SuperRunner Idler Arm Beefage

[legoms013]

So a while back I made a new idler arm to replace the Superlift one. The goal was to make something stronger and that could accept the LARGER and more COMMON Chevy leaf spring bushings (Like RuffStuff sells). Well I accomplished that just fine.

Now the dilemma is that the bushing wear out pretty quick due to all the forces involved with my setup AND that the idler arm rocks back and forth as I steer from left to right or right to left. It is noticeable in that it feels like there is something loose in the steering (and effectively there is).

If you need a way to visulaize this I will post a link to a youtube video showing what is going on here.

The wobble I describe is partly due to the larger torque arm now induced since modify my SuperRunner kit (dropped it down 2.5"). It mainly exists because of the loose tolerances between: the inner bushing steel sleeve, the 9/16" bolt inside the bushing sleeve, and the flex of the bushing itself.

Long story short, point to be taken away from this is: How do I eliminate the wobble of the idler arm?

My first two ideas were:

1) Make the upper bushing like 3" wide (as opposed to the 1.5" that it is now), which would spread the bushing halves way apart, and distribute the load better. This I view as the cheaper route, and more "ghetto-fab" and may not completely fix my problem.

2) Cut off the bushing all together, and run some kind of needle bearing or tapered roller bearing setups on tight tolerance shaft (much like a spindle and wheel bearing setup). This I see as being the more expensive route, but would work the best. Also, not sure where to get said parts?

What are some other ideas/methods that anyone else has? Keep in mind it is ONLY the upper bushing on the idler arm where it attaches to the crossmember that needs beefing not the one on the centerlink.

Here are some pics:

 

[jovibuilt]

I replaced both bushings in mine with delron or UHMW one I dont remember which.I used a lathe to make them same as the super lift ones.And used the super lift steel inserts.It works great and really tightened up my steering.

 

[4x4junkie]

Going to larger bushings I suspect was counterproductive. Bigger bushings will have more give or flex than smaller ones having the same I.D. would (combined with the fact urethane has some compressive memory as well, this would only cause it to become looser quicker).

However there's nothing at all wrong with the idea of widening the bushing spacing IMO, you are effectively reducing the leverage against the bushings by having them spaced wider.

Harder bushings like mentioned can work too. I'm not sure if needle bearings might be more work that it's worth though, trying to keep dirt & water, etc. sealed out of them.

 

[legoms013]

Going to larger bushings I suspect was counterproductive. Bigger bushings will have more give or flex than smaller ones having the same I.D. would (combined with the fact urethane has some compressive memory as well, this would only cause it to become looser quicker).

However there's nothing at all wrong with the idea of widening the bushing spacing IMO, you are effectively reducing the leverage against the bushings by having them spaced wider.

Harder bushings like mentioned can work too. I'm not sure if needle bearings might be more work that it's worth though, trying to keep dirt & water, etc. sealed out of them.

Correct, the only thing I really gained by switching to the polyurethane Chevy bushings was that they are larger, and much cheaper than what Superlift want's to charge me for a replacement set of their proprietary sized idler arm bushings ($4 vs $60+S&H).

So my three options at this point that I see as viable are:

1) Delrin or UMHW bushings
2) Widening the bushing sleeve

Question is, where can I get Delrin/UMHW bushings?

If I can find a place that will make me some, or I can buy them already made, I will try a stiffer bushing first.

And if that doesn't alleviate my problem, looks like I am going to have to make a new bracket that accepts a wider bushing sleeve, and thus make another idler arm too.

 

[aspevacek]

With the pictures you had sent me in the PM. I am doing the bushing method. Based on what I see here I may to do a little rethinking yet again on the steering I am building. I went with Poly bushings for now, but may have to looking into something like a thick Brass bushing machined to fit in the hole. As I start the build I will do a write up of what I used and what all was involved. I am currently waiting my mothers cousin to finish the had of all my 1/4 inch plate parts. I will be using Heim joints for the rod ends and DOM tubing for everything.

Once again thx for the close up shots of how the idler arm mounts it really helped me along of ideas of how to mount it. I was over thinking the whole thing and trying to tie it to the crossmember and the frame.

 

[4x4junkie]

Correct, the only thing I really gained by switching to the polyurethane Chevy bushings was that they are larger, and much cheaper than what Superlift want's to charge me for a replacement set of their proprietary sized idler arm bushings ($4 vs $60+S&H).

I bought a rear spring bushing set for my Ranger awhile back... It had 3 different sized bushings, all with the same I.D. (IIRC, they were 1.5", 1.25" and 1" O.D.). I don't know if the smaller ones are available separate or not, but if so, I'd try to find something like those if it comes down to making an arm with a longer tube for the bushings.

 

[legoms013]

I bought a rear spring bushing set for my Ranger awhile back... It had 3 different sized bushings, all with the same I.D. (IIRC, they were 1.5", 1.25" and 1" O.D.). I don't know if the smaller ones are available separate or not, but if so, I'd try to find something like those if it comes down to making an arm with a longer tube for the bushings.

Like an Energy Suspension brand leaf spring bushing kit?

I think I will have some Delrin bushings made first. And if that doesn't get rid of most of the excess movement (I have a hunch it will) then I will also modify the bracket as well, extending/widening the tube and adding some gussets.

 

[legoms013]

I got a quote for delrin bushings...$80 per bushing half. Screw that.

Not gonna go that route b/c of the cost and b/c I don't think it will fix my problem anyway.

I need to find a solution to the loose tolerances between the bushing sleeve and the bolt itself. Something like widening the tube won't address.

I am out of ideas short of researching small roller bearings and a lathed spindle shaft of some sort.

I need something like Total Chaos' aftermarket Toyota idler arm.

 

[4x4junkie]

I need to find a solution to the loose tolerances between the bushing sleeve and the bolt itself. Something like widening the tube won't address.

That small bit of clearance between the bolt & sleeve shouldn't matter, the sleeve should not move when the bolt is tightened (clamping the sleeve within the bracket).

Oh, and yes, it was an Energy Suspension leaf bushing kit I have.

 

[legoms013]

Doesn't matter how tight I crank down on the bolt and nut, the idler arm still walks back and forth on the bolt.

Does the same thing with the Superlift idler arm as well.



I'll put a longer cheater bar on it this weekend and try tightening it again but I fear no improvement...

 

[CHKNFKR]

If you end up going the spindle/hub route, head to your local rural king, big r, farm supply, whatever you have in your area and take a look at trailer spindles and hubs, those things are infinitely useful!

 

[4x4junkie]

Doesn't matter how tight I crank down on the bolt and nut, the idler arm still walks back and forth on the bolt.

Does the same thing with the Superlift idler arm as well.



I'll put a longer cheater bar on it this weekend and try tightening it again but I fear no improvement...

Sounds like the sleeve may be too short then (the sleeve should fit to within 1mm or so inside the bracket).

 

[legoms013]

Sounds like the sleeve may be too short then (the sleeve should fit to within 1mm or so inside the bracket).

I was wondering. I'll check it out this weekend.

What you said before makes sense though, if the sleeve is sandwiched in the bracket correctly it wouldn't be able to move (which is where I am getting movement). Maybe it is too short and not sandwiching correctly...