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A little help for a total newbie...


Uncle Gump

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The wife was doing some Christmas shopping on Amazon yesterday and she shot down the front bumper that was on my list. So I need to get something I want on my list before I get things I don't want or need.

My goal is to add a CB to my truck but there are a lot of choices out there. I like the thought of having one that the controls are in the mic and the actual radio can be under the seat or dash. I was looking at this one...

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00005N5WW/ref=ox_sc_act_title_4?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1

Thoughts, waste of money, this one is better bang for your buck... any input would be appreciated.

The end goal is simply to have another form of communication in the event I get in a jamb with no cell phone signal (happens a lot in northern Michigan), trail communication with friends and traffic reports on road trips.

Also, I was reading some other threads on here yesterday and noted that a 4 foot antenna is really the minimal length. Would a five foot be better?
 


Ranger850

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I am far from an expert an cb antennae and the likes , but a good friend of mine is. He says actual antenna length does not matter but that the length of cable and antenna should be divisible by 3 foot. Because the CB radio waves are 3 ft from peak to valley. I'm sure some one with more knowledge can correct me if I'm wrong.
 

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I am far from an expert an cb antennae and the likes , but a good friend of mine is. He says actual antenna length does not matter but that the length of cable and antenna should be divisible by 3 foot. Because the CB radio waves are 3 ft from peak to valley. I'm sure some one with more knowledge can correct me if I'm wrong.
That's what I was always told too.

When buying an antenna you should also get one that is adjustable, and have a good SWR meter to set that with. My last CB setup I didn't read all the directions, just went nuts with it, and couldn't get the red rubber cap back off to fix my SWR settings, and ended up damaging the antenna in the process. I could receive just fine, but nobody could understand when I was transmitting.

Last thing, don't waste money on two antennas like the big rigs have. A co-phased setup like that creates a very long corridor ahead and behind the vehicle for broadcast and receiving, but it doesn't work if you can't get the antennas at least 8 feet apart, so a Ranger just isn't wide enough.
 

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I remember from my youth, my dad "peaking the antenna" with a meter and him not using "twin truckers" because they needed to be a certain distance apart.

I guess I assumed that CB antennas where all adjustable... and that is all I know about CB radios.

I think I better find a short but informative read on just the basics... just to give me a clue on the entire subject before I burden all of you with with basic questions. Anyone have a good read to recommend?
 

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Now to circle back to the actual question.

I don't have an first hand experience with that radio, but Cobra makes good units. My dad has some cobra radios that are over 40 years old now that still work. Just remember that you need some sort of air space around the radio as it can get hot.
 

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adsm08

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Read this:

http://www.firestik.com/Tech_Docs.htm


These guys are where I learned almost everything I know on the subject. The rest was learned by doing it wrong the first few times.
 

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Do people still really use CB frequencies? Last CB I had was over 20 years ago (good ole cobra 29 ltd) which worked great on offroad/camping trips but I now use VHF - Grms/murs because you can get much better range with a much smaller antenna. Communication is also usually much clearer. If your getting a radio just to listen to truckers and satisfy your inner bandit, then go CB. If you want a radio for communication with other people within a known group there are much better options these days. My unit in my truck is multi band VHF, GRMS, FRS and MURS. When I go camping I can toss everyone in my group handheld GRMS 2 ways to talk with my truck somewhat of a base, also my buddy has a similar radio so we can chat truck to truck on any available frequency. The other BIG advantage is that repeaters are legal and fairly common on GRMS & MURS which means if you find one in your area you can boost signal strength by many many miles. I live on the coast so the marine VHF frequencies come in handy alot as well. Obviously not a big selling point if you live in Montana. But at that point those are just more open channels!
 

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Do people still really use CB frequencies? Last CB I had was over 20 years ago (good ole cobra 29 ltd) which worked great on offroad/camping trips but I now use VHF - Grms/murs because you can get much better range with a much smaller antenna. Communication is also usually much clearer. If your getting a radio just to listen to truckers and satisfy your inner bandit, then go CB. If you want a radio for communication with other people within a known group there are much better options these days. My unit in my truck is multi band VHF, GRMS, FRS and MURS. When I go camping I can toss everyone in my group handheld GRMS 2 ways to talk with my truck somewhat of a base, also my buddy has a similar radio so we can chat truck to truck on any available frequency. The other BIG advantage is that repeaters are legal and fairly common on GRMS & MURS which means if you find one in your area you can boost signal strength by many many miles. I live on the coast so the marine VHF frequencies come in handy alot as well. Obviously not a big selling point if you live in Montana. But at that point those are just more open channels!
I don't use it as much as I used to. I used to use them to listen in on the truckers, especially in bad weather, in college because I was often running 2 hours each way up and down US-15, and at one point my route went through the foothills of the Appalachian range. It was not fun coming up to the hills where it was maybe a little drizzle, or even clear, and then crest it and drop into the upper Susquehanna valley near Williamsport to a surprise snow and ice storm that had the clouds below the peak of the mountain. That happens often right there and it is not a nice surprise.


I keep the stuff around right now because everyone I know already has it, and going out to my dad's hunting camp almost half the trip (by time, not distance) is through areas where cell coverage is still spotty at best.
 

Uncle Gump

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Well... I'm wired up with coffee and on CB info overload...

The first link that ranger850 posted calls out the very radio I questioned. I put that radio in the wish list before the wife ends up buying me something else.

adsm08's link put me on overload... lots of information. I think the biggest consideration I need to make is where I'm gonna mount the antenna. Center of the roof is what is optimal... I'm just not sure that will work for me with a canoe on the top when I'm road tripping to my fishing spots. I also think at this point the right coax, mount and antenna are probably more important then the radio I choose. However, I gained this information from an antenna company. I do believe there is a lot of truth in their statements.

dirtman... I get your point that there are better options for distance, frequencies, etc... The problem for me is I don't have a sack full of handhelds to pass out and blowing down the highway I don't have a "known group" I'm traveling with.
 

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I would strongly suggest don't buy a Cobra 75 WX, WSTX, whatever it is (or any variant thereof). They seem to have the poorest sounding microphones I've ever come across. And unlike most hard-mount radios, you cannot swap the mic out for a better (aftermarket) one either (not without doing major microsurgery on the unit anyway). Our group almost always endures the muffled sound of at least one of those units by a person who unwittingly bought one when we're out with a large (or new) group. Some comments go along the lines of: As bad as two soup cans with a string, but with socks stuffed into the cans. Occasionally it is that bad, they can be completely garbled, depending on the person's voice characteristics.
Cobra once made very good units, but except for a few of their "legacy" units (the 29-LTD and 148-GTL for example), they're junk nowadays (and even the legacy units are not as good as they once were).

If an all-in-the-hand-mic type unit is what you're after, get the Midland 75-822. It is a MUCH better sounding unit, and to top that off, you have the freedom to use it as an actual hand-held radio too (though not very effectively due to the extremely short antenna, but it'll still work fine for spotting another driver thru a trail obstacle).

Of course even the Midland falls far short of the good clean sound you'd have with a Uniden PRO-520XL ( a small under-dash unit). And the Uniden is FAR cheaper to boot.

I am far from an expert an cb antennae and the likes , but a good friend of mine is. He says actual antenna length does not matter but that the length of cable and antenna should be divisible by 3 foot. Because the CB radio waves are 3 ft from peak to valley. I'm sure some one with more knowledge can correct me if I'm wrong.
Yeah your friend is completely wrong (first time I've heard something about a 'divisible by 3-foot' thing :icon_confused: Usually people tout 18 feet, which is also wrong for many reasons).
Length of the antenna itself matters immensely, not just for CB, but for any radio, transmitter or even just a receiver. A very short antenna (less than 1/8 wavelength, or about 4' for CB) has a very small (or steep, in layman terms) radiation resistance (a tiny fraction of the 50-ohm system impedance) and it only gets steeper the shorter you go. This causes most of your transmitted energy to be dissipated as heat (resistive losses) in the antenna's load coil (basically it works more like a dummy-load than an antenna).

Best length for a (vehicle-mounted) CB antenna is between 102-108". This represents approx ¼ of the 11-meter wavelength of the CB band and provides about a 40-50 ohm input impedance, which matches well with the 50 ohm output impedance of the radio unit.
However I also know some people don't like antennas that tall on their vehicle, so shorter-length antennas are commonplace. However, know that if you go too short, you come to a point where performance starts to drop off extremely fast (falling off the "knee" if you were to graph it), which is generally right about 54-60" for CB antennas.
IMO, a 60" antenna is a good compromise for those who don't want a full 102" tall one. Field tests I've done showed about a 2-3 dB difference between antennas 60-66" tall, and a 102" tall antenna, which in most cases is difficult to discern. Testing 36" and shorter antennas however showed large drops in both transmitted and received signal strength, even though the SWR was good.

Length of the antenna cable is irrelevant when your SWR (match) is good. If changing the cable length affects your setup significantly, then it's because you have a bad SWR (mismatch) and/or a poor ground somewhere. The only thing important in regard to cable length is that you have the shortest length practical, as this will minimize the losses in a longer-than-necessary length of cable.

The Firestik link posted earlier is mostly good, but even there, I still found plenty of mistakes.


I have the 5½' tall Francis CB-26 Hot-Rod antenna mounted on a triple-magnet mount similar to this one on mine. A spring keeps the antenna from getting damaged or knocked over by low trees and/or drive-though overhangs.




Regarding comments earlier about MURS, GMRS, etc., I do have to agree, the 27 MHz segment of CB radio, due to having had no significant regulatory updates in decades, has become quite antiquated since each of those other services generally uses FM where squelch circuits work far more effectively to block noise & static from busting through the speaker while driving through towns or other populated areas. Of MURS, GMRS, FRS, and HAM, I think MURS is by far the most versatile, although for whatever reason it has not gained much popularity, probably partly because there are no commercially-made mobile (hard-mount) radios available, you have to repurpose a hand-held if you want a mobile unit in your vehicle, or modify a ham radio or some other unit to work there. There are some hard-mount GMRS units that have hit the market recently that look promising, though to do it correctly you have to purchase a license (authorization) from the FCC to use a GMRS unit legally (though few do).
 

Uncle Gump

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Mr 4x4junkie... That was the one post I was hoping for about 10 days ago... I do appreciate the real life experience you took the time to put out there.

I'm certain the ship has already sailed and that very cobra unit is here awaiting my "surprise" Christmas morning. Not to late to correct that choice at this point in time. I'm going to take at better look at your suggestions. Just trying to give myself the best shot at this installation being successful.

I do know with the reading I did do... I had put a 60" firestick in the wish list. Not because 60" was deemed optimal length.. but more of a figure I read concerning 60% of the antenna mast being above the highest part of the vehicle. Thinking I was going to make a bracket off the bed rail... leaving the 60% over the top of my cab high Leer cap.

I'm still under the impression that a CB radio has a place even with the better radio options available... and at least touches a portion of the objectives I'm looking to accomplish.
 

Will

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There is not much on the CB these days except on the interstate--I spend my day around I-65 as it bisects my town so there is trucker chatter all day. The truckers use them, though they have potty mouths these days. I have one mounted, plus a handheld for someone outside of the truck to talk to you on when winching, spotting or they are following you while you tow something stupid. Plus the kids use the handheld and run around the area talking to the ones in the truck.

My radio is a Uniden 980 with SSB (single side band). The single side band is used by hobby people to talk all over the country--mostly at night when the radio waves will skip off the atmosphere. The 11-meter CB band is pretty close to what you would call Shortwave, and does a good job of ricocheting around the atmosphere instead of just punching up and out like higher frequency waves do. It's not an organized thing, though. SSB CB has been around since the 23 channel vacuum tube days, but it isn't used that much. There are guys out there doing it, though.

So I suggest getting a CB with SSB and giving yourself another thing to use the radio for.

I have a 3' Firestick (tuneable tip) drilled right through the center of the roof on a spring mount. Works great. For picking up skipped waves, you can make a dipole and string it between 2 trees about 10' in the air and pick up people all over the country. It's amusing to listen to, but I don't participate in the conversations. Maybe TRS can start an SSB across the USA project like the banner.
 

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