4

06/11/01
^ NOISE - "SQUEALING" OR "WHISTLING" NOISE
FROM FRONT AXLE AREA - DRIVING AT SPEEDS
OF 16 - 64 KM/H (10-40 MPH) - 4X4 VEHICLES
ONLY - REVISED FRONT OUTER HALFSHAFT
DUST SEALS

^ FRONT AXLE - "SQUEALING" OR "WHISTLING"
NOISE FROM FRONT AXLE AREA - DRIVING AT
SPEEDS OF 16 - 64 KM/H (10 - 40 MPH) - 4X4
VEHICLES ONLY - REVISED FRONT OUTER
HALFSHAFT DUST SEALS

FORD:
1998-2001 EXPLORER
2000-2001 RANGER
2001 EXPLORER SPORT TRAC, EXPLORER SPORT

MERCURY:
1998-2001 MOUNTAINEER

This article is being republished in its entirety to update the model applications covered.

This TSB applies to 2001 Explorer Sport/Sport Trac 4X4 vehicles, 1998 - 2001 Explorer/Mountaineer 4X4 vehicles (all build dates), and 2000 - 2001 Ranger 4X4 vehicles built after 11/1/1999 only.

ISSUE

Some 4X4 vehicles may exhibit a high-pitched "squeal" or "whistle" type noise from the front of the vehicle at speeds from 16 to 64 km/h (10 to 40 mph). This noise may be caused by the front halfshaft excluder (dust) seals (-3K070-) as they rotate against the inner front hubs. The noise may be more pronounced in cold weather conditions.

ACTION

Install new front halfshaft excluder seals on each side of the vehicle. Refer to the following Service Procedure for details.

H.

 

[Bent Bolt]

I'm well aware of the TSB. I have not had problems replacing the seals and having the noise come back. Cleanliness is paramount in a successful repair on this issue.

 

[stinkijeans]

Well, like I said... the Ford dealer has replaced them twice. Now they are out again.

I take meticulous care of my truck and never abuse it. There's absolutely no reason for this to happen this many times. It's ridiculous.

H.

 

[stinkijeans]

Well, finally got an answer from the screwlearship today...

Just as I expected... Ford said screw you.
They aren't going to fix THEIR DEFECTIVE PARTS.

Time to take the gloves off and go higher up the food chain for what good it will do.

SJ

 

[stinkijeans]

Ok guys.. I need some clarification from someone who has actually replaced these seals...

First some brief history:

The last time the dealer replaced the excluder seals, they also replaced a 'retaining ring' according to my invoice. They are part # F8Z7-3B457-AA, qty. 2

Well, guess what... I didn't see any of these 'retaning rings' when I pulled the CV shaft out of the hub. The only thing that came out after I removed the hub installer was the giant axle nut.

Does anyone know if these retaining rings are even used on a 2001 Ranger 4x4?

I ordered these rings with the excluder seals as I assumed I needed them based on the last invoice from Ford. The instructions for the rings said to install them on a groove on the axle. It is instruction sheet # I.S. 7288A.

There is no groove in my axle as far as I can tell.


Sounds to me like someone at the dealer charged the warranty company for a part they never put on my truck. Or charged for them and never installed them.

Can someone confirm that a 2001 Ranger 4x4 does or does not use these rings?

Thanks,

SJ

 

[mhughes165]

it is a high probability that the stealership screwed you and the warranty company, several dealers out this way were caught doing "temp" fixes so they can get paid for warranty work multipole times, odds are they just gerased them up and sent u on your way

 

[Bent Bolt]

it is a high probability that the stealership screwed you and the warranty company, several dealers out this way were caught doing "temp" fixes so they can get paid for warranty work multipole times, odds are they just gerased them up and sent u on your way

Pretty amazing that you automaticly jump on the dealership when you don't even know what the F8Z7-3B457-AA part is. Even stinkjeans thinks the dealer didn't install them.

F8Z7-3B457-AA are the c-clips on the end of the stubshaft that holds the axle in the diff. According to the WSM ( work shop manual ) those clips are to changed everytime the axle comes out.

 

[stinkijeans]

Well, one of my local dealers and Ford in general is on my **it-list at the moment anyway for their defective seals. this is the third time they've failed.
I also wonder if all they did was toss in some grease and let them go.
My pinion seal also went out TWICE... supposedly. After I switched dealers, they appeared to fix everything... until now.

Bent Bolt is right... these clips are a plastic-type washer and have a steel-sorta ring on them.

I'm just going by what the last invoice said they installed.

I have a manual on CD as well as AllData... neither of them mention this retaining ring in a 2001. According to the manual, you're supposed to replace the retaining ring on the CV shaft if you remove it. I wonder if that's what the dealer replaced and billed the wrong part #?

Another thing I found too... the manual says I have to completely remove the CV joint to install the excluder seal. I don't think you have to.
I unbolted the upper ball joint, rotated the spindle and the seal comes right out.

So why does the manual want you to remove the entire CV shaft?


SJ

 

[Bent Bolt]

BEcause those excluder seals are installed on the CV joint and they are a pain in the ass to do properly. They are NOT supposed to spin on the CV joint.
Good luck.

 

[stinkijeans]

Here's the 'retaining ring' that I ordered that was supposedly used on my truck when Ford replaced the excluder seals:

As you've said.. the manual recommends replacing a retaining ring every time you pull the CV shaft... is this that ring?

I've removed other CV shafts before, and they've always had a metal C-clip.
That's why this whole mess confuses me.

SJ.

 

[stinkijeans]

Well, once again... the particular Ford dealer I spoke with yesterday was WRONG... just when I was starting to give them a little leniency.

That little orange 'retaining ring' is NOT used anywhere on my 2001 spindle/axle area.

I took Bent Bolt's advice and pulled the CV joint out. He was absolutely right... those seals are tricky to install correctly. You can't simply 'press them on by hand' as one of my manuals suggests. I ended up clamping the joint in a vice and tapping the seal very gently into place. A 2" PVC coupler and tubing fits almost perfectly and won't damage the seal.

Now my question is... can I re-install the axle without a new C-clip?
The guy at the dealership I spoke with said they don't typically replace those clips unless they are obviously torn up.
He just said that plastic clip was used on my 01... he was wrong about that, so I'm not sure what to believe.
I'd go get a new clip, but I live a long ways from town and I doubt anyone carries it.

I'm going to make a complete R&R post on this and hopefully I can get it 'stickied' in this forum so nobody else goes through the same trouble that I am.

SJ